57
   

Guns: how much longer will it take ....

 
 
vikorr
 
  4  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2020 05:24 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:
Ah, so my supposed demonization came from where you insist that I mean something other than what I expressly say that I mean.

I am not responsible for things that I've never said.
You've used 'axe murderer' in direct place of his name - multiple times. . Associating someone with a 'demon' is demonisation. You do not need to explicitly say they are a (or the) 'demon' (in this case 'axe murderer') to demonise them. You know this.

Hypothetically, if I had never called you racist, but used ‘racist’ in place of your name each time -you’d absolutely know I was calling you a racist. You wouldn’t think it was a figure of speech. You’d know it for what it was.

This shouldn’t need to be explained.
oralloy wrote:
You engage in childish name-calling because you are not capable of producing an intelligent argument.
Oh I think it was very well explained when I said:
vikorr wrote:
- you demonise the black guy as much as possible because you are racist (seriously - you have never defended a black guy in a conflict situation on these forums...or even expressed more than token understanding of their perspective... and you engage in severe demonisation the black participants of such discussed conflicts)
To clarify further:

- In this thread you've only demonised black guys, but while justifying everything the white people did
- you avoided any empathy with the black people, while empathising fully with the white people
- you believe only the bits of the story that are convenient to you (if the black person tells it), while believing everything the white person says
- any evidence that falls in favour of the black person, you ignore or call irrelevant, while even loose evidence in favour of the white person you focus on
- the reasonable behaviours of the black person you ignore (in the video), while the unreasonable behaviours of the white person you support (in the video)
- you come to only one conclusion - firmly in favour of the white person each and every time, even while there are other possibilities as to what occurred
- any misunderstanding falls firmly in favour of the white person

....these are all things you've expressed, and just in this thread, but there have been others on this forum in similar vein. I say on this forum – that’s all I’ve seen you do. I say that nowhere on this forum (when it comes to a conflict between black and white) have you given anything but a token form of empathy or support for a black person over a white person when there has been a conflict between the two. You've not actually tried to understand both sides on any such occasion- just one side - the white side.

This is what makes you racist – the extreme bias that you’ve engaged in towards black people in such conflicts (in all the above ways)

Quote:
She repeated the entire complaint, not just the fact that the thug had dark skin.
In fact, she repeated the other details of her complaint more times than she repeated the race of the thug who was menacing her.

On the call? Sure. Although you can’t say she gave details she kept her complain very, very vague. I'll repeat, with a few corrections that - In that video:

- she left out that he had asked her to leash her dog in the conservation area. This is fact, and biased her story.
- she did not tell 911 what the 'threat' was. This is fact, and biased her story.
- She then repeatedly kept it to a vague 'threatenning'. This is fact, and biased her story.
- she left out his reasonable tone while talking to her. This is fact, and biased her story.
- she left out telling them that he was making no move towards her. This is fact, and biased her story.
- she left out that he agreed that she should call police. This is fact, and biased her story..
- She didn't even bother properly describing him (age, height, build, clothing etc). This is fact.
- The first two times, she focused on describing him as a 'african american male'. This is fact,

That is a lot of bias she engaged in. Then:
----------------

1. I’m going to tell them that there’s an African American man threatening my life
Obersvations:
- Prior to the call, her main concern was for him to stop recording her behaviour. She didn’t ask him to stop threatening her – she asked him to stop recording her, three times.
- It is only, and immediately after he didn’t stop recording that she threaten to call the cops and say “I’m going to tell them that there’s an African American man threatening my life”
- Why switch her concern from being recorded to suddenly needing the police for a 'threat'?
- She’s exhibits a fair degree of calm for someone who’s life is being threatened
- Fight, flight, or Freeze, which comes in degrees according to the perceived ‘threat’…is quite low in this (because she is fairly calmly talking, and taking the time to call police). This Indicates no threat to life
- She keeps the description of what she ‘is going to tell them’ only to his race and gender, and a threat (without any details of how)
- Her head tilts back and forth to both shoulders – this is usually a sign of indecision or non-belief

2. She calls and says to 911 “There is a man, African American”
Observations:
- She said man, then felt the need to add ‘African American’. Why did she feel the need to add ‘African American’ – if she needed police to know the description, that is in no way helpful to identifying him…but if she thinks police are racist, there’s a racist benefit to her to say it.
- The first complaint out of her mouth is ‘he is recording me’. People usually put the information most important to them first. This is reinforced by her having already asked him 3 times to stop recording, immediately before she threatened to call police. This shows what she was the most upset at.
- The 2nd words are ‘threatening me and my dog’


3. She once again says “There is an African American man”
Observations

- Why the need to repeat African American man? 911 no doubt heard the first time.
- She once again follows this up with ‘he is recording me’. So each time she’s raised her complaints to police so far, it is the fact he is recording she places first. She has no raised it 3 times before threatening to call police, then raised it as her first complaint on talking to police, then when her complaints were raised again – raised it as her first complaint.
- ‘And threatening myself and my dog’
- Same thing. What goes first is what is most important to people. So what she is really upset at is the recording.
- She sounds more put out than threatened

4. She says “I’m being threatened by a man”
Observations:
- Actually she wasn’t being threatened. That is very clear on the video.
- Only at this point in time, after she doesn’t get her way with 911, does she go from being fairly calm to hysterical. And not in a ‘I’m being threatened way” as she claims - for she stays exactly where she is.


Her main concern was being recording. Seen by her only raising the recording as a concern (3 times) before threatening to call police (about a black man threatening her) and then on each of the first two she complains about being recorded first.
vikorr
 
  2  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2020 05:38 pm
@vikorr,
And again - 911 probably asked her the nature of the threat (what was said / how she was threatened).
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -3  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2020 05:48 pm
@vikorr,
You falsely accuse me of racism because you are incapable of presenting an intelligent argument.

https://cdn.creators.com/1054/259422/259422_image.jpg
vikorr
 
  2  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2020 09:09 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
You falsely accuse me of racism

Head in the sand response from a man who can't argue against the facts presented showing his racism....in this post.
Quote:
because you are incapable of presenting an intelligent argument.

...nor can he find rational arguments against the overwhelming arguments showing her to be racist in this same post.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2020 11:04 pm
@vikorr,
Don't be so dishonest. I've addressed all of your arguments.

Because you are not capable of responding to my points, and because you have no honor or integrity, you are falsely accusing me of racism.
vikorr
 
  2  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2020 11:33 pm
@oralloy,
Uh - actually - I raised heaps of points that you never answer.... Particular in the linked post...but there's a heap of others you never respond to.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2020 11:37 pm
@vikorr,
I answered your points until you started falsely accusing me of racism.
vikorr
 
  2  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2020 11:50 pm
@oralloy,
This was your response "You falsely accuse me of racism because you are incapable of presenting an intelligent argument."

Seems to me you've chanted a slogan while avoiding actually explaining anything.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2020 11:53 pm
@vikorr,
The explanation is pretty clear.

The reason why you falsely accuse me of racism is your inability to present an intelligent argument.

Another contributing factor is your lack of honor and integrity.
vikorr
 
  2  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 12:07 am
@oralloy,
And yet your 'response' responded to none of my points...so no explanation on your part as you claim...

...while I presented numerous intelligent arguments, which:
- contain facts at the beginning of them
- contain facts that you continue to ignore
- contain facts you make no reasonable arguments against
- and make no arguments against the conclusions...

...you just chant meaningless slogans like 'until he withdrew he was menacing her'...which is purely your opinion, and a one eyed one that enables you to ignore all your biases, all her evidenced biases, her being more concerned with him recording than the menace, and her needlessly using 'african american male three times.

Quite frankly - the only thing you've got is ' a vague threat and a guy offering a dog a treat'. From there you go into hyperbole, exaggeration, and demonisation of the black guy...while ignoring every fact to the contrary.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 02:32 am
@vikorr,
I responded to your points plenty of times before you started falsely accusing me of racism.

If you're feeling nostalgic for a response to your points, scroll back up and read the posts from before you started falsely accusing me of racism.
vikorr
 
  3  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 02:41 am
@oralloy,
You say 'falsely' because:
- you've lost the argument, and don't want to admit it (she was more worried about him recording her than any 'threat')
- you know you can't find any evidence from your posts on this forum showing you aren't racist (see below, and previous indicators).


You know that you have no posts anywhere on this forum that:
- empathise with black people who end up in conflict situations with white people
- take the black persons side over the white persons side (when there is a physical conflict between the two)
- don't try to demonise/blame the black people
- The best you've come up with is a token 'the white guy committed an offence also'...while hammering the black guy.
- etc

These are fact. You say you only deal in reality but avoid this. But of all the things you do - it is the over the top demonisation of black people, and in particular, of Mr Cooper, that is the most disturbing.


Besides of which, even prior to my saying you are racist - there are plenty of other facts you plain ignored, replying with a superficial chant of 'the menace wouldn't go away until he left'...which is purely your opinion, and one that allows you to ignore the wealth of evidence to the contrary of your opinion. Your claims are based in a desire to ignore the flaws in your own arguments.
Olivier5
 
  4  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 02:42 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

There was nothing false about her testimony. Everything that she said was the truth.

That's a bold face lie.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 03:53 am
@Olivier5,
Wrong again. Everything that I said is the truth, and everything that she said is the truth.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 03:59 am
@vikorr,
vikorr wrote:
You say 'falsely' because:

I say falsely because you are lying about me.

You are accusing me of racism because you lack the ability to make an intelligent argument, and because you lack the honor and integrity to admit it.
Olivier5
 
  2  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 04:12 am
@oralloy,
More lies.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 04:25 am
@Olivier5,
I know that reality upsets you, but no. The truth is not a lie.

Everything that I've said is true, and everything that Amy Cooper said when she called the police is true.
vikorr
 
  2  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 04:28 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
I say falsely because you are lying about me.
There is a plethora of your posts on this thread that prove it true. You say 'falsely' without any backup, because you've engaged in racism for so long, you are unable to quote from this forum to show otherwise.

Come, you say falsely, then -
- show somewhere on this forum where you've defended a black person who has been in conflict with a white person.
- show somewhere you've empathised with a black persons perspective when there has been a conflict with a white person
- show somewhere you haven't demonised the black person
- show somewhere you have considered all possibilities - including ones in the white persons favour AND ones n the black persons favour

Show something from this forum that displays you as not racist. I say you can't do it. The most I've ever seen is token admissions, while you point the vast majority of your attacks at the black person.
Quote:
you lack the ability to make an intelligent argument
Which is pure delusion on your part:
-with a plethora of facts and intelligent argument on my side (including many facts + explanations), with no exaggeration
- and superficial chants & slogans on your side (with a sole fact, and little explanation), coupled with exaggerations and demonisations.

You say you deal with reality. Start showing it.

It doesn't take much to start being unbiased - you simply consider all sides. Each side can be capable of mistakes. Not all incidents are decidable as to the rights & wrongs. Not all people who come out alive tell the truth of the matter. Many people, both black and white, will tell stories that favour themselves. You can empathise with different parts of each side. You can come to an overall conclusion that doesn't demonise one side for a misunderstanding or poor wording.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 04:35 am
@vikorr,
Repeating your childish name-calling only reinforces the fact that you are not capable of making an intelligent argument.
vikorr
 
  2  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2020 04:42 am
@oralloy,
I did say you wouldn't be able to find any posts of yours in favour of a black person (in a conflict situation with a white person). You are proving my statement.

A plethora of your posts against black people though.
 

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