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The Failed Presidency.

 
 
blueveinedthrobber
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 11:13 am
I have decided that we are all either too brilliant or too stupid to ever agree on anything, so let's drink.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 11:44 am
BPB, That's the best suggestion I've heard all day!
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 11:49 am
cicerone imposter wrote:
BPB, That's the best suggestion I've heard all day!


(belch) Me (belch) three!

Don't (big belch) leave withow me!

Belch!
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georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 11:51 am
It is always a pleasure to encounter Blatham in his virtuous mode.

I agree that perhaps it would be better for me to enumerate my objections to such articles point by point, rather than objecting to the posting of the article itself. My issue is that the cited articles are so one-sided and so filled with selective and inaccurate reporting and various polemics that the effort to do so would be so far out of proportion to the effort required to merely paste the article on a post here as to constitute a seriously unfair burden.

Perhaps instead I should haunt some conservative websites, copy material ( probably equally one-sided) from them and paste my own counter- posts. Would that improve the experience on this site for our participants. I doubt it. I believe that if you will consider that possibility for a moment, you may better understand my objection.

I do agree with Bi-Polar Bear that we will likely never fully agree, but propose that we continue the disputes directly, while we drink.
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 12:05 pm
I understand your objection perfectly george and addressing each article point by point has **** all to do with your qualm.

Your qualm was that some debate by way of copy and paste, expecting those who participate in their discussions to go through the tedious task of refuting what is often a screed line by line.

Informative articles are always appreciated and there are whole sites like cnn devoted to it. But here, where we come to discuss issues with each other we are often met with the debate by way of copy and paste tactics.

Thing is, anyone can read a newspaper. Anyone can copy and paste. I would suggest cnn.com and the testing forum as appropriate venues for practicing reading an article and copying it and pasting it. Here on the politics board I'd much rather hear what the participants have to say, not marvel at their copy and paste skills. Actually I don't mind if they copy and paste, as long as they don't expect it to suffice as a response in a discussion. I enjoy BBB's threads as she posts them for people to read and discuss and does not use it in a "aha, I disagree with you, read this tome and call me in the morning" way.

I really appreciate citations for factual allegations made in a discussion but copying and pasting an op-ed piece is like saying that you have nothing to stay but that you have mastered the art of copy and paste.
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timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 01:14 pm
Howdy, CdK ... glad you stopped by to join us as we get pasted. What'll it be ... BPB and I are doin' chilled shooters of 1800, but order whatever you like ... this round's on me.
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angie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 01:21 pm
It's a bit early to partake, but, hell, I'm a Red Sox fan so I guess that makes it ok.

So I'll have whatever it is that one creates with Bailey's, Khalua, and vodka. (mudslide ?)
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 02:54 pm
craven

Very few here debate by copy/paste alone, and certainly hobitbob isn't one of that few.

I don't think we disagree much here, but let's note that the negatives on the other side of this equation(posters' voices only) are easily as clear to evidence...repetition and poorly informed opinion. Those of us who read a lot, and from a relatively wide array of sources, bump into much which is relevant to the various subjects at hand, and it is really part of good citzenship to make these things available for others. I personally like the method which most of us use...a little teaser paragraph or three with a link.
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timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 03:02 pm
That earns ya an extra, there, blatham ... just have it put on my tab.
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Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 03:33 pm
Okay youse guys (and gals), cut-and-paste is one thing, but cut-and-plastered is another.
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georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 03:34 pm
I always suspected Blatham was a good citizen.
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BillW
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 04:12 pm
Even though he is one of those socialists to the north Cool Exclamation
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hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 04:44 pm
BillW wrote:
Even though he is one of those socialists to the north Cool Exclamation

You say that like its a bad thing! Wink
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timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 05:16 pm
Not all Northern Socialists are all bad ... some have a redeeming virtue or two Laughing
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 05:51 pm
"Redemption" was, in fact, my dear mother's choice for a middle name for me. But father, a Shropshire-born socialist brewer, and pessimistly hopeful for his sons, insisted on Lance..."Blimey Margaret, that's the ugliest little bugger I've ever laid eyes on. Fodder, that's what he'll end up, fodder for the bleedin' capitalist upper classes! Bloody disgrace the way things are going. Redemption! He hasn't got a hope in hell! Let's give the poor blighter a handle that at least might trick a few doxies."
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 05:54 pm
And have you "tricked a few doxies?" Wink
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 06:24 pm
The future turned out even worse than my father had feared.
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PDiddie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 06:36 pm
Speaking of failures (and I am not speaking of blatham):

Quote:
The lesson of every presidential scandal in modern American history is that it's the coverup, not the crime, that kills you. Nixon and Watergate, Reagan and Iran-contra, Clinton and Monica Lewinsky -- each president might have avoided disgrace if only he had promptly admitted his misdeeds so the country could forgive him and move on. Instead, each man dragged his drama out by telling lies that invited first disbelief, then ridicule, and eventually demands for censure.

George W. Bush is now on the verge of making the same mistake. Like Clinton, Reagan and Nixon before him, Bush's problem is that he has lied to the American people, and the question hanging over the future of his presidency is whether he will have to fess up.

Clinton and Reagan did. Reagan salvaged his presidency by giving a nationally televised Oval Office speech admitting that "my heart still tells me we didn't trade arms for hostages, but the facts show otherwise." Clinton avoided removal from office by confessing during a prime-time television speech to an "inappropriate" relationship with Lewinsky (Clinton's apology was so lame and late, however, that he still had to endure the humiliation of impeachment). Consummate politicians, both Reagan and Clinton chose to endure the temporary shame of apology in order to keep their job as the most powerful man on earth.

But George W. Bush is unlikely to swallow his pride, and that's what will bring him down. Bush seems temperamentally more akin to Richard Nixon, who held to his increasingly dubious protestations of innocence until the bitter end of Watergate and was duly driven from office. Bush is now tempting the same fate.


How Bush could save his presidency--and why he won't
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Ethel2
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 07:05 pm
Foolin those doxies into redemption...that's what he does. A socialist with a name of Lance........a redeeming virtue if I ever saw one.

And yes, GW will never fess up properly. We'll see if it tumbles him. Humpty Dumpty himself.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2003 07:36 pm
And isn't it a brain-twister when GWBush still enjoys the better than 50 percent high performance rating.
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