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Prosecutor Arrested In Sex Sting Involving 5 yr old Girl

 
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Oct, 2007 06:19 pm
A most excellent development! Precisely what I'd have recommended to him, given an opportunity. Rah, rah, rah!
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Oct, 2007 06:21 pm
I knew that would make the revenge freaks happy.


And here one of them is to gloat.


Rah rah rah indeed.

Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Oct, 2007 07:54 pm
Re: THIS JUST IN!!
bigdice67 wrote:
This just in! The coward took his life, instead of answering to his behavior.

Turning our attention away from
considerations of pedophilia,
what, exactly do u have in mind,
regarding cowardice ?

In your opinion,
what shud he have done and Y shud he have done it ?

Is the death penalty the most severe punishment ?
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Oct, 2007 07:56 pm
dlowan wrote:
I knew that would make the revenge freaks happy.


And here one of them is to gloat.


Rah rah rah indeed.

Rolling Eyes

Will u explain what u have in mind,
at greater length and greater depth of detail ?
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Oct, 2007 07:58 pm
OCCOM BILL wrote:
A most excellent development! Precisely what I'd have recommended to him, given an opportunity. Rah, rah, rah!


We 'd all be safer,
if ALL violent criminals ( e.g., robbers, burglars, murderers,
pickpockets, car thieves, etc. ) cud be convinced
to make the same decision.
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 01:18 am
dlowan wrote:
I knew that would make the revenge freaks happy.


And here one of them is to gloat.


Rah rah rah indeed.

Rolling Eyes
Revenge freak? Talk about a twisted spin. From what I read; there was no victim to avenge (thank Good). I have no way of knowing if he acted on his sick desires in the past, nor even if he would have this time. But I am very glad he removed the possibility of next time. You more enlightened folks can look down your noses at me all you wish, but I'll continue to view the self-removal of pedophiles as the single most decent thing they can do for the team. His last act was in all likelihood the most noble thing he's ever done.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 03:13 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
dlowan wrote:
I knew that would make the revenge freaks happy.


And here one of them is to gloat.


Rah rah rah indeed.

Rolling Eyes

Quote:
Revenge freak?

Revenge is a concept of great profundity; very interesting.






Quote:
I am very glad he removed the possibility of next time.

Yes.
I got pretty mad at the thieves who stole my car
from in front of my house. I tend to agree with u, Bill.

Shud this include burglars, robbers, murderers & car thieves ?







Quote:

You more enlightened folks can look down your noses at me all you wish,

I choose not to do that.



Quote:

but I'll continue to view the self-removal of pedophiles as the single most decent thing
they can do for the team. His last act was in all likelihood the most noble thing he's ever done.

Yeah; u think Gonzales missed one ?

For purposes of your post,
how r u defining " pedophiles " ?
What he did was most clearly an attempt at pedophilia; no doubt,
but on the less obvious side of the spectrum,
how far shud the definition of pedophilia extend ?


David




`
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 03:21 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
dlowan wrote:
I knew that would make the revenge freaks happy.


And here one of them is to gloat.


Rah rah rah indeed.

Rolling Eyes
Revenge freak? Talk about a twisted spin. From what I read; there was no victim to avenge (thank Good). I have no way of knowing if he acted on his sick desires in the past, nor even if he would have this time. But I am very glad he removed the possibility of next time. You more enlightened folks can look down your noses at me all you wish, but I'll continue to view the self-removal of pedophiles as the single most decent thing they can do for the team. His last act was in all likelihood the most noble thing he's ever done.


This is the oddest and, to use your word, twisted opinion you have ever offered. You would prefer suicide as a method of justice.

Joe(shall each prisoner be left alone with a length of rope?)Nation
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 07:25 am
Joe Nation wrote:
OCCOM BILL wrote:
dlowan wrote:
I knew that would make the revenge freaks happy.


And here one of them is to gloat.


Rah rah rah indeed.

Rolling Eyes
Revenge freak? Talk about a twisted spin. From what I read; there was no victim to avenge (thank Good). I have no way of knowing if he acted on his sick desires in the past, nor even if he would have this time. But I am very glad he removed the possibility of next time. You more enlightened folks can look down your noses at me all you wish, but I'll continue to view the self-removal of pedophiles as the single most decent thing they can do for the team. His last act was in all likelihood the most noble thing he's ever done.


This is the oddest and, to use your word,
twisted opinion you have ever offered.
You would prefer suicide as a method of justice.

Joe(shall each prisoner be left alone with a length of rope?)Nation

That really IS interesting.
From observation of history,
we know that a significant proportion
of criminals have attempted suicide.
Many of their attempts have succeeded.

What r the arguments pro & con ? ( no pun )
The first n most obvious: financial convenience
for the taxpayers.
The second has already been mentioned:
avoiding recidivism.

A con is that an innocent man who is depressed
over his misfortune and the calumny against his reputation
attendant to having been arrested for alleged child molestation
in the vu of his family, friends, neighbors and business associates
may move him to abort his earthly life.

Another consideration is that a man may wish to avoid
the violent sexual molestation that prisoners expect
to have visited upon them in prison after a sentence for child rape,
regardless of the guilt or innocence of the prisoner.
( I don 't know whether that is a pro or a con. )

As a nation, and as a world, our consensus has been
that capital punishment is the most severe penalty
hence, if a guilty man adopts it,
then he is accepting a more severe revenge upon himself than incarceration;
( i.e., he is not getting away with it ).
People who have unsuccessfully attempted suicide
have told us of observing hellish circumstances in retribution for that act.



Any additional pros or cons ?

Comments ?

Questions ?
0 Replies
 
bigdice67
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 07:36 am
I think I answered you question in you quoting me. Since he said in the initial contacts that he had experience in this matter, there may be victims. Those kids that he have, or have not, victimized are to be helped in psychological, or in the worst case, also medical matters. They have been robbed of their future. Let's help them have a somewhat normal adolescence, shall we?

Merriam-Webster writes
Quote:
pedophilia
One entry found for pedophilia.
Main Entry: pe·do·phil·ia
Pronunciation: "pe-d&-'fi-lE-&, 'pE-
Function: noun
Etymology: New Latin
: sexual perversion in which children are the preferred sexual object


BTW, I asked it once earlier; what should the police do to expose these freaks, and how can we help?

Sorry 'bout your car, man. Hope you had insurance.
Parents are the only insurance kids have, when used right.
0 Replies
 
eoe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 07:55 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
A most excellent development! Precisely what I'd have recommended to him, given an opportunity. Rah, rah, rah!


I'm with you OB. That's one we don't have to worry about anymore.
0 Replies
 
Robert Gentel
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 08:51 am
It's sad how ugly normally sane folk get when discussing pedophilia. Very sad. They take leave of their humanity in the very name of humanity.

What twisted irony.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 09:10 am
OmSigDAVID wrote:
dlowan wrote:
I knew that would make the revenge freaks happy.


And here one of them is to gloat.


Rah rah rah indeed.

Rolling Eyes

Will u explain what u have in mind,
at greater length and greater depth of detail ?



Huh?

I have explained it in great detail in a number of places.


Including, I would have thought, in a very succinct form on this thread.




In a nutshell, I do not believe that inflicting more torment and death is a way of solving the problem of what to do with those who act illegally and immorally towards other people.


I also believe that those who lovingly and self righteously revel in fantasies of torment and murder of those have behaved wrongly, and encourage others to engage in such fantasies, or engage in such fantasies as a group, as we see on various threads around here, are doing something very negative on a personal and societal level, and their behaviour revolts me, as it does many other people.


I don't think they are bad people, I know they are not, but I find the lack of insight and rationality and compassion in the revengeful thinking they display on this subject very ironic and actually saddening.


I agree that the concept of revenge is a very complex one, and I have been thinking of starting a thread to discuss it, but I am wanting to gather some very good quotations to spur thinking, since it is such a contentious subject.

I agree that desire for revenge is a a pretty common human impulse, just as we have many impulses that are damaging to any attempt to live in some form of sophisticated working aggregation of humans. Hence laws and justice syatems and such.


Such impulses are normal and nothing to be disturbed about...however, focusing on such impulses, and even lauding them and claiming some sort of righteousness and morality in doing so, and joining in and encouraging group fantasies about them strikes me as being a sad and harmful thing to be doing.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 09:30 am
bigdice67 wrote:


Quote:
I think I answered you question in you quoting me.

If I have been redundant: I apologize for that.
My memory is not as sharp as it used to be.



Quote:
Since he said in the initial contacts that he had experience in this matter,
there may be victims.

Yes.
In the 1970s, I attended a psychological seminar given by Nathaniel Brandon
to relieve an obsession I had with a particular young lady
who had made overtures of friendship to me, in school, years before.
Anyway, at that seminar, I met numerous young ladies who complained
of sexual abuse in their childhoods, that continued to plague them
into their adulthoods.




Quote:
Those kids that he have, or have not, victimized
are to be helped in psychological,

Yes, if thay have symptoms.
However, I can 't help but remember my own case
wherein a 17 year old girl seduced me when I was 11
and a 23 year old girl did the same thing, later that year.
I valued those experiences at the time,
and I remember them fondly.
I wud not have desired psychological treatment
for what I deemed to be my good fortune.


Quote:
or in the worst case, also medical matters.

Yes; V.D. or worse: AIDS.




Quote:
They have been robbed of their future.

Well, maybe in some cases,
but let 's not be too quick to include all children who have had sexual experiences;
( see my case set forth above ). I had a successful and happy life; I was not robbed of my future.





Quote:
Let's help them have a somewhat normal adolescence, shall we?

Do u mean from a psychiatrist ?


Let us hope that every person of any age
who complains of emotional problems or of somatic difficulties
will receive competent and successful medical assistance.





Quote:

Merriam-Webster writes
Quote:
pedophilia
One entry found for pedophilia.
Main Entry: pe·do·phil·ia
Pronunciation: "pe-d&-'fi-lE-&, 'pE-
Function: noun
Etymology: New Latin
: sexual perversion in which children are the preferred sexual object

I believe that is a very fine definition
which is of value to our discussion.

Earlier, I had hoped to garner opinions of whether
more subtle behaviors than overt rape
( e.g., conversations with children, shaking hands with them, a pat on the back, etc. )
are manifestations of pedophilia.




Quote:
BTW, I asked it once earlier;
what should the police do to expose these freaks, and how can we help?

Offhand, I don 't have any good ideas.
I do not believe in entrapment; i.e.,
I oppose the police actively enticing and encouraging the citizens to violate the law
and then pouncing on them when thay have taken the bait.
( Can u imagine the IRS doing that ? )
Probably the best thing to do is have good defensive education in the schools,
discussing the matter with children.



Quote:
Sorry 'bout your car, man. Hope you had insurance.

Thank u, Dice.
I got it back from the police.
I also have 2 cars.


Quote:

Parents are the only insurance kids have, when used right.

Parental advice ( and warning ) is very, very important.
When I lost my mother 30 some odd years ago,
the loss of her advice was among the most emotionally painful considerations.

However, when I was 8, I went to Phoenix, Arizona.
I was home alone a lot, and despite living in a peaceful neighborhood,
where I never knew of any crime, I felt ill-at-ease in defending my home,
if I ever needed to; ( I never did ).
Anyway, after a few weeks there, I won a small framed .38 revolver
in a poker game with some other kids of the area.
That began my gun collection; I thereafter lived in a sense of tranquility
David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 09:37 am
Robert Gentel wrote:
It's sad how ugly normally sane folk get when discussing pedophilia. Very sad.
They take leave of their humanity in the very name of humanity.

What twisted irony.

Welcome to the forum, Mr. Gentel.

David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 10:06 am
dlowan wrote:
OmSigDAVID wrote:
dlowan wrote:
I knew that would make the revenge freaks happy.


And here one of them is to gloat.


Rah rah rah indeed.

Rolling Eyes

Will u explain what u have in mind,
at greater length and greater depth of detail ?



Quote:
Huh?

I have explained it in great detail in a number of places.


Including, I would have thought, in a very succinct form on this thread.

Sorry to have missed it; u have my apologies.




In a nutshell, I do not believe that inflicting more torment and death
is a way of solving the problem of what to do with those who act illegally
and immorally towards other people.


Quote:
I also believe that those who lovingly and self righteously revel in
fantasies of torment and murder of those have behaved wrongly,
and encourage others to engage in such fantasies, or engage in such
fantasies as a group, as we see on various threads around here,
are doing something very negative on a personal and societal level,
and their behaviour revolts me, as it does many other people.

Well, some folks may mirror your sense of distaste.
We all have equal rights of free speech,
not just people who agree with our points of vu.







Quote:
I don't think they are bad people,
I know they are not, but I find the lack of insight and rationality and compassion
in the revengeful thinking they display on this subject very ironic and actually saddening.


I agree that the concept of revenge is a very complex one,
and I have been thinking of starting a thread to discuss it,

I hope that u will do it; sounds attractive.
I am sure that it will be welcomed.




Quote:
but I am wanting to gather some very good quotations
to spur thinking, since it is such a contentious subject.

I suggest Google.




Quote:
I agree that desire for revenge is a a pretty common human impulse,

I suspect that revenge was practiced
long b4 humans had evolved, and since then.





Quote:
just as we have many impulses that are damaging to any attempt
to live in some form of sophisticated working aggregation of humans.
Hence laws and justice syatems and such.

That addresses which impulses we shud execute
and which we shud suppress.
It can be HARD to decide,
by SEVERAL criteria.




Quote:

Such impulses are normal and nothing to be disturbed about...
however, focusing on such impulses, and even lauding them
and claiming some sort of righteousness and morality in doing so,
and joining in and encouraging group fantasies about them strikes me
as being a sad and harmful thing to be doing.

Well, u know that we all have our own individual points of vu,
not all of which r in harmony with yours.

With all respect,
I doubt the wisdom of folks fretting about the potential heckler 's veto.
As a libertarian individualist hedonist, I suggest that it is
better that all concepts compete for popularity and viability, on their own merits,
in the marketplace of ideas ( altho candor moves me to admit, that in my childhood,
I toyed with the idea of travel thru time with a Thompson S.M.G. and killing Karl Marx
before he caused any trouble ).
David

P.S.:
However, that was defensive, rather than vengeful.
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 10:06 am
The more David talks the more we get to know him.


Joe(guns and seduced into sex at 11)Nation
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 10:15 am
'Twas ever thus.

David



P.S.:
As of age 11,
I 'd already had my gun collection for 3 years.
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 10:26 am
That was why I put them in that order.

Other victims, you were a victim, you just haven't realized it yet, might have reversed the two.

Joe(Just because they were women doesn't mean they weren't pedophiles.)Nation
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Oct, 2007 10:51 am
Revenge? To my mind; writing off opinions like my own to revenge is a big lazy Strawman that makes it easier for the self-righteous apologists to demonize a perfectly rational reaction to heinous behavior. I have no desire to see pedophiles raped, brutalized or murdered. I do wish, for the good of us all, for them to be neutralized in the most effective way possible; before, during or after their first evil deed is actually done. Temporary incarceration does not accomplish this, plain and simple. Self removal has a perfect track-record for accomplishing this, so I naturally give credit where it's due.

While no expert:
I have read enough to know that child molesters tend to be serial-offenders. This means one individual tends to plague many lives, making the risk of recidivism a mighty risk indeed.

I understand that offenders tend to be former victims themselves… making it essentially similar to a communicable disease. I do not consider this an acceptable excuse for heinous behavior. I've known too many victims who haven't become perps.

The fact that the perps commit their crimes against defenseless children magnifies the heinousness of their crimes completely off the charts. When balancing individual freedom Vs. Security of society; protecting the defenseless innocent has to be the top priority. It baffles me that the supposedly enlightened ones here can so easily slide into the comforting ideal of "every life has value", while ignoring the obvious paradox created by the pedophile's desire to violate the sanctity of the most innocent among us.

In too great a percentage of cases, no matter how benevolent the intentions of the powers that be, the release of child molesters results in recidivism. While some may believe that every life has value (I don't), I cannot for the life of me understand a belief that places a greater or even equal value on the life of the victimizer than that of the innocent victim. This simply doesn't make sense.

Weep all you wish for the self-dispatched sorry excuse for a human. I will not. Rather I'll give him the props he deserves for doing the most decent thing he could have done as his final act. Revenge has NOTHING to do with it.
0 Replies
 
 

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