53
   

Guns: how much longer will it take ....

 
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 15 Jun, 2021 02:38 pm
@hightor,
hightor wrote:
They chose to compare those two firearms because of their current popularity.

I disagree. They chose to compare them with the goal of misleading people about the AR-15.


hightor wrote:
For people who know little of ballistics the effect of the 5.56 does make it "unusually" dangerous.

That is incorrect. It is just an ordinary rifle.


hightor wrote:
And, in a practical sense, the small lightweight gun fitted with a recoil-reducing stock and an extended magazine is more dangerous than a classic hunting rifle with more power because of the ease which the AR-15 can be stowed, carried, and deployed.

Classic hunting rifles can be stowed, carried, and deployed easily too.

I agree that larger magazines make a weapon more dangerous, but that is the case with any gun and is not unique to the AR-15.


hightor wrote:
But more people are killed with handguns.

OK. And?


hightor wrote:
Most departments follow that practice. State troopers as well.

Michigan state troopers have H&K MP5 submachineguns in their cars (real full auto too, not semi-auto-only).

I don't approve (not that they care what I think).

I know it is probably the most easily controlled full-auto ever made (that isn't fixed to a tripod anyway), but full auto just seems to me to be an opportunity to miss the bad guys and hit bystanders.

That is an acceptable risk in war with soldiers on a battlefield. But I think policing should require the utmost care to avoid accidentally shooting bystanders.


hightor wrote:
Part of the rationale for this is that criminals are using more powerful weapons. What was that famous shootout in California where the two criminals completely outgunned the police department?

North Hollywood bank robbery.


hightor wrote:
That was one of the catalysts for rearming municipal police departments.

True. But the the police had shotguns before that.

A blast of #1 buckshot is a different type of wound from a high velocity rifle bullet, but it actually destroys a similar amount of flesh.
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Jun, 2021 03:56 pm
@oralloy,
You don't seem to realize just how dumb your argument is. ar-15s literally tear people to shreds. arguins other long guns are equally deadly, it simply means they should be banned too. You've provided inescapable logic for banning all of them, not just ar15s. fgood work.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 15 Jun, 2021 04:07 pm
@MontereyJack,
MontereyJack wrote:
You don't seem to realize just how dumb your argument is.

That's because it's not dumb.


MontereyJack wrote:
ar-15s literally tear people to shreds.

As do most long guns.


MontereyJack wrote:
arguing other long guns are equally deadly, it simply means they should be banned too. You've provided inescapable logic for banning all of them, not just ar15s.

Not a chance. The American people will never allow you to outlaw their hunting shotguns.


MontereyJack wrote:
good work.

Of course my work is good. I'm the one who did it after all.

But thanks for the compliment.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 15 Jun, 2021 10:17 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:
MontereyJack wrote:
ar-15s literally tear people to shreds.

As do most long guns.

Here is the profile of a wound from a .357 magnum handgun.
https://web.archive.org/web/20150421182415if_/firearmstactical.com/images/Wound%20Profiles/357%20Magnum.jpg

Now here is the profile of a wound from an AR-15. And yes, it is more devastating than the handgun wound.
https://web.archive.org/web/20150216063910if_/firearmstactical.com/images/Wound%20Profiles/223%20Remington%2050gr%20JSP.jpg

Now here is the profile of a wound from a deer rifle. Notice the different scale of the ruler on the bottom. Notice also that the deer rifle produces a more devastating wound than the AR-15 does. There is a reason why deer rifles are good for deer while AR-15s are good for smaller animals. People who are shot with AR-15s are taken to the hospital. People who are shot with deer rifles are taken to the morgue.
https://web.archive.org/web/20150423081632if_/firearmstactical.com/images/Wound%20Profiles/308%20Winchester.jpg

Now here is the profile of a wound from a blast of buckshot. Notice that although it is a much different kind of wound than made by rifles, it still is much more devastating than a wound from a handgun.
https://web.archive.org/web/20150421190731if_/firearmstactical.com/images/Wound%20Profiles/12%20Gauge%20No%204%20Buckshot.jpg
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Jun, 2021 01:56 am
@oralloy,
Keep going. You're making the case for considering banning all of them stronger. and we've got an adminustration which basically owes norhing to the nra.No need to stop with the ar-15. People don't particularly want to see their kids blown aplart, you know.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 16 Jun, 2021 03:04 am
@MontereyJack,
Not a chance. You don't even have the political muscle to outlaw AR-15s. Your talk of outlawing "even more" is delusion.

You keep forgetting that America is a democracy. The American people will never permit you to outlaw their hunting shotguns.
0 Replies
 
mommabear
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 16 Jun, 2021 04:01 am
https://scontent-dfw5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/200273268_10223528931150325_6794798057392853039_n.jpg?_nc_cat=103&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=dbeb18&_nc_ohc=FO0UI2BymKsAX-Hearx&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-1.xx&oh=22fbd9fe3ed2892eafd0e02d61fe8ca6&oe=60CE2DD3
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Jun, 2021 08:46 am
@mommabear,
there are a lotople and they of those people and they have guns. that's the point that Samuel L and you miss.
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Jun, 2021 09:07 am
@MontereyJack,
should be : there are a lot of those people and they have guns.
0 Replies
 
mommabear
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 16 Jun, 2021 07:59 pm
Ever notice.... Why is it that Jack the Ripper never felt like he'd been left out of anything for not owning a gun??
RABEL222
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Jun, 2021 08:55 pm
@mommabear,
Wasn't jack the ripper a little before AK 15?
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 16 Jun, 2021 09:00 pm
@RABEL222,
That was the point. He didn't have any such weapons available to him.
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Jun, 2021 03:09 am
@oralloy,
seems to me thsat is the poiint. 1890s london had ONE jack the ripper b ecause it's hard to kill more than one person at a time with a scalpel. Now we've had close to 300 mass shootings just this year because it's so much easier to kill a bunch of people at once with an ar-15 or other semiautos. Make it easier for them and sychos will emerge.. thanks, nra.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 17 Jun, 2021 11:30 am
@MontereyJack,
The point is that it was not hard at all for Jack the Ripper to kill a huge number of people.

Sure, he did it one at a time. But that didn't prevent him from racking up a huge body count.
izzythepush
 
  3  
Reply Thu 17 Jun, 2021 11:50 am
Jack the Ripper killed five people over three years.

The NRA butchers hundreds every week.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 17 Jun, 2021 11:53 am
@izzythepush,
The NRA has not killed a single person.
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Jun, 2021 12:00 pm
@oralloy,
5 ripper murders 5 over three months is a huge number? Niic cruz killed three times that many in 4 and a half minutes in parkland with an ar15. Another of your signature stupid arguments. Riu
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 17 Jun, 2021 12:03 pm
@MontereyJack,
They'd be just as dead if he'd killed them with a knife.
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Jun, 2021 12:16 pm
@oralloy,
Monumentally stupid argument. a
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Jun, 2021 12:21 pm
@oralloy,
Liar.
0 Replies
 
 

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