Mosque to be Built Near Ground Zero

@BillRM,

You said 'wait for the riots in australia' and implied this 'incident' had just happened. That's before we even consider how irrelevant this is to the thread even if it was true. Liar.

Now you obfuscate with stuff from Pakistan. Is Manhattan in Pakistan?

You are a hater. And sad. And small.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

My position on your argument that the Shah was great compared to what came after is that the Shah was a terrible dictator who abused his people and your defense of him is not logical or understandable. Comparing him to the current regime is completely illogical, like saying Hitler wasn't all that bad for Germany because Stalin was worse.

My position on the lower Manhattan community center and your use of other countries' government systems as justifying denying its construction is that the actions of other governments with respect to their people do not excuse intolerance or discrimination in the United States when dealing with its citizens. If you want to discuss the merits of building a community center in lower Manhattan, great, but saying foreign governments mistreat their citizens, so we can and should do the same is a silly argument.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Quote:

Nothing. At all. Are you just looking for some sort of justification for your anti-Muslim bigotry?

I am a bigot toward any group where millions are threatening to harm Americans for the actions of twenty-five nuts in northern Florida.

Or, for the sin of others Americans trying to block a Mosque in one location in NYC.

Or, any group where hit contracts are put out on a writer life by a nation state in the name of that religion and US bookstores fear carrying the book because of those threats.

Where a high profile Muslin American get on the airwaves and informed all of us that he consider it his religion duty to kill that writer if he had the chance. Amusing side note to this day he is on the no fly list at least as a result of that statement.

Yes, I am bigot when I read about women getting a hundred lashes for not covering up completely or having coffee in a public place with a male friend under cover of religion laws.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Quote:

Nothing. At all. Are you just looking for some sort of justification for your anti-Muslim bigotry?

You only need to google the news to find such justifications no need to go looking for them<grin>.

I am a bigot indeed toward any group where millions are threatening to harm Americans for the actions of twenty-five nuts in northern Florida.

Or, for the sin of others Americans trying to block a Mosque in one location in NYC.

Or, any group where hit contracts are put out on a writer life by a nation state in the name of that religion and US bookstores fear carrying the book because of those threats.

Where a high profile Muslin American got on the airwaves and informed all of us that he consider it his religion duty to kill that writer if he had the chance. Amusing side note to this day he is on the no fly list at least as a result of that statement.

Yes, I am bigot when I read about women getting a hundred lashes for not covering up completely or having coffee in a public place with a male friend under cover of religion laws.

Or other women being stone to death or waiting to be stone to death.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

Why are you talking about Pakistan?> This is about the USA, and "our" laws. We can't control what other countries do with their laws. Are you emotionally attached to Pakistan too!

Hmm the branching was the subject of how peaceful Muslims happen to be as a group.

And the claims of our friend Firefly that others major religion groups would react with violent and threats of violent in a similar manner due to book burnings and such.

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@hingehead,

Quote:

You said 'wait for the riots in australia' and implied this 'incident' had just happened. That's before we even consider how irrelevant this is to the thread even if it was true. Liar.

Now you obfuscate with stuff from Pakistan. Is Manhattan in Pakistan?

You are a hater. And sad. And small.

The people threating to kill American troops because of the Mosque and books burnings are living in the middle east including Pakistan not NYC or Florida.

The dates of religion riots have some bearing on the subject? Something had change over the last ten years or so for the better in the thousand years olds
Muslim religion?

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@engineer,

Quote:

My position on your argument that the Shah was great compared to what came after is that the Shah was a terrible dictator who abused his people and your defense of him is not logical or understandable. Comparing him to the current regime is completely illogical, like saying Hitler wasn't all that bad for Germany because Stalin was worse.

So you do not think it is now our moral duty to kill those religion nuts and put in place a freely elected government because it in the end it is all our fault?

Second if I was a woman in Iran who wish a better life for my female children I would be praying in the Mosque everyday for such an evil man as the Shah to be place in power in Iran.

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@BillRM,

Your brains are mush. You paint every member of a group as being as bad as its worst elements. That is bigotry of the highest order. Instead of dialogue you preach mindless hate. You are a fool.

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@hingehead,

Quote:

Your brains are mush. You paint every member of a group as being as bad as its worst elements.

When they had clean up their act to the point where whole major nation states are no longer acting like 15 century religion barbarians you might have a point.

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Jon Stewart rocks
http://t.co/N5qU3V8

BillRM clearly sucks from the foxnews teet.

SQUIRREL!

1 Reply

@hingehead,

Quote:

BillRM clearly sucks from the foxnews teet.

As a Democrat, I do not care for that news channel all that must.

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

So you do not think it is now our moral duty to kill those religion nuts and put in place a freely elected government because it in the end it is all our fault?

Second if I was a woman in Iran who wish a better life for my female children I would be praying in the Mosque everyday for such an evil man as the Shah to be place in power in Iran.

If you actually knew anything about Iran, you would not since women in Iranian mosques old enough to have experienced the Shah have personal experience of people who disappeared under his reign. As for invading and putting in place a freely elected government, how is that working in Iraq? And Iraq had a secular government (with some religious trappings) before the US invasion. For small, relatively weak countries, only the harshest of dictatorships or theocracies can withstand powerful country interference. These forms of government can demand that their citizens endure any type of hardship for either the beloved leader or God so that all means of pressure against them fail. You can destroy the country but you cannot install your favorite style of government. That should be obvious by now. Any action the US takes against Iran makes their government stronger, not weaker. Every time the US intervenes in a country, those people ask "who can protect us from the US?" Typically that answer is the religious establishment. In Iran, we have stopped digging the hole and that is clearly the right strategy. Walk troops in there and every hand will be turned against you, even those women in the Mosques praying for liberation from the Shah.

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@djjd62,

Quote:

so slum lord bad, corporate book cooker good, interesting moral choices you make

WTF are you talking about?? There is no corporate book cooker here. Are you talking about Mark Hurd? I hate guys like him, they are scum, but they are doing the work that investors want them to do, they are following orders when they drive profits on the backs of the working man. He did not cook the books though, so far as we know all he did was have some expense reports where not all the T's were crossed and the I's dotted. The board did not have cause to fire him based upon what we know, and if they did they should not have given him a $40+ million exit package. They were wrong either way. The point of the thread was not how great Hurd is, or that he was right, or that he is great....it was that the HP board sucks. I am firmly in the majority camp on that one I think. I am on the majority here on the Mosque issue as well. I am sure this sucks for people who need to believe that I am always on the side of the lunatic fringe, but o'well.

1 Reply

@engineer,

Quote:

As for invading and putting in place a freely elected government, how is that working in Iraq? And Iraq had a secular government (with some religious trappings) before the US invasion. For small, relatively weak countries, only the harshest of dictatorships or theocracies can withstand powerful country interference. These forms of government can demand that their citizens endure any type of hardship for either the beloved leader or God so that all means of pressure against them fail.

Sorry knocking out the current government and placing our own in is more then doable and might in the future prove to be needed without the need to do great harm to the country as a whole.

No amount of religion motivations is going to do a bit of good against our technology and the religion leadership that we do not place a smart bomb up their rear ends will once more be in exile in France.

Hell after what happen after one president told Sadam and his sons to leave in 48 hours from Iraq I would not be surprise if those brave religion leaders was running to the airport to get on planes for France far ahead of our invasion.

Knocking out the current government and placing our own in is more then doable and might in the future prove to be needed.

No amount of religion motivations is going to do a bit of good against our technology and the religion leadership that we do not place a smart bomb up their rear ends will once more be in exile in France.

Oh?, the Iraq people was all against us when we walk in?

Footnote as a matter of fact Iraq is working out just fine and we had become a somewhat spoil people when it come to losing any of our troops given the task the cost had not been all that great. Far less then the taking of one major island in the South Pacific during WW2 for example.

In fact increasing the arm forces manpower at this time of high unemployment and spending more money on technology might just be what our country need now to get the country humming away as WW2 did for us in ending the great depression.

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@hawkeye10,

Your being in the "majority camp" on Hurd's unethical behavior just proves how unethical most Americans are today. That sucks more than anything in my books.

As a once upon a time auditor during my work years, I would have reported such unethical behavior to my boss.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

Your being in the "majority camp" on Hurd's unethical behavior just proves how unethical most Americans are today. That sucks more than anything in my books.

HP's board has in recent history lacked both competence and ethics, and I dont think that they look any better after firing Hurd than they looked before. In any case it has nothing to do with either my ethics or the Ground Zero Mosque issue. You boys have a hard time sticking to the subject I see.

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Quote:

"If we judge another religion by the worst of their people and we judge ours by the best, where does that put us?" - Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf

A
Relevance self-evident
T

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@failures art,

Quote:

"If we judge another religion by the worst of their people and we judge ours by the best, where does that put us?" - Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf

Other faiths worst members are doing such as running churches with 25 members or so or maybe running a TV religion network here and there however the Muslin faith had their worst running whole nations.

1 Reply

@failures art,

Quote:

Relevance self-evident

This is a guy who just a few days ago felt the need to clarify whether he supports Hamas or not. How often do you hear him speak against those in Islam who preach hate against the West? This guy can spin a good story, you gotta give him that, but on closer inspection it is mostly BS.

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@hawkeye10,

You're a guy that demands him to make such clarifications. Now you want to hold that against him? You're constantly questioning his motives, how dare he answer!

A
R
T

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Mosque to be Built Near Ground Zero

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