Talking to your kid about "the n- word".

@ebrown p,

ebrown p wrote:

Quote:

My teenage sons and their friends refer to each other as "niggers".
(I don't believe white kids in their social circles would use the term.)

I 'm reminded of a (strange?) experience of mine in the 1990s.
There were about 6 male blacks aged around 20 in an elevator,
of whom one was highly and vocally enraged toward another one, not present.
The angry one raged on and on in his complaints,
addressing the others, and repeatedly referring to the object
of his ire by the word that is the subject matter of this thread.
He raised his voice in emphasis every time he attributed this
racial description to the perpetrator of his discontent (whose race he shared).

His denunciations were the only voice in the elevator.

ebrown p wrote:

Quote:

The term is used as a typical teen irreverent and defiant social ritual.
I don't know if this is healthy or not; teen rituals have their own strange logic.
On one sense, casual use of a historically painful word probably diminishes its effect.
Forbidden words are endowed with a sense of mysticism and power.

As a parent, I do not focus on words. I want my kids to be decent compassionate people.
You do this by understanding other people's feeling and thinking about what you say.
You don't do this by banning words.

I think explaining why a word is hurtful to other people is a good idea.

That sounds reasonable.
My own vu, of explaining the applicable history
has already been posted by others.
I need not be redundant.

There are at least 2 "B words";
one can be explained as pertaining to dogs
and their sons who, presumably r also dogs.

The other concerns wedlock or its absence.
It seems odd that cruelty is ofen ascribed to people
who 've been born of parents "without benefit of clergy."

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Finn dAbuzz wrote:

Quote:
Like mostly incoherent rantings made only more insane by a zero method use of formating (bold,underline,color,italic,size). In this case, my imagination takes me on a ride where you rant about first amendment rights. Perhaps you'd throw in "freedom of thought" into a sentence to imply that teaching a child that "nigger" is a bad word is akin to censorship.

Finish with a "thought police" to seal the deal.

Pretty amusing Diest. (Is there a commonly used acronym for expressing amusment? Say a third of LOL?)

I don't think there's a lot of harm in a little bit of baiting, but I also don't complain about trolling. If you do, then perhaps you should reconsider the accusations or the baiting.

Dude, I just set the bar low so there's a chance to be impressed anymore. I'd love to be wrong on this.

T
K
O

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@Diest TKO,

Diest TKO wrote:

Quote:

Like mostly incoherent rantings made only more insane by a zero
method use of formating (bold,underline,color,italic,size).

Its interesting that u bring that up.
Maybe around a year ago, I put u on Ignore for a few months
not so much because of disagreement with any of your opinions,
as the fact that it was painful trying to figure out what u were trying to say in your posts.
Eventually, I decided that the value of your contributions was lower than the discomfort involved in decoding your posts.

I take it that English is not your first language.

David

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No. English is my first language, I just suck at typing and I don't always proofread my posts. I switched Internet browsers so that I'd have a realtime spell check to help with it. The big difference here is that if I have a post that confuses someone it was unintentional, you put effort into making yours hard to understand.

T
K
O

1 Reply

It's not all that simple to explain that word easily. The thing that might confuse your kids if yu give them the explanation as suggested abbove is that these days more and more people are using the word as positively charged slang that I am more and more inclined to regard as a sort of generalized 'friend'. The word is in that context most frequently heard between afroamericans, and I guess it's the present substitue of 'brother' as used in the 80's and 90's.

If you don't touch that aspect of it, your kids may very well become even more confused when they hear it used in the above mentioned context.

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@najmelliw,

language is dynamic, society is dynamic, some people are static. they usually have a very limited vocabulary.

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@Diest TKO,

Don't you think it's ironic that your only contributions to this thread have been idiotic nonsense about how someone else would ruin the thread with idiotic nonsense?

Finn is spot on to peg it as trolling.

1 Reply

I was told by my mother that in the second grade I came home from school asking what the word meant, since some boys were using it during time in the schoolyard. Apparently, she became very serious and explained that it was a very bad word, and our family did not use that word. I was also warned that children that use that word (this was the 1950's) I should not hang around, since she believed they may be more likely to get into trouble.

I still do not associate with people that use that word.

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@najmelliw,

Quote:

these days more and more people are using the word as positively charged slang that I am more and more inclined to regard as a sort of generalized 'friend'. The word is in that context most frequently heard between afroamericans, and I guess it's the present substitue of 'brother' as used in the 80's and 90's.

I don't believe "more and more people are using the word..." and I also don't believe it can ever be "positively charged."

I'm not alone

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rob-harper/the-n-word-is-never-accep_b_113501.html

http://media.www.harambeenews.com/media/storage/paper1394/news/2009/02/05/Opinion/African.Americans.No.More.NWord-3638902.shtml

http://www.villagevoice.com/2008-10-22/music/the-n-word-is-flourishing-among-generation-hip-hop-latinos

I recall an interview of Richard Pryor who was a pioneer of the word's reclamation process vowing, upon returning from a trip to Africa, that he would never use the world again. I don't believe he did either.

As Harper puts it:

Quote:

Any attempt to justify the use of a word that historically has a negative meaning, is an indication of deeper psychological issues with the group or person justifying its use.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Quote:

I don't believe "more and more people are using the word..." and I also don't believe it can ever be "positively charged."

all you have to do is be around anyone under 30....which I am, every day, to see that more and more teens are using it and it is not used in a negative way.I don't care what Huffington says

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@panzade,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wD-UpHlB9no

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@2PacksAday,

that's a beautiful rant 2-pack...but it doesn't obscure the fact that the word is being used without prejudice by blacks and whites...no matter how you or I feel about it.

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@Diest TKO,

Diest TKO wrote:

Quote:

No. English is my first language, I just suck at typing and I don't
always proofread my posts. I switched Internet browsers so that
I'd have a realtime spell check to help with it.
The big difference here is that if I have a post that confuses someone it was unintentional,
you put effort into making yours hard to understand.
T
K
O

Against the chance that u actually BELIEVE that,
let me assure u that it is not true that I try to make my posts "hard to understand."

Its only that I am endeavoring to call attention to chronic
long term error in English, as to its non-fonetic spelling.

I make an effort to lead by example, to abandon the error,
substituting an easier form.

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

diest, dave is the don quixote of phonetics...

(so's ya understand) Wink

(if you REALLY get his attention, he turns it off...)

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@panzade,

No, I don't disagree with you on that....well, I'll say it this way....I do agree that some people use the word not meaning anything negative or prejudice. But I also think they are doing more harm than good....on many levels.

I was actually gonna post that link earlier, after what Ebrown said...about his teen sons using the word...and wondering if it were healthy...he didn't claim to know the answer...neither do I....but I talked myself out of posting it.....and this thread isn't really about if/how/or why it's right or wrong to use the word, or even who gets to use it....it's about how to explain the word and it's meanings to a child....but I'm sure it will head that way....well it already has.

1 Reply

@Rockhead,

Rockhead wrote:

diest, dave is the don quixote of phonetics...

(so's ya understand)

(if you REALLY get his attention, he turns it off...)

U r insightful,
but my side is gonna WIN,
just out of human lethargy.

David

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@Robert Gentel,

Robert Gentel wrote:

Don't you think it's ironic that your only contributions to this thread have been idiotic nonsense about how someone else would ruin the thread with idiotic nonsense?

Finn is spot on to peg it as trolling.

Perhaps ironic.

I'm not saying I've contributed in this thread. Not yet at least. I'm just thinking about a similar thread and it's parallels. I predicted to see in this thread what I saw in that thread. For that, I can't see how it's idiotic or nonsense. At worst, I'm being pessimistic; cynical.

As I said, I set the bar low in expectations so I could be surprised. It's better to be wrong about this kind of thing. So far David has proven me wrong about the content. It could be that he has relevant input, or that he just wants to prove me wrong. I'm satisfied either way.

Finn's wrong about one thing. It's not baiting, more like bug spray. I'd rather see David post something relevant and to topic just to prove me wrong than the alternative.

T
K
O

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@2PacksAday,

...used to be easy to teach children about the hate that encompasses the word nigger...not anymore. Kids don't see overt racism like I did, or not as much. It's hard for them to relate to the Civil Rights struggle.

Blacks have managed to take the sting out of the word. Good for them. Who are white people to tell them they can't use the word in a different context?

I don't envy boomer's task and I know you don't either 2pac

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@boomerang,

It's GREAT that he's coming to you for these explanations.

REALLY great.

That he'll get to hear the words is a given.

That he's confident to bring them to you isn't.

I get lots and lots of kids who ask me about troubling words that they have felt unable to bring their parents. Often a big list.

Not that I have the answers at hand necessarily!!!!!!!!!!

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@panzade,

Quote:

all you have to do is be around anyone under 30....which I am, every day, to see that more and more teens are using it and it is not used in a negative way.I don't care what Huffington says

I bet you see that with a lot of words.....often kids today find their parents practice of banning words and general over protection stupid and kinda insulting. It is amazing what these kids will say when they don't think any adults are listening. Most of them have unlocked Internet, and the ones who don't quickly hook up with the ones that do, parents who over reach by over protecting waste their parenting mojo. My kids are all teens now, and I have always been fast to grant them freedom once they prove able to handle it.I also tell it like it is with them, very little censorship. Their friends come from different types of homes, and at some point (while they were in my house and had learned to trust that I would not rat on them) I became aware of how many of them had become superb actors in front of their parents. Kids will conform to the expected behaviour, but as they get older these kids who have been mislead by parents when young stop taking their parents lectures and opinions seriously.

1 Reply

Talking to your kid about "the n- word".

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