18
   

Four cops offed in WA

 
 
engineer
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 07:58 am
@sozobe,
I think this is a critical blow to Huckabee. In the law and order Republican primaries, he will be crucified by those fortunate enough not to have a decision like this blow up in their faces.
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 09:50 am
@engineer,
engineer wrote:

Does anyone else find the term "offed" to be casual to the point of offensive
for describing what happened in Washington?
Yes; I believe that in some vague, undefined way, in the twisted mind of the author,
the choice of words was intended to imply that the murders are MY fault
because of my support of the natural right of self defense.
This is not my paranoid interpretation thereof, but rather
the fact of my being called out, by name,
by the author of that title because of my history of posting
(as if I had alleged that any person who carries a gun is IMMUNE from all harm, regardless
of whether he is alert to his surroundings [i.e., straw man strategy]).

In the disordered mind of the author,
I was supposed to react with apology in chagrin, now in apostasy, rejecting preparation for self defense.
I think that he expected me to shout "Mea culpa!!" as I gnashed my teeth and rented out my clothing.
Those reactions did not happen.

(He claimed otherwise subsequently in the thread, but I don 't believe him.
I suspect that he was attempting damage control for his disgraced self-image.
I think he was just trying to make the best of a humiliating situation
into which he mindlessly put himself in an anti-David spirit.)

If u read the posts in the thread u will find them to be self-explanatory.


OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 09:58 am
@engineer,
engineer wrote:

I think this is a critical blow to Huckabee.
In the law and order Republican primaries,
he will be crucified by those fortunate enough
not to have a decision like this blow up in their faces.
Maybe; I had a hard time in deciding what to think of him
as he was campaigning for the GOP nomination. I prefer him to McCain,
but he is a bit unpredictable; not necessarily bad.





David
engineer
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 10:16 am
@OmSigDAVID,
Huckabee is unpredictable because he might go real Christian on you when you least expect it. He might suddenly support healthcare for the poor or extending unemployment to the needy or even show compassion for immigrants. Not that those are his stated positions, but he's got that streak in him.
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 10:16 am
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
(He (Merry Andrew)claimed otherwise subsequently in the thread, but I don 't believe him.
I suspect that he was attempting damage control for his disgraced self-image.
I think he was just trying to make the best of a humiliating situation
into which he mindlessly put himself in an anti-David spirit.)


Damage control for his disgraced self-image.?

Anti-David spirit?

I'm starting to worry about you David
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 10:23 am
@engineer,
engineer wrote:

Huckabee is unpredictable because he might go real Christian on you when you least expect it. He might suddenly support healthcare for the poor or extending unemployment to the needy or even show compassion for immigrants. Not that those are his stated positions, but he's got that streak in him.
I thought so too. That 's not good; I thought McCain was worse.

I voted for McCain in November 2008.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 10:24 am
@panzade,
panzade wrote:

Quote:
(He (Merry Andrew)claimed otherwise subsequently in the thread, but I don 't believe him.
I suspect that he was attempting damage control for his disgraced self-image.
I think he was just trying to make the best of a humiliating situation
into which he mindlessly put himself in an anti-David spirit.)


Damage control for his disgraced self-image.?

Anti-David spirit?

I'm starting to worry about you David
The thread speaks for itself.
I stand by what I said.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 10:29 am
@Merry Andrew,
from ABCNEWS.com:

Cop Killing Suspect Maurice Clemmons Shot Dead by Seattle Police

For more on this and other breaking news go to ABCNews.com







Maybe Andy thinks that now that (in his mind) carrying a gun has been proven worthless,
the police shoud have been unarmed, as thay chased the killer.

Maybe just HURL INSULTS at his reputation,
instead of shooting him, Andy? U think?





David
Merry Andrew
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 11:35 am
@OmSigDAVID,
No, Dave, you're wrong again as usual. Nothing in that headline comes as either a shock or a surprise to me. I really didn't expect that Clemmons would ever get to go to trial if they found him.

And why in the world you would think that I would think the police should have been unarmed is quite beyond me. You don't actually live in the real world, do you?
TTH
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 12:22 pm
I want to set the record straight that this shooting was NOT gang related. Also, one of the officers was able to shoot Clemmings before that officer was murdered. Several people are in custody for helping Clemmings.

My heart goes out to the families and friends of the murdered officers, the Lakewood Police Dept., nearby agencies, all law enforcement and the community.
dyslexia
 
  4  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 12:27 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

from ABCNEWS.com:

Cop Killing Suspect Maurice Clemmons Shot Dead by Seattle Police

For more on this and other breaking news go to ABCNews.com







Maybe Andy thinks that now that (in his mind) carrying a gun has been proven worthless,
the police shoud have been unarmed, as thay chased the killer.

Maybe just HURL INSULTS at his reputation,
instead of shooting him, Andy? U think?





David
david you're gone totally over the line this time.
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 03:14 pm
@dyslexia,
He ridiculed me, called me an "idiot" because I favor wearing a gun.
(See the opening paragraf.) Now, I am holding him, logically, to account for what he said.

(I don 't really care -- thay r only empty words -- but I was having a little fun, at his expense.)

If u think that 's "over the line" u r more than welcome to explain
what line and how I 'm over it, if u wanna.





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 03:20 pm
@TTH,
TTH wrote:

I want to set the record straight that this shooting was NOT gang related.
Also, one of the officers was able to shoot Clemmings before that
officer was murdered. Several people are in custody for helping Clemmings.

My heart goes out to the families and friends of the murdered officers,
the Lakewood Police Dept., nearby agencies, all law enforcement and the community.
I believe that u r factually correct.
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 03:39 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Of course, if you were a police officer, you would probably be carrying the gun and ammunition prescribed by your department. It would be in a department approved holster which would surely have a retention strap.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 04:48 pm
@Merry Andrew,
Merry Andrew wrote:
No, Dave, you're wrong again as usual.
Nothing in that headline comes as either a shock or a surprise to me.
I really didn't expect that Clemmons would ever get to go to trial if they found him.
I think most of us expected events to evolve as thay have; no surprizes, so far as I know.





Merry Andrew wrote:
And why in the world you would think that I would think
the police should have been unarmed is quite beyond me.
The reason "in the world" is that u ridiculed the police' wearing guns
as having been ineffective in defending them from death.
U implied that this disproved my advocacy of wearing defensive guns.

In effect, u made fun of the police -- the victims -- for their folly
(shoud I say "idiocy"?) in wearing guns because,
as u pointed out: in this case,
those guns did not protect them from death.


U implied that, in the face of these murders, I 'd repent of and reject
my earlier support of people being prepared for predatory emergencies
by wearing defensive guns. In your mind (based on what u wrote in your posts)
I was supposed to say:

" This proves that I was rong.
Wearing defensive guns cannot be of help in predatory emergencies.
Everyone stop wearing any defensive guns, because if trained police
cannot make good use of them, then u can 't either, so throw your guns in the garbage
and just take your chances as far as self defense goes.
Just hope for the best; that 's enuf; no problem.
Because of these murders, I 'll now become a fanatical pacifist,
and will no longer defend myself, my home, nor my family nor friends,
because guns have been PROVEN not to work.
I will become either Quaker or Amish; eeenie, meanie, miney, mo . . . . "



Andy, I infer from your posts -- generally -- that u have a sufficiently decent CHARACTER
as not to ridicule recently deceased victims of violence
on the basis of the failure of their defensive preparations (i.e., wearing guns),
but it appears that you are so consummately STUPID as to have done that
in the beginning of this thread.

In your effort to make ME look like an "idiot" as u put it,
u inadvertently cast aspersions on the deceased victims.

U owe them and their families an apology.

(Note that I bear u no resentment for your denigration of me in this thread.)





David
Merry Andrew
 
  6  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 05:51 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
The reason "in the world" is that u ridiculed the police' wearing guns
as having been ineffective in defending them from death.
U implied that this disproved my advocacy of wearing defensive guns.

In effect, u made fun of the police -- the victims -- for their folly
(shoud I say "idiocy"?) in wearing guns because,
as u pointed out: in this case,
those guns did not protect them from death.


I did nothing of the sort whatever, you feeble-brained senile dullard!

Never, by explicit statement nor by any inference that a normally sane person (which, of course, excludes you) could make have I ridiculed the police wearing guns nor suggested anywhere, anytime, in any fashion that it might be preferable for police to go around unarmed. That statement exists only in your fevered, intelectually abreviated imagination, David.

What I did say in the introduction to this thread was that the fact that four well-trained and well-armed police officers were gunned down in seconds kind of defeats your argument that going around heeled, packing serious heat, is the universal antidote to becoming a vic tim. Inasmuch as these officers obviously became victims I don't see how you can counter that.

Hang it up, Dave. Take a nap.
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 08:17 pm
@Merry Andrew,
David wrote:
The reason "in the world" is that u ridiculed the police' wearing guns
as having been ineffective in defending them from death.
U implied that this disproved my advocacy of wearing defensive guns.

In effect, u made fun of the police -- the victims -- for their folly
(shoud I say "idiocy"?) in wearing guns because,
as u pointed out: in this case,
those guns did not protect them from death.


Merry Andrew wrote:
I did nothing of the sort whatever,
you feeble-brained senile dullard!
Obviously, u DID,
its just that u are too stupid to understand your own words.


Merry Andrew wrote:
Never, by explicit statement nor by any inference that a normally sane person
(which, of course, excludes you) could make have I ridiculed the police
wearing guns nor suggested anywhere, anytime, in any fashion
that it might be preferable for police to go around unarmed.
The way that u DID IT, dimwit, is by implying that the victims were on a fool 's errand
by taking the trouble to wear guns, as David inanely prattles about and supports.
U scoffed at their wearing guns, that the guns had no value, because thay had not saved the victims from death.
U did this in an effort to denigrate ME,
but your example was a post-mortem slap in the face to them. If one of the widows saw your post,
she 'd have good reason to be extremely offended at u, Andy.



Merry Andrew wrote:
That statement exists only in your fevered, intelectually abreviated imagination, David.
GET OFF YOUR HIGH HORSE, YOUNG MAN, and do it this very instant!






Merry Andrew wrote:

What I did say in the introduction to this thread was that the fact that four well-trained
and well-armed police officers were gunned down in seconds
kind of defeats your argument that going around heeled,
packing serious heat, is the universal antidote to becoming a vic tim.
THAT's THE POINT!!!
U made fun of people who try to protect themselves
from future emergencies by proper preparation
, on the grounds that
it does not ` always work and therefore all efforts shoud be abandoned.

According to u, a man who does not agree with that is an idiot.
Those police obviously did not agree with that, since thay were wearing guns.

NOTE, incidentally, that I never said nor have I ever believed that
wearing a gun "is the universal antidote to becoming a vic tim" as Andy falsely alleges of me.
Sometimes preparations for emergencies are helpful; not always.








Merry Andrew wrote:
Inasmuch as these officers obviously became victims I don't see how you can counter that
Here's how I can counterargue that:
I have said this so many times already that I 'm getting tired of it:
I am a man the use of whose stainless steel mirror .44 revolver
in low light conditions was sufficient to scare away criminals
who shot at me; the MERE SIGHT of my silver colored gun was enuf
that thay screamed and fled within a fraction of a second
of my pulling out the weapon. I suspect that thay felt in personal danger.
I have a hunch that thay prefer helpless, unarmed victims.
I don 't claim to be a mindreader, but think thay felt disappointed
that their victim of the evening had defensive firepower.
I am very CONFIDENT that those criminals favor your philosophy, Andy.
Thay 'd want to take u by the hand and embrace u lovingly for trying to protect them.
Thay 'd hug u and kiss u. So woud their mothers, but not their victims' mothers.



Now, upon my reading of Andy 's scorn and ridicule,
I am expected to throw my guns in the garbage
and to adopt HELPLESSNESS in the face of any future violence,
because if the 4 armed police can 't defend themselves,
then OBVIOUSLY I am not able to do so either, regardless of the fact that I already DID.

Did I get that right, Andy ???




Merry Andrew wrote:
Hang it up, Dave. Take a nap.
NO. It will not happen that way, Andy: U LOSE, because u made a fool of yourself.

U are welcome to put your tail between your legs and slink away into the night,
or u can (extremely unlikely) be enuf of a MAN to admit
that u were rong and offer proper apologies.

That woud be expecting too much of u.





David
Merry Andrew
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Dec, 2009 10:11 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
U LOSE, because u made a fool of yourself.



It would appear that the majority of the posters on this thread disagree with you, Dave. My posts keep garnering 'thumbs up' while more and more A2kers are putting you on 'ignore' or, at least, collapsing your ranting and raving posts. (And, btw, I've not ever had you on 'ignore' nor are any of your posts collapsed on my computer. You're far too hilarious to ignore.)
slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Wed 2 Dec, 2009 08:14 am
Huckabee's poor judgement in granting clemency to this guy could and should cost him any shot at any future presidential nomination. However, what's really remarkable to me in this whole tragic incident is the reaction of Clemmons' family and friends in aiding and abetting this killer. Evidently they lied to police, providing numerous false leads while staunching his wounds and plotting his escape.

I understand family ties and all, but to help a family member who'd just shot four random police officers in the head execution-style is completely beyond me.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 2 Dec, 2009 04:04 pm
Police now have six people in custody for helping suspected cop-killer Maurice Clemmons elude police during a two-day manhunt.
The six have been identified as Douglas Davis, Eddie Davis, Rickey Hinton " Clemmons' half brother " Letricia Nelson, Quiana Williams and Darcus Allen, the Pierce County prosecutor's office said. Allen is being held as a fugitive from Arkansas, where he is wanted on robbery and theft charges and parole violations.

Even with a gunshot wound to the torso, Clemmons, 37, managed to elude police until early Tuesday, when a Seattle police officer spotted him and told him to show his hands. Clemmons ran and appeared to reach into his pocket, and the officer shot and killed him, Assistant Police Chief Jim Pugel said.

Authorities say relatives and friends aided Clemmons during those days that he evaded authorities.

Relatives and friends drove Clemmons from the scene of the coffeehouse shooting, bandaged his wound, drove him 40 miles to Seattle and hid him, affidavits filed by Pierce County prosecutor Mark Lindquist say.

According to the documents, someone drove Clemmons away from the coffeehouse. Eddie and Douglas Davis said that at Hinton's home, Clemmons told them and Hinton he had "taken care of business" and had been shot by police, the documents say. They said he had told them the night before that he would shoot police, the documents say.

The Davises and Clemmons went to the home of a female relative of Clemmons' in the Seattle area, where they treated Clemmons' wound, the affidavits say. From there, the documents say, they drove to a parking lot and met a woman who took them to an apartment complex where Clemmons switched cars. His journey ended when he encountered the officer who shot him.

"If the officer didn't pull up ... there's no telling what he would've done," said Ron Lewis, 59, who lives in the neighborhood where Clemmons died. "Maybe he would've hijacked someone else driving by. He knew they were looking for him. He had to be desperate."

Earlier Wednesday, corrections officials in Washington and Arkansas debated who was responsible for allowing the convicted felon to be out on the streets in the first place.

Clemmons had been on parole in Arkansas for a series of robberies and burglaries, but because he was allowed to move to Washington state in 2004 when he left prison, he was under the supervision of Washington's Department of Corrections.

The problems began between the two states in July after Clemmons had been arrested for allegedly punching a police officer and raping a child. Arkansas Department of Community Correction issued a warrant for his arrest based on information it received that Clemmons had absconded and couldn't be found.

Clemmons was kept in jail because of the warrant issued by Arkansas. However, Arkansas rescinded the warrant in late July because it received a letter from Clemmons' attorney that he had not absconded, department spokeswoman Rhonda Sharp says.

E-mails show Washington state corrections officials asked Arkansas officials not to rescind their warrant because it was the reason they would be able to keep Clemmons in jail.

0 Replies
 
 

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