Guns: how much longer will it take ....

@vikorr,

vikorr wrote:

Err. No:
- Arbery wasn't going to kill anyone

He violently attacked Travis McMichael. It's one of the cases where progressives are saying that black people should be allowed to violently attack people with impunity.

vikorr wrote:

- Cooper wasn't going to kill anyone (and those are just from the last pages of this thread)

He made a pretty vicious threat to harm a woman's pet. It's one of the cases where progressives are saying that black people should be allowed to violently attack people with impunity.

vikorr wrote:

- I recall that black guy who was murdered in Florida by a vigilante (calling himself neighbourhood watch)

Self defense is not murder. Neither is it vigilantism. Mr. Zimmerman was the captain of the neighborhood watch. It's one of the cases where progressives are saying that black people should be allowed to violently attack people with impunity.

vikorr wrote:

who hunted down a black guy who had been just been visiting his aunt that lived in the neighbourhood.

Mr. Zimmerman didn't hunt down anyone at all. Trayvon tried to murder him, and he defended himself. He is currently suing the Martin family for all of their ill-gotten gains acquired at his expense.

https://apnews.com/6d1a808562080dac2d1ca9ce3b0dd416

vikorr wrote:

- several ones with police executing black men (one I recall in particular where the officer shot the guy in the back, then took his taser out of his holster and put it in the dead victims hands. Luckily caught on camera)

That's nothing that I am familiar with. I don't recall anything like that.

vikorr wrote:

Those of course are just the ones I recall off the top of my head, though I don't think you've visited them all.

I certainly didn't visit that last one.

There's been a new case in the news today if you're interested. A new "I can't breathe" thing. It's kind of unusual in that the police department fired four police officers instantly instead of suspending them while investigating. I've not looked into it enough to formulate my own opinion.

https://apnews.com/9157e1bdc0f99797bcdc25e6f243aa19

2 Replies

@oralloy,

It's interesting that you frame the confrontations - initiated by the white people with guns, as the black people violently attacking them.

I daresay that the people defending the people who lost their lives are saying that these killers should not have been initiating an armed confrontation with innocent people (Each time, the innocent person was the black person). Also, seeing as the black guy is the one that ends up dead - he doesn't get to tell his side of the story.

Quote:

There's been a new case in the news today if you're interested. A new "I can't breathe" thing. It's kind of unusual in that the police department fired four police officers instantly instead of suspending them while investigating. I've not looked into it enough to formulate my own opinion.

There's a term called positional asphyxia. It's usually associated with the deaths of babies, but there were at one stage, several deaths in Australia related to it - in restrained adults. Some Jujitsu classes now teach about it. I presume police receive training in it - so their firing may relate to not following their training (together with the resultant death)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positional_asphyxia

Quote:

Research has suggested that restraining a person in a face-down position is likely to cause greater restriction of breathing than restraining a person face-up.[2] Multiple cases have been associated with the hogtie or hobble prone restraint position.[3][4] Many law enforcement and health personnel are now taught to avoid restraining people face-down or to do so only for a very short period of time.[1]

Risk factors which may increase the chance of death include prolonged (particularly resisted) restraint, obesity, prior cardiac or respiratory problems, and the use of illicit drugs such as cocaine.[5] Other issues in the way the subject is restrained can also increase the risk of death, for example kneeling or otherwise placing weight on the subject and particularly any type of restraint hold around the subject's neck. Research measuring the effect of restraint positions on lung function suggests that restraint which involves bending the restrained person or placing body weight on them has more effect on their breathing than face-down positioning alone.[6]

1 Reply

@vikorr,

vikorr wrote:

I daresay that the people defending the people who lost their lives are saying that these killers should not have been initiating an armed confrontation with innocent people (Each time, the innocent person was the black person).

If you are referring to the neighborhood watch case, Mr. Zimmerman did not initiate the confrontation, and Trayvon was anything but innocent.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

He was making NO threats against her dog. He only asked her to put him on a leash, as the park rules required.He was a birder and illegally unleashed dokgs, in area where they are supposed to be leashed play hell with birds. He was right.. She was a jerk. She deserved to be fired for it. And Zimmerman violated the rules under which neighborhood watches were constituted, in several ways. That provides no cover for his actions. That was murder too. Silencing the other person by killing him does not validate your actions.

1 Reply

@MontereyJack,

MontereyJack wrote:

He was making NO threats against her dog. He only asked her to put him on a leash, as the park rules required.

Wrong. He said he was going to do something and she wasn't going to like it, and then he tried to lure her dog away from her.

MontereyJack wrote:

She was a jerk. She deserved to be fired for it.

People do not deserve to be fired for protecting themselves from attack. She should have applied the three S's and been done with the guy.

MontereyJack wrote:

And Zimmerman violated the rules under which neighborhood watches were constituted, in several ways. That provides no cover for his actions.

Mr. Zimmerman's actions do not require cover. People have the right to defend themselves when someone attacks them, even when their attacker has black skin.

MontereyJack wrote:

That was murder too.

I know progressives want black people to be able to kill people with impunity, but no. Self defense isn't murder.

MontereyJack wrote:

Silencing the other person by killing him does not validate your actions.

Sure it does.

Shoot. Shovel. Shut-up.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Zimmerman initiated the confrontation. Trayvon following the advice of his phone friend, ran away from the creepy white guy. The creepy white guy followed him at a run into Trayvon's own backyard and according to the phone evidence, attacked him. Zimmerman initiated it and murdered Trayvon.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

As you always do, you attempt to whitewash the white persons actions and recast things so it's the black person's fault. Whatever justifications you attempt tp construct, that's racist.

1 Reply

@MontereyJack,

Pointing out facts and reality is neither whitewashing nor racist.

Facts and reality are also not "constructed" like the phony claims of progressives.

When a black person tries to murder a police officer (or the captain of the neighborhood watch), that is indeed his fault. Saying so does not recast anything.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

what you consider facts and reality are basically just your opiniopns and interpretations, rather than what an objective view oif the situation shows. She admitted she was wrong and apologized profusely. Watching the video, she is clearlky getting hysterical for no reason, and he was doing nothing except legally taping her as she melted down.

1 Reply

@MontereyJack,

Wrong. Facts and reality are facts and reality.

She had every right to be afraid after the way that thug threatened to harm her pet. If that thug had threatened one of my cats that way, I'd draw a gun on him, and shoot if he did not immediately stand down.

The way progressives bullied her into apologizing for their phony accusations shows that the best course of action when a minority attacks you is to just apply the three S's and walk away.

2 Replies

@oralloy,

Zimmerman's actions were in violation of the rules, and he forced the confrontation and gunned down Trayvon murderously. No way around that.

1 Reply

@MontereyJack,

Wrong again. Trayvon forced the confrontation.

Progressives want black people to be allowed to kill police officers (and neighborhood watch captains) with impunity, but no. Self defense isn't murder.

2 Replies

@oralloy,

That is a totally racist recasting of the situation, your usual "thug" foor example. He asked her to follow the park rulke and leash her dog. She refused. End okf story. It's on her, not on him. It's purely your own racist recasting on no evidence that he was threatening her or her dog.

1 Reply

@MontereyJack,

Progressives really hate facts and reality, but no. Pointing out facts and reality is not racist. Neither is it recasting anything.

That thug threatened to harm her dog, and she should have shot and killed him instead of calling 911, but unfortunately she wasn't carrying a gun.

0 Replies

@oralloy,

Trayvon ran away. Zimmerman chased him and forced the confrontation.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

And that is your usual racist lie about "progressives."

1 Reply

@MontereyJack,

Progressives sure do hate facts and reality. But no. Facts and reality are neither racist nor lies.

When progressives demand that police officers (and neighborhood watch captains) be prevented from defending themselves when a black person tries to murder them, it is entirely correct to condemn them for that.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Your opinnions, and that';s all they are, are neither facts nor reality. Fantasy, yes, reality, nok.

1 Reply

@MontereyJack,

Wrong again. Facts and reality are not opinions. Neither are they fantasies.

Reality remains real no matter how badly progressives dislike it.

1 Reply

@MontereyJack,

MontereyJack wrote:

Trayvon ran away. Zimmerman chased him and forced the confrontation.

Wrong again. Trayvon came up to Mr. Zimmerman and tried to murder him.

2 Replies

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