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Why is sexual abuse of boys not taken seriously

 
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 12:28 pm
A car accident can POTENTIALLY cause physical harm. It MAY require a trip to the hospital.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 01:05 pm
@boomerang,
boomerang wrote:
Quote:
Well... David's post does make it clear
that there are people who indeed don't take it seriously.

It was not my intention to create that impression.
It saddens me that u inferred that I was trying to be humorous.
Boomer, whether I am right or not,
I assure u, on my honor, that I am not kidding around on your thread.
What I posted is not a joke.
I was speaking earnestly and from the heart.



boomerang wrote:
Quote:
I really, really don't get this:

Quote:
If a sexual abuser is a MALE,
then he shoud go to jail, but that does not apply to women
who shoud be free of any such interference.

There are things, very brutal things,
that a male can do (relating to forcible sodomy)
that no female is able to do.


boomerang wrote:
Quote:
If a gay 15 year old boy is raped by a woman
should she go to jail and it be okay if he was raped by a man?
What u describe if accomplished by force is a criminal assault,
even if no sex were involved. For instance, if a female
kicks a boy in the ass, or throws a rock at him,
she shoud be held to account; that 's not sex related.
I have posted hereinabove on this thread that I condemn
and deplore perverted males having sexual contact with minors.
I 've said and re-iterate that statutory rape laws shoud legally
curtail the conduct of adult males.

Please do not take this to be kidding,
because I offer this
with NO humor:
I sincerely believe that it is very unlikely that normal sexual intercourse (normal mating)
can be accomplished with a freightened male because,
in my opinion, he 'd not get an erection.


I have not yet read your quoted research.
I will do so, and possibly I will comment upon it,
depend ing on what it says.
boomerang wrote:
Quote:
I found this interesting overview of studies
(haven't looked up the actual studies yet though) showing that abuse
by men and women towards teenage boys isn't all that different:


Quote:
Dynamics of Female Perpetrated Abuse

Some research has reported that female perpetrators commit fewer and less intrusive acts of sexual abuse compared to males. While male perpetrators are more likely to engage in anal intercourse and to have the victim engage in oral-genital contact, females tend to use more foreign objects as part of the abusive act (Kaufman, 1995). This study also reported that differences were not found in the frequency of vaginal intercourse, fondling by the victim or abuser, genital body contact without penetration, or oral contact by the abuser.

Females may be more likely to use verbal coercion than physical force. The most commonly reported types of abuse by female perpetrators include vaginal intercourse, oral sex, fondling, and group sex (Faller, 1987; Hunter et al., 1993). However, women also engage in mutual masturbation, oral, anal, and genital sex acts, show children pornography, and play sex games (Johnson, 1989; Knopp and Lackey, 1987). The research suggests that, overall, female and male perpetrators commit many of the same acts and follow many of the same patterns of abuse against their victims. They also do not tend to differ significantly in terms of their relationship to the victim (most are relatives) or the location of the abuse (Allen, 1991; Kaufman et al., 1995).

It is interesting to note in the study by Kaufman et al., (1995), that 8% of the female perpetrators were teachers and 23% were baby-sitters, compared to male perpetrators who were 0% and 8% respectively. Finkelhor et al., (1988) also report significantly higher rates of sexual abuse of children by females in daycare settings. Of course Finkelhor's findings should not surprise us given that women represent the majority of daycare employees.

Research on teen and adult female sexual abuse perpetrators has found that many suffer from low self-esteem, antisocial behaviour, poor social and anger management skills, fear of rejection, passivity, promiscuity, mental health problems, posttraumatic stress disorder, and mood disorders (Hunter, Lexier, Goodwin, Browne, and Dennis, 1993; Mathews, Matthews, and Speltz, 1989). However, as in the case of male perpetrators, research does not substantiate that highly emotionally disturbed or psychotic individuals predominate among the larger population of female sexual abusers (Faller, 1987).

There is some evidence that females are more likely to be involved with co-abusers, typically a male, though studies report a range from 25% - 77% (Faller, 1987; Kaufman et al., 1995; McCarty, 1986). However, Mayer (1992), in a review of data on 17 adolescent female sex offenders, found that only 2 were involved with male co-perpetrators. She also found that the young women in this study knew their victims and that none experienced legal consequences for their actions.

Self-report studies provide a very different view of sexual abuse perpetration and increase the number of female perpetrators substantially. In a retrospective study of male victims, 60% reported being abused by females (Johnson and Shrier, 1987). The same rate was found in a sample of college students (Fritz et al., 1981). In other studies of male university and college students, rates of female perpetration were found at levels as high as 72% - 82% (Fromuth and Burkhart, 1987, 1989; Seidner and Calhoun, 1984). Bell et al., (1991) found that 27% of males were abused by females. In some of these types of studies females represent as much as 50% of sexual abusers (Risin and Koss, 1987). Knopp and Lackey (1987) found that 51% of victims of female sexual abusers were male. It is evident that case report and self-report studies yield very different types of data about prevalence. These extraordinary differences tell us we need to start questioning all of our assumptions about perpetrators and victims of child maltreatment.

Finally, there is an alarmingly high rate of sexual abuse by females in the backgrounds of rapists, sex offenders, and sexually aggressive men, 59% (Petrovich and Templer, 1984), 66% (Groth, 1979), and 80% (Briere and Smiljanich, 1993). A strong case for the need to identify female perpetrators can be found in Table 4, which presents the findings from a study of adolescent sex offenders by O'Brien (1989). Male adolescent sex offenders abused by "females only" chose female victims almost exclusively.


http://www.aest.org.uk/survivors/male/ibc3.html

boomerang wrote:
Quote:
In my opinion it doesn't matter if the abuser is a man or a woman,
they're doing the same things to the same person and it is criminal.
The abuser's gender doesn't make a difference.

I don 't see it that way.
To my mind,
in MY opinion, it woud have been a much worse,
much more painful memory to me, both physically and emotionally,
if I had been forcibly sodomized by a male.
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 01:22 pm
With all of his bragging and his illogical rants, my experience of David has been sufficient that my opinion of Mensa went in the toilet a long time ago.
Robert Gentel
 
  7  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:10 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
In other words,
YOUR intelligence is so relatively MAGNIFICENT that u need to start a FLAME WAR
on Boomer 's thread, because u r not enuf of a gentleman to be civil.
Did I get that right?


David, even if you aren't calling others idiots I think what you are saying is far more offensive. Second guessing the suffering from sexual abuse is one of the more prevalent sources of ongoing suffering abuse victims face.

To say that their very real pain is "idle superstition" is something that is going to deeply offend people, even those who haven't been abused themselves but who can empathize with those who have been.

You like to say that when men do it it's "perverted" but when women do it it is not, but this shows very little understanding of paraphilia (a more scientific term for "perversion"). Given that the women in question were 17 and 23 this was not a large chronophilia (the paraphilia when one's pychosexual age is discordant with one's chronological age) if at all.

In both cases it still represents sexual impropriety to me, in that an 11-year old is often not emotionally and physically prepared for sexual activity, but it may well be the case that you were.

However it is highly untoward for you to suggest that because of this experience there is no such beast as pedophilia in women. The existence of female hebephilia, ephebophilia and pedophilia is well documented and what you experienced was simply not very far along the spectrum of the paraphilia out there.

I'll ask you again, do you have a line anywhere? Is a two-year old fair game? I know two year old males who were sexually abused by females. They enjoyed it at the time but later grew to deeply resent the experience. Here is an example of one such case. The guy murdered one of the women who participated in the abuse in 2005 and then took his own life. As a child he expressed interest in the sexual activity being given him, but he lacked the maturity to give informed consent and it came to haunt him.

Your case represented a much smaller chronological discrepancy that Ricky's abuse started at and while it may not have been harmful to your estimation I urge you to consider that in other cases it can be, and that your particular experiences lacked many of the contributing factors that can make it so (such as authority figures, greater psychosexual vs chronological discrepancy and more).

One of the reasons that this is such a polemic subject is that there are relatively normal sexual attitudes that include such attractions. There are adolescent males and females that healthy adults can feel physical attraction for. But the realization that their physical and emotional maturity may not be ready for sexual activity is what should hold adults back and serve as a barrier to prevent predation on weaker emotional beings.

I grew up in a group that preached that there was nothing wrong with adult/child sex. And I do acknowledge that the girls who were abused often suffered more than the boys who were. But that you were a willing participant at the time means little, many of the girls I knew were as well, and among the girls and boys alike many came to suffer very profoundly from their premature exposure to sexual activity.

While it is certainly true that some may view the experience positively it is very little harm to them to erect the barrier that protects those who don't. You having to wait till you were able to give informed consent is worth the many lives destroyed by those who didn't get that opportunity, and I urge you to consider that your experience may have been positive for you, while the societal barrier still makes sense in order to prevent the harm to those to whom it would not.
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:30 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:
my opinion of Mensa went in the toilet a long time ago.

Mensa is mutual-admiration society for people with low self-esteem who test well.

But that's beside the point.
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:33 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
in MY opinion, it woud have been a much worse,
much more painful memory to me, both physically and emotionally,
if I had been forcibly sodomized by a male.

So, because another experience would have been worse, being abused by a woman can't be painful?

So, if someone burglarizes your house, you should be grateful to them, because they could have burnt it down, ya know.
Francis
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:36 pm
@DrewDad,
It's quite obvious now that David's reasoning follows a line that reason knows nothing of..
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:48 pm
@Francis,
He knows what he knows, and ain't no facts gonna change his mind.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:48 pm
@Rockhead,
Rockhead wrote:

dave, now you are boring, wrong, and hurting my eyes with all your damn red type.

what's next in your civil gentlemanliness?
I 'm sorry if u think that I m boring.
I m not Johnny Carson.
I 'm just expressing my opinions of what is right and rong
and what the law shoud be.

The red type was a device to separate my writing
from others' writing. I coud have done it much more labor intensively
and inconvenienty, if I did not take that shortcut.





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:49 pm
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:

For a Mensan, you sure are an idiot.
Maybe that is an attempt at humor; I 'm not sure.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:52 pm
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:

A car accident can POTENTIALLY cause physical harm. It MAY require a trip to the hospital.
Is this another attempt at humor ?
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:56 pm
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:

He knows what he knows, and ain't no facts gonna change his mind.
I have an open mind.
I am not immune to logic.
If I become dissuaded from my earlier point of vu, I ll admit it.
If your efforts to convince me are found to be in error,
I will not surrender just to become popular with u.

I 'd rather be right than popular.





David
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  3  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 02:59 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

DrewDad wrote:

A car accident can POTENTIALLY cause physical harm. It MAY require a trip to the hospital.
Is this another attempt at humor ?

No, it's an attempt to point out to you how absurd you are.

Try answering some of Roberts questions, if you have such an open mind. I'm afraid I don't think I can be civil to you.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 03:01 pm
@DrewDad,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
in MY opinion, it woud have been a much worse,
much more painful memory to me, both physically and emotionally,
if I had been forcibly sodomized by a male.

Quote:
So, because another experience would have been worse,
being abused by a woman can't be painful?

It depends on WHAT she DOES.




Quote:
So, if someone burglarizes your house, you should be grateful to them,
because they could have burnt it down, ya know.

I understand your point.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 03:04 pm
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:

Setanta wrote:
my opinion of Mensa went in the toilet a long time ago.

Quote:
Mensa is mutual-admiration society for people with low self-esteem who test well.
What do YOU
know about it ?

Quote:
But that's beside the point.

It IS; so Y did u go off topic?
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 03:13 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

DrewDad wrote:

Setanta wrote:
my opinion of Mensa went in the toilet a long time ago.

Mensa is mutual-admiration society for people with low self-esteem who test well.
What do YOU
know about it ?

Oh, my wife and I looked into it since we both have qualifying test scores.

But then we met some Mensans. It takes more than a high test score to make someone interesting, nice, or socially adept. And I'm surprised they didn't all have their arms in slings from walking around trying to pat themselves on the back.

OmSigDAVID wrote:
Quote:
But that's beside the point.

It IS; so Y did u go off topic?

Why did you perpetuate it?
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 04:04 pm
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:

OmSigDAVID wrote:

DrewDad wrote:

Setanta wrote:
my opinion of Mensa went in the toilet a long time ago.

Mensa is mutual-admiration society for people with low self-esteem who test well.
What do YOU
know about it ?

Oh, my wife and I looked into it since we both have qualifying test scores.

Quote:
But then we met some Mensans. It takes more than a high test score to make someone interesting, nice, or socially adept. And I'm surprised they didn't all have their arms in slings from walking around trying to pat themselves on the back.

If u say THAT, then I am a bit skeptical of your allegations
because in over 30 years of being in Mensa,
I 've never seen THAT.
Its just our social club.



OmSigDAVID wrote:
Quote:
But that's beside the point.

It IS; so Y did u go off topic?

Why did you perpetuate it?
To question u.
I dispute that the post is perpetual.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 04:08 pm
@Robert Gentel,

Let me get back to u, Robert.
I found both of your posts very interesting n well reasoned.
I 've gotta get some sleep; falling asleep here.

I 'll respond within a few hours.





David
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 04:31 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
per·pet·u·ate (pər-pěch'ōō-āt')
tr.v. per·pet·u·at·ed, per·pet·u·at·ing, per·pet·u·ates

1. To cause to continue indefinitely; make perpetual.
2. To prolong the existence of; cause to be remembered:
0 Replies
 
boomerang
 
  3  
Reply Fri 4 Sep, 2009 05:38 pm
Okay. Can this stop now? It was a pretty good conversation for a bit. Personally, I'm glad David joined in, it can get kind of boring when we all sit around agreeing with each other.

I think David's experience is valid. What mystifies me is that he thinks it is so universal as to preclude women being punished for such behavior.

I confess to experimenting with a variety of recreational drugs and enjoying all of it. I don't recommend that it all be legalized simply because I thought it was fun.

The idea of it no longer appeals to me.

I'll wager that David is no longer having sex with women 20 years his senior.
 

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