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Pet peeves in women's (or men's) wear

 
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 03:35 pm
@ehBeth,
ehBeth wrote:

I personally feel that it has to do with respect. Respect for oneself and others.


But, what do your shoes have to do with respect? Like, if you aren't wearing the socially-approved shoes, you're being disrespectful? To me this is somewhat shallow, other than for protective purposes, clothing is immaterial and judging people based on their clothes is hardly an evolved behavior for our society to engage in.

Quote:
I also don't think anyone cares whether you buy into it or not.


Probably not, but that doesn't mean my opinion isn't valid. Encouraging people to Toe the Line for the sake of 'not sticking out' isn't what our society should be about.

Cycloptichorn
aidan
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 04:05 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Quote:
Not just court but all aspects of life. And yes, it will take brave people who are willing to challenge the status quo, to remove us from this historical farce, that the 'clothes make the man.'

But in that sense, school uniforms are a great equalizer.
I think there are two different subjects here. 'Clothes' as an emblem of status- and 'clothes' as a method of personal expression.
Quote:

Hard for me to believe that people find clothing to be distracting.

Anything that's interesting or thought provoking is distracting to me. But I'm easily distractable. If I were on a jury and one of the attorneys was wearing a distracting piece of jewelry or really high heeled shoes that looked uncomfortable to walk in (or flip flops and bright toenail polish)- or a brightly colored silk vest (David maybe) - call me shallow- but I'd be distracted. Not in a judgmental way - just in an interested, curious way.

Quote:
I really detest school uniforms, and think it's socially harmful to kids to make them dress up like little clones of each other. I certainly never had to deal with that ****.

I never had to wear a school uniform either - but we all had our own default 'uniforms'. The freaks wore one brand of jeans, t-shirts and desert boots or earth shoes- the jocks another and the preppies another....it's the same thing.

My daughter has to wear a uniform and I have to say, I love it. It's so easy and practical- it keeps school about school. It's not a fashion show.



sozobe
 
  2  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 04:18 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
I think that in Joe's example it has more to do with respect for one's client. Whether it's for good or ill, the lawyer that shows up in flip-flops is doing a disservice to her client. She is less likely to be effective.

Clothing is a form of expression, every bit as much as voice, the words you choose to use, the language you choose to use, etc., etc. (the things I mention are a small fraction of total self-expression modes). Whether she showed up in flip-flops or chose to speak in, like, teenager up-speak? Ya know?, she made a choice that made her less likely to represent her client effectively. Still her choice.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 04:25 pm
@sozobe,
sozobe wrote:

I think that in Joe's example it has more to do with respect for one's client. Whether it's for good or ill, the lawyer that shows up in flip-flops is doing a disservice to her client. She is less likely to be effective.

Clothing is a form of expression, every bit as much as voice, the words you choose to use, the language you choose to use, etc., etc. (the things I mention are a small fraction of total self-expression modes). Whether she showed up in flip-flops or chose to speak in, like, teenager up-speak? Ya know?, she made a choice that made her less likely to represent her client effectively. Still her choice.


Oh, I know. But an immaterial one, in the big picture. It's just a very visible sign that our society is far more focused on stupid and inconsequential aspects of one's nature than it should be.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 04:32 pm
@aidan,
Those shoes I posted a few pages ago are VERY distracting to some people. Whodathunkit?
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 04:34 pm
@aidan,
aidan wrote:

My daughter has to wear a uniform and I have to say, I love it. It's so easy and practical- it keeps school about school. It's not a fashion show.


Agreed. Which is why I've taken to wearing my own "office uniform", same color/style pants with the same color/style shirt every day of the week.

And really, doesn't this accomplish the goal of "challenging the status quo"?
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 04:35 pm
@maporsche,
Quote:

And really, doesn't this accomplish the goal of "challenging the status quo"?


Yeah, it does, actually. It's exactly what I am talking about - you have made an affirmative decision to go with what works for you, instead of what society expects out of you. True, it's in the opposite direction from what I was talking about, but that doesn't matter.

I applaud your decision, sir!

Cycloptichorn
spendius
 
  2  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 04:42 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Hey Cyclo-- would you go to a funeral in a loin cloth with a bone through your nose and a luminous dyed mohican haircut?

If not you're dead in the water and have been fannying about with minor delicacies in the service of sounding cool to the lower middle class. (the Beta Minus.)
Joeblow
 
  2  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 05:11 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

joefromchicago wrote:

I was in court for a hearing today and the opposing counsel, a woman who, I estimated, was in her early 30s, was wearing flip-flops. Very nice flip-flops, I'll hasten to add, but flip-flops nonetheless. I was tempted to ask if those were her dress flip-flops, but I refrained.


Was it inappropriate?

I have a real hard time with the 'formal' nature of business clothing. It's designed to tell other people that you are also a serious person. I find the whole concept to be eminently ridiculous.

Cycloptichorn



Well, there is such a thing as courtroom decorum. Deep cleavage is a no-no as well, as is loud, flamboyant clothing.

These are all things you might reasonably expect to see on the street on any given day.

Courtrooms generally do represent serious business.

Don’t slouch or lean on the bench, either.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 05:14 pm
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

Hey Cyclo-- would you go to a funeral in a loin cloth with a bone through your nose and a luminous dyed mohican haircut?

If not you're dead in the water and have been fannying about with minor delicacies in the service of sounding cool to the lower middle class. (the Beta Minus.)


I may require that to be the dress at my funeral - think of how fun it would be!

Cycloptichorn
spendius
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 05:18 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
I would be weeping Cyclo. I would wear a black suit, black polished shoes, a black tie and a white shirt and a hat to cover up my unbarbered locks. (Apologies for the beard.)
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 05:19 pm
@aidan,
aidan wrote:

Quote:
Now, I've got a pair of fancy high heeled ones,


I've got a pair of high heeled ones. They're not fancy though - they're olive green with a wedge heel from Old Navy. My daughter borrows them on occasion and I laugh and laugh when she wears them because she's really tall and thin and usually wears flats, but when she slips on my flip-flops to go outside for a moment or something, she seems to be slightly tottery and it looks so cute.
I think the higher heel helps develop my calf muscles- I can feel them working when I wear them, so I make a point of doing that.

I think the key to comfortable flip flops is the shape and smoothness of the little piece that goes between your big and second toe and also the width and texture of the straps that go across the top of your foot. If they're cheap plastic and too thin - they're won't be comfortable.

The Gap makes really good, sturdy, comfortable flip flops- in great neutral colors. One nine dollar pair lasts me a whole summer - and that's wearing them pretty much every single day.
U can find a custom shoemaker who 'll make a plaster cast
of @ foot and build a shoe around it, unique for your use.





David
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 05:24 pm
@spendius,
spendius wrote:

I would be weeping Cyclo. I would wear a black suit, black polished shoes, a black tie and a white shirt and a hat to cover up my unbarbered locks. (Apologies for the beard.)


Don't do that - how sad!

And you don't have to apologize for the beard, it is a natural and preferable state for a man's face to be in.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 10:23 pm
@sozobe,
sozobe wrote:
Quote:
I think that in Joe's example it has more to do with respect for one's client.
Whether it's for good or ill, the lawyer that shows up in flip-flops
is doing a disservice to her client. She is less likely to be effective.
I can assure u that litigants ofen take their cases
very, very seriously -- sometimes for years on end, as thay await
their day in court. If their attorney showed up wearing sandals,
his client 'd be alarmed n demoralized, wondering:
"O, NO! What have I gotten myself into?"
It is not uncommon for litigants to fire their trial attorneys;
sometimes thay go thru several different ones.

A jury hearing argument of trial testimoney qua the disputed facts
is less likely to give earnest consideration,
or perhaps less likely even to pay much attention
to someone dressed for a beach picnic rather than someone who is well dressed.

A disgruntled client might think in terms of malpractice litigation
for any lawyer who lost after being so injudicious as to accept Cyclo 's advice.






sozobe wrote:
Quote:
Clothing is a form of expression, every bit as much as voice,
the words you choose to use, the language you choose to use,
etc., etc. (the things I mention are a small fraction of total self-
expression modes). Whether she showed up in flip-flops or chose
to speak in, like, teenager up-speak? Ya know?, she made a choice
that made her less likely to represent her client effectively. Still her choice.
Your points r well taken.





David
Rockhead
 
  2  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 10:30 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
if I'm paying $100+ an hour, the joker better be dressed better'n me...
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 10:42 pm
@Rockhead,
Rockhead wrote:

if I'm paying $100+ an hour, the joker better be dressed better'n me...
That better be a BIG +.

Its been a while since u coud get any decent self-respecting trial attorney for $100 an hour.





David
Rockhead
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 10:43 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
we're still in Kansas, Toto...
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 10:45 pm
@Rockhead,

I don 't know much about Kansas,
but I was getting $100 an hour in NYC 30 years ago.
Rockhead
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 10:46 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
that's aboot how far behind we are...

(mind you I have not required counsel for some time now)
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Thu 27 Aug, 2009 10:49 pm
@Rockhead,

OK Good luck with that
0 Replies
 
 

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