Obama..... not religious?

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It's just that historically favored progressive, or liberal, views on gay rights, women's rights, and other issuesdo not NEED to be specifically christian- the same set of values can be easily secular, yet one would NEED to be christian to gain presidency, so therefore it is plausible that he may not be christian.

And this is precisely what triggers my climb up onto the soapbox. If one states that they are a member of a certain faith, is an active member of that faith, and walks the walk of his chosen faith then that person is, in fact, a member of that faith.

I've had the same discussion with fundies who says that Catholics aren't christian so this has nothing to do with Obama, per se.

Bullshit, we can't see inside his brain. That makes belief systems sound like puppetry.

... faith has a multitude of issues connected to authenticity.

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What in there has he not followed or espoused?

Actually, JPB...

...an argument can be made that any “Christian” who condones homosexual behavior, is a hypocrite...which is equivalent to saying that the person is not really a Christian.

The Bible is unambiguous about how the god of the Bible...the god Jesus worshipped...feels about homosexual conduct. It is, in the opinion of that god...an abomination...an insult to the god.

And the opinion of the god of the Bible should matter to Christians...should it not?

So from that perspective, he is not a Christian...and quite honestly, it sounds as though you are not either.

Can we discuss this?

The journey towards equality for sexual minorities:

In 2005, the UCC became the first major Christian denomination in the U.S. to promote same-sex marriage. They confirmed this position in 2007. However, their journey to this point started in the 1970s.

John H. Thomas, General Minister and President of the UCC wrote:

"It was not an 'issue' or the alleged 'gay agenda' that caught the attention of the church. It was the presence of gay and lesbian persons in our churches, as well as their families, who began to be unwilling to be silent about their sexual orientation, and who began to say to us that it is wrong to ask our gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgender members to choose between their baptismal identity and their sexual identity. 4

During the 1970s, the General Synod commissioned a study of human sexuality. Their final report "Human Sexuality" was controversial; its support fell far short of a consensus. At about that time, many congregations engaged in the "Open and Affirming" process that usually lead to a declaration that they are open and affirming to gay, lesbian, bisexual and transsexual persons. Several hundred congregations have now taken this step.

In the early 1990s, the General Synod recommended that that candidates for ordination should not be automatically rejected on the basis of their minority sexual orientation. Committees on Ministry of the various Associations in the UCC largely followed this recommendation.

More recently, same-sex couples have approached their ministers and asked that their relationships be blessed in a formal church ritual.

John H. Thomas continues:

"Over the years the church has heard the scripture speaking in new ways. There was a time when Christians believed the Bible condoned slavery. There was a time when Christians believed the Bible prohibited women from offering certain kinds of leadership in the church. In each case a few passages were identified to 'prove' the point. But as Christians began to listen more carefully to the whole of Scripture, new insights emerged. ..."

"Not every new theological and biblical insight is true or valid. But we must recognize that interpretations change in light of new understandings, that to embrace new insights is not necessarily to abandon scripture but rather to read scripture in the light of life’s new challenges and opportunities under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. And it is to read every text in Scripture against the highest law which is the love of God and the love of neighbor." 4

"Over the years the church has heard the scripture speaking in new ways. There was a time when Christians believed the Bible condoned slavery.

There was a time when Christians believed the Bible prohibited women from offering certain kinds of leadership in the church. In each case a few passages were identified to 'prove' the point. But as Christians began to listen more carefully to the whole of Scripture, new insights emerged. ..."

"Not every new theological and biblical insight is true or valid. But we must recognize that interpretations change in light of new understandings, that to embrace new insights is not necessarily to abandon scripture but rather to read scripture in the light of life’s new challenges and opportunities under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. And it is to read every text in Scripture against the highest law which is the love of God and the love of neighbor."

I stand by my contention that any Christian who condones homosexual behavior is a hypocrite"which is equivalent to not being a Christian.

I always love it when someone not in the club decides they know more than the members about the duties and obligations of belonging.

Indeed, my experience is that most Christians know little more about Christianity than birds know about ornithology.

I always love it when someone not in the club decides they know more than the members about the duties and obligations of belonging.

Bullshit, we can't see inside his brain.

the god of the bible

Sure, we can't see inside his brain. You also don't know whether or not he really believes in the platform of the Democratic party. Maybe he just paid lip service to those values and acted according to the political platform of the Democratic party so he could get elected President.

Because, you know, a radical Islamist just couldn't get elected...

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Bullshit, we can't see inside his brain.

And yet, you refuse to judge him by his actions.

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Bullshit, we can't see inside his brain.

And yet, you refuse to judge him by his actions.

Hitler was a vegetarian.