46
   

Mosque to be Built Near Ground Zero

 
 
BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 10:42 am
@firefly,
Quote:
WASHINGTON, DC - As the commander of troops in Afghanistan, General David Petraeus, is warning against anti-Islam displays in the United States, the largest progressive veterans group in America, VoteVets.org is releasing an open letter of support for the Park51 Community Center, in Lower Manhattan.


You mean the peace loving Muslin world will begin killing Americans at random to a great degree then is happening now if we block this Mosque?

Firefly peace loving and killing over a Mosque location in the US?

Is there something wrong here in your and others claims?
BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 10:45 am
@firefly,
Quote:
That seems to have begun after General David Petraeus delivered his remarks last week--the media coverage began to shift and to focus more on support for the project, and the 9/11 opposition rally near the WTC really was paltry, nothing anywhere near what Geller had hoped for, and she had hyped that events for months


Nothing like death threats directed at our troops to change public opinion toward the Muslim world that for sure.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  5  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 10:55 am
@BillRM,
14,000 veterans support the building of the community center/mosque--including veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan. Those are the people who have put their lives on the line, in the Muslim world, in support of our country and our Constitutional freedoms. When they speak out, people should pay attention.

I am not making "a claim". If you think you understand the situation better than General David Petraeus, that just proves what an ignorant jerk you are.

The spreading of anti-Muslim propoganda, by groups like Stop Islamization Of America, and trying to interfere with peaceful Muslim Americans' freedom of worship, does give Al Qaeda a recruiting tool, and it does contribute to increased danger for our troops. If I have to believe someone on this score, I'll listen to General David Petraeus, and not to you, BillRM.
Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:06 am
@firefly,
Quote:
Including 450 Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans


Or, 0.028124999999999997%

panzade
 
  1  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:16 am
@Irishk,
"new math"?
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  5  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:18 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Love it our good friend the Shah who we placed in power along with the British gave women far more respect and freedom then the religion dictatorship that replaced him and no women was stone to death either unlike now.

You've got this backwards. Yes, the regime that came in after the Shah is repressive, but the US didn't have anything to do with that. The regime that the US overthrew was the one before the Shah. That one was secular and democratically elected. The US replaced a democratic government with a harsh dictatorship, setting up a situation where a religious figure could symbolize the resistance and come to power.
BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:22 am
@firefly,
Quote:
and it does contribute to increased danger for our troops. If I have to believe someone on this score, I'll listen to General David Petraeus, and not to you, BillRM.


Yes, but you and others are claiming we got the Poor Muslins all wrong that they are a peace loving people and any one who question that is a bigot.

Then on the other side of your mouth you are supporting the idea of the good General that if we do not all roll over and stop complaining about the location of this Mosque our troops will be attack and kill by peace loving Muslims.

Kind of an interesting mind that can hold two 180 degrees concepts at the same time.

Odd is it not that I could burn bibles all day long either the King James or Orange Bible or the Jewish Torah or the Mormon Bible and there would be no riots and no killing of our troops.

I could raised all kind of hell about a location of a Jewish Temple or a Mormon temple or a Christian Church and there would be no violent backlash because of it.

However for some strange reason when dealing with the peaceful Muslims that does not seem to be the case.

So Firefly once more they are a peaceful people but they will kill us if we do not stop interfering with this Mosque correct?
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:23 am
@engineer,
engineer wrote:

BillRM wrote:

Love it our good friend the Shah who we placed in power along with the British gave women far more respect and freedom then the religion dictatorship that replaced him and no women was stone to death either unlike now.

You've got this backwards. Yes, the regime that came in after the Shah is repressive, but the US didn't have anything to do with that. The regime that the US overthrew was the one before the Shah. That one was secular and democratically elected. The US replaced a democratic government with a harsh dictatorship, setting up a situation where a religious figure could symbolize the resistance and come to power.


Absolutely correct - and this was in large part due to the Socialist leanings of the previous government, which the CIA was extremely paranoid about spreading, IIRC.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:24 am
I think the real point is that the media has been ignoring a lot of support for the community center/mosque--including support from groups like this verteran's organization.

I also think that more supporters are becoming more vocal, and visible to the media, as a backlash to the anti-Muslim sentiment fueling opposition to the community center project. That was evident on both Sept 10th and 11th in support rallies held near the WTC. I think overt support for the project will continue to grow.

BillRM, if you were a Muslim American and announced you were publicly burning as many copies of the New Testament as you could get your hands on, as an act of contempt for Christianity, you don't think you would provoke violence--from Christian Americans? Of course you would. Christians are not different than Muslims.

You do realize we are discussing building a community center/mosque in NYC, don't you? You seem rather disconnected from the topic.

BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:31 am
@engineer,
Sorry I said nothing about what was there was before the Shah in Iran.

So I have nothing backward and women under the Shah was treated as full human beings and was not stone to death or given a 100 lashes for being with a male in a public place as is happening now under the now existing Religion dictatorship.
Cycloptichorn
 
  4  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:35 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Sorry I said nothing about what was there was before the Shah in Iran.

So I have nothing backward and women under the Shah was treated as full human beings and was not stone to death or given a 100 lashes for being with a male in a public place as is happening now under the now existing Religion dictatorship.


What you have backward is the fact that WE put that 'religious dictatorship' in place, to REPLACE the Shah.

Cycloptichorn
OmSigDAVID
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:36 am
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
I think the real point is that the media has been ignoring a lot of support for the community center/mosque--including support from groups like this verteran's organization.

I also think that more supporters are becoming more vocal, and visible to the media, as a backlash to the anti-Muslim sentiment fueling opposition to the community center project. That was evident on both Sept 10th and 11th in support rallies held near the WTC. I think overt support for the project will continue to grow.

BillRM, if you were a Muslim American and announced you were publicly burning as many copies of the New Testament as you could get your hands on, as an act of contempt for Christianity, you don't think you would provoke violence--from Christians? Of course you would. Christians are not different than Muslims.


That 's a foolish thing to say.
I come from a Christian background.
If anyone were burning Bibles, as u say,
it woud not even get a yawn out of me (let alone "violence" as u put it).

If that happens tomorrow, I will only think that the arsonist
only wasted his money in buying them.
To MY mind, it woud be not even a triviality.





David
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:38 am
@firefly,
Quote:
you don't think you would provoke violence--from Christians? Of course you would. Christians are not different than Muslims.


Sorry people had done it before and had even place Jesus on his cross upside down in a bottle of human urine in an art show in New York City and I do not remember hearing about riots and killing perhaps you could point me to a link where that had happen.

People had yell and jump up and down about the locations of other religion buildings and I do not remember ever hearing about killings and riots as a result perhaps you could give us all a link to such an event.
BillRM
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:39 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Quote:
What you have backward is the fact that WE put that 'religious dictatorship' in place, to REPLACE the Shah.


WRONG
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:41 am
@Cycloptichorn,
BillRM wrote:

Sorry I said nothing about what was there was before the Shah in Iran.

So I have nothing backward and women under the Shah was treated as full human beings and was not stone to death or given a 100 lashes for being with a male in a public place as is happening now under the now existing Religion dictatorship.
Cycloptichorn wrote:


What you have backward is the fact that WE put that 'religious dictatorship' in place, to REPLACE the Shah.

Cycloptichorn
Yeah; "WE" = JIMMY CARTER.
Democrats = bad luck.

In addition to stabbing our friends in the back,
he also gave away the Panama Canal.





David
BillRM
 
  -3  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:44 am
@firefly,
Get ready for the riots

NC Church Plans Halloween Bible-Burning
Comments 60
October 14, 2009 3:31 PM
Dan Lehr
A North Carolina pastor says his church plans to burn Bibles and books by Christian authors on Halloween to light a fire under true believers.
Pastor Marc Grizzard told Asheville TV station WLOS that the King James version of the Bible is the only one his small western North Carolina church follows. He says all other versions, such as the Living Bible, are "satanic" and "perversions" of God's word.
On Halloween night, Grizzard and the 14 members of the Amazing Grace Baptist Church also will burn music and books by Christian authors, such as Billy Graham and Rick Warren.
Telephone calls to the Amazing Grace Baptist Church and Grizzard's home were not immediately returned Wednesday.


0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  4  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:46 am
@BillRM,
The topic is about building a community center/mosque in lower Manhattan.

I'm not interested in your various, and irrelevant, comments about everything else under the sun.

Because no one in the Rape thread will respond to you anymore, you came over here to seek attention, and derail another thread. I'm not interested in helping you do that. You have nothing intelligent to say on this topic.

That Halloween story is old news...and unrelated to building a community center in NYC.
BillRM
 
  -3  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:49 am
@firefly,
Give ready for the killing and the riots in Austral............

Australian Muslims Urinate,Spit,and Burn Bible
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Showing posts 1 - 7 of7 Saleem
Aurora, Canada
Reply »
|Report Abuse |Judge it! |#1 Wednesday Aug 25

Australia : Muslim Students Urinate, Spit On Then Burn Bible
Uh oh, does this mean the worlds 2 billion Christians are gonna start rioting in the streets and calling for the blood of Muslims to be spilled? Hmmm probably not, but I'm sure the MSM will report this at and make it front page headlines for a month just like the Koran desecrations :

TWO Muslim students have been expelled from an Islamic school in Melbourne for urinating and spitting on a Bible and setting it on fire.

The explosive incident has forced the East Preston Islamic College to call in a senior imam to tell its 650 Muslim students that the Bible and Christianity must be respected.

Anxious teachers at the school have also petitioned principal Shaheem Doutie, expressing "grave concern" about an "inculcation of hatred and radical attitudes towards non-Muslims" at the school, including towards non-Muslim teachers.

The Bible desecration took place last week at a school camp held near Bacchus Marsh, about 50km west of Melbourne, attended by 33 teenage Muslim boys ranging in age from Year7 to Year 10.

A school report of the incident, obtained by The Australian, says it happened late at night and involved three students and another two watching.

"The main perpetrator (a Year 7 student) urinated on the Holy Bible, tore some pages from the Holy Book and burnt them then finally spat on the Holy Book," the report says.

The second boy, from Year 9, "tore pages from the Holy Book and burnt them", while a third student, from Year 7, "tore pages from the Holy Bible and then he rolled it up like a cigarette and pretended to smoke it".

The boys come from a variety of ethnic Muslim backgrounds -- one is believed to be an Albanian/Malaysian, another Lebanese and another Indonesian.

Mr Doutie, whose school receives about $3.9 million in state and federal government funding each year, told The Australian yesterday that both he and the school community were appalled.






Neanderthal75

Since: Jul 10

344

United States

Please wait... Reply »
|Report Abuse |Judge it! |#2 Wednesday Aug 25
This is nothing new in Islam: it is not a 'religion of peace' as many professional (and wholly ignorant) politicians, Social Progressives (Lefties in an Oz frame of reference), and anti-Westerners would have us believe.

A Saudi member of the Mutaween burned his own daughter to death for converting to Islam:

http://www.examiner.com/christianity-in-caspe...

In Pakistan, a mother and her 4 CHILDREN are BEATEN to death in their own home by 'good and faithful' Muslims:

http://www.examiner
panzade
 
  3  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 11:49 am
@OmSigDAVID,
I can't believe you passed your bar exam-

Quote:
On September 8, 1978, the shah's security force fired on a large group of demonstrators, killing hundreds and wounding thousands.

Two months later, thousands took to the streets of Tehran, rioting and destroying symbols of westernization, such as banks and liquor stores.

Khomeini called for the shah's immediate overthrow, and on December 11 a group of soldiers mutinied and attacked the shah's security officers. His regime collapsed, and on January 16, 1979, he fled the country. Fourteen days later, the Ayatollah Khomeini returned after 15 years of exile and took control of Iran.


Where's the peanut farmer in all this?
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -3  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2010 12:02 pm
Muslins burning bibles and whole churches


http://www.balaams-ass.com/alhaj/flames.htm

FLAMES AND ASHES OF BIBLES AND CHURCHES
IN SHANTI NAGAR KHANEWAL, PAKISTAN




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Page one and two consist of the photos on the previous page.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Page 3

On February 5th & 6 th 1997 in the presence of the cries-screams and tears of a very harmless, armless (no weapons) & peace loving a tiny community, an unprecidental,horrifying attack was made by the muslim believers,the citizens of the same country on the Christians who are in extreme minority.

The citizens who were attacked are the waeker section of the same society which have been living from many centuries together in harmony and brotherhood but the Islamization imposed by General Zia-ul-Haq and then later on the introduction of different Islamic laws, particulary the Blaspemy laws have created an atmospere of hatred prejudice and jealously against the citizens who have been working for the freedom of this land.

According to different news papers and interviews taken by different Human Rights-Social Activists and Religious leaders, nearly 75 thousand Muslims from the surrounding villages, towns, cities (Kabirwala, Mian Channoo, Khanewal and Multan) got gathered by a pre-planned plot mad by the Police officials of the Police Station Khanewal Saddar and the fundamentalists leaders fully equipped with all modern and latest sophisticated waepons, marched as an army towards the Christians Churches, Hostels, Dispensaries and Houses. The clouds of the smoke, the high degree of heat of flames, the screams and cries of the people whose belongings were burnt to ashes, their Bibles and Hymn books were also torched and blazed into ashes. This attack was not made by any foreign land people, but it was attacked by the people of the same country.

Actually this was an uncountable crowd of the believers who were raising slogans. "Kill the Christians because they are Blasphemers towards the Holy Quran and Holy Prophet".

The facts collected actually have been stated by the Muslims who are witnessing the brutal scene when it was being staged and played by the brutal people of the police and Islamic fundamentalist. Some of Muslims though they tried to bring the situation calm and quiet so that bad name should not come on the Muslims but the Muslims Mosque Priests and Political leaders from both parties were also inciting to burn every thing of the Christians which come in their way.


Page 4

The press media has been very active to communicate to the masses of the pathetic, horrifying scene where 15 hundered houses, shops, stores and 13 Churches and over 1500 Bibles and hymn books and religious commentaries were burnt into ashes in Shanti Nagar Khanewal, Punjab, Pakistan.

Though the experienced journalists of different News Papers, Journals and Magazines have also provided some clues that police officials were more responsible than the simple and illiterate Muslims.

Facts finding team comprising of Human rights social activists and religous Rev. John Victor Mall, Rev. William Johnson, Mr. David Paul, Mr. J.D.Gill, Mr. Niamat Bernard, Mr. Patras went on 9th Feb, 1007 from Lahore to Khanewal and Shanti Nagar. Whatever facts and figure they had found is being stated.

On the way this team took two very responsible and trust worthy persons Chaudhary Fateh Jang, and Mr. John Harnam from Chak No. 135 Stuntzabad so that they could be guide to the team in Shanti Nagar as they had very close relatives as well as they also belong to the same District of Khanewal. Though the press media has given the cause of attach on the Christians accusing them some Christians had desecrated the Holy Quran. As some pages of the Holy Quran had been torn and thrown in a mosque. Therefore, the Muslims got gathered and attacked on the Christian's village and Churches. That was self made story by the Muslims. Actually no Christian had committed any crime of such nature of Blaspemy.

There thirteen Churches have been desecrated, furniture and the altar has been ransacked. Over 1500 Bibles and Hymn books have been burnt into ashes. Besides over 1500 houses and belongings of the people have been ransacked in Shanti Nagar.

This team believes that this in human plot was concieved by the police especially by SHO Aziz-ur-Rehman Dogar, Head Constable Noor Nabi and ASI Mohammad Sadiq. The man who is being accused of desecrating the Holy Quran and writing derogatory remarks about the Prophet is a tonga driver, and is illiterate. Actually no Christian in Pakistan can ever think, dare to say or do some thing against Islam.


Page 5

The flames of fire are still to be seen and smelt in the village and houses have been destroyed with ammunition like petrol bombs and grenades. Concrete ceilings have been blown away which clearly indicate that forces beyond human strength was used. We the leaders of the Christian Community and human rights activist are convinced, that this was a planned plot against the Christrians to eliminate then completely.


Some points are worth
0 Replies
 
 

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