Stressed!!! My job may be sent out of state!!

It was just a rhetorical question.

Let me give another example. Say you applied for a job then they lowballed you with their offer, and wouldn't come up on a counter. Would it still be considered bad form to not take it?

I had this happen to me once, they came up a bit, but not enough. I should have passed but didn't because I thought I needed the job. The next time, I asked for a lot more than the original offer and they met me half way.

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OK, I see.

I'm not sure why but salaries are usually reasonable for assistant professorships. They don't really low-ball, as far as I know (maybe it happens). They vary, of course, but seems to be mostly about cost of living plus the reputation of the institution. (High cost of living plus reputable place = higher salary, low cost of living + minor place = lower salary, etc.) I think people usually know the salary within say 5-10% of what it will end up being before they apply.

At any rate, if someone applies for a postdoc or assistant professorship, is made the offer, and then turns it down, that person's going to have trouble finding another job. He or she will get a reputation as a flake.

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Soz, do academics only apply (in the U.S.) for one job per cycle?

Here they apply for several at a time - they can't possibly accept more than one. It would be odd if the turndowns were found flaky as a result.

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Right, that was my addendum last page.

sozobe wrote:

Let me amend that -- in my husband's field, it's fine to apply for several jobs and accept the best one offered. It's just not cool to apply for a job, get an offer, and then turn down the offer in the absence of anything better.

Example -- E.G. had a multi-year postdoc position. He could keep that job until it was finished, but it was expected that as he started making a reputation he could apply for jobs well before his postdoc was completed. In the earliest years, he applied for one or two jobs, that was it. (You might remember when Madison was a distinct possibility, then I think Minneapolis was the next year.) He thought long and hard about applying for each one because he knew he would have to accept if he got the offer. (He didn't.)

Then towards the end of his postdoc, he started applying for faculty jobs in earnest; he applied for several jobs at once and got several offers, of which this one was the best. He turned down some offers in favor of this one, that was fine.

Anyway, didn't mean to go on about this at length -- my main point is that I know that it CAN be a problem to apply for (one) job and then, if it is offered, turn down the offer. I don't know if that is pertinent to Linkat's situation.

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Linkat wrote:

Ok, I found a position that would be a lateral move. It would be different than my prior experiences, but related - more on the corporate side and more working as a team as opposed to heiarchy type of set up. I know one person in my position before that moved to similar position, but in a slightly different group so it is possible. I wrote her a quick email to see what sort of info I could get and the above is about what she sent me. She also said she had initially had a difficult transistion.

Should I apply - I feel a little scared - I will be going out of my comfort zone. I suppose I could to at least find out more about the position. Do you think applying and then finding out it isn't a good fit more would hamper future attempts at other positions?

As an aside - my fortune cookie last night said..."Do you see difficulty behind every opportunity, or opportunity behind every difficulty?"

Good cookie.

Like Noddy said, you've got stress no matter what. The question is, which type you want, I suppose.

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Quote:

"Do you see difficulty behind every opportunity, or opportunity behind every difficulty?

One must consider the consequences, before they act.

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Thanks sozobe (and others) - my husband is also concerned as this former peer did not come out and say anything like its great here! Usually when some one is happy with their transition, they say so. I also still have lots of time - one possible option is in a group where I do have experience - if I would move to this position I would still be in the same building so I can still drive (the other I would have to go back to taking public transportation) and as it is a more technical position for the same title I would have a promotion. The summers would be easy - which is the opposite for me now, but I would be very busy toward the end of the year. Which to me is a better option for family life balance.

I do have at the latest end of September 2008. So I was thinking of finding and gathering as much information of various areas first rather than just jump at the first thing I qualify for - that is my husband's fear at this point.

Here's another - I have a one-on-one meeting with my boss' boss' boss (3 levels above me) - some one that had a key role in deciding my fate - basically who would stay and who would go. I am concerned how I will handle it. Will I lose it and let her know how she has affected my life and my family's lives? Part of me wants to - not in a mean way, but to a straight forwarded way so she can appreciate how hard it is on everyone. I feel like I am letting her off easy by not saying anything about it. On the other hand, I was thinking of canceling and telling her I do not feel it is the right time to meet. Either way I am not sure if I will handle this as maturely and professionally as I should - it is still very personal for me.

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I was also thinking - my husband just had an incredible week at his new business and things are already looking good for this week - he has a huge catering order already. If his business were to grow, the stress of I have to find a new job will lessen.

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Congrats to your husband!

I think that your boss' boss' boss is someone who could potentially be very useful until you're settled into a new job, and not someone to antagonize. You can probably be honest but positive -- you know, "this was quite a blow for this this and this reason [practice this part, short and sweet but the most important points], but I've been getting some interest already and I'm optimistic that it will work out if I really put a lot of effort into this." You can follow that up with asking this person if he or she has any ideas for how you can find the best possible local position. Who knows, you may get a valuable lead.

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sozobe wrote:

Congrats to your husband!

I think that your boss' boss' boss is someone who could potentially be very useful until you're settled into a new job, and not someone to antagonize. You can probably be honest but positive -- you know, "this was quite a blow for this this and this reason [practice this part, short and sweet but the most important points], but I've been getting some interest already and I'm optimistic that it will work out if I really put a lot of effort into this." You can follow that up with asking this person if he or she has any ideas for how you can find the best possible local position. Who knows, you may get a valuable lead.

I know you are right - however, I still feels hurtful for me. It is very personal as it effects from family directly. My older daughter heard me talking to my mom about it and she began to cry. She likes where I work - certain types of little benefits I get like circus tickets and other family oriented stuff and she remembers when I used to work long hours - mommy is home earlier now. If it was just something that didn't have so much of an impact to my family it would be easier to handle for me. Hurting my family is what makes me angry.

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Have you considered the housing market, if you have to sell right now?

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Linkat--

Telling Your Boss Plus Three about your personal inconvenience won't change anything--except possibly her feelings towards you. The Bottom Line is going to trump your personal inconvenience every time.

Smile and smile and smile--at least until you've nailed down a job. Then you can "share" your anger.

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"Hold your dominion".

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sozobe wrote:

Congrats to your husband!

I think that your boss' boss' boss is someone who could potentially be very useful until you're settled into a new job, and not someone to antagonize. You can probably be honest but positive -- you know, "this was quite a blow for this this and this reason [practice this part, short and sweet but the most important points], but I've been getting some interest already and I'm optimistic that it will work out if I really put a lot of effort into this." You can follow that up with asking this person if he or she has any ideas for how you can find the best possible local position. Who knows, you may get a valuable lead.

I'd make the this was quite a blow part short - like a half sentence, and not explain why - as the woman may need to work on her empathic skills but you aren't the one to instruct. (This was quite a blow, but I'm....)

Or I'd skip it. Surely they know it is a blow. I'd also let her speak first (dangle...). THEN I'd figure out whether to mention it is quite a blow, human to human.

Who knows, she may be on your side and keeping her eye out for you.

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Thanks all - I will not mention anything as you all suggest, but will continue to make up lines in my head - doesn't that always make you feel better - what you would say if the outcome didn't matter.

Another thing is she also heads up our tax group and that is the group I believe I will target to get a job - I have experience and the comparable job in that job is actually one level above my current - they are staying here as it is difficult to find and hire people for that group. I wasn't initially sure if she was over that group (as I do not believe she has experience in tax), but I had it confirmed this morning.

The other issue is - her goal would be to either get me to move to Texas - ideal for the company and group so there is an experienced person there or to get me to stay until next year as a second option. We are already down by two people at my level and it is unlikely that they will be able to hire some one with the stipulation that their job will move to Texas next year (that is how they are currently recruiting for the two positions). Thus the six month retention pay they are offering.

My goal is to find a secure position at or above my current salary in this area - or if possible to have a position in RI for end of school year next year.

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Linkat--

You sound like the mistress of all potential forks of your destiny.

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They might not know about hubby's new business, or kids in school -- it's a blow for everyone but not necessarily an equal blow. And it's a good segue to getting any possible local leads.

But there is a danger of putting the boss3 on the defensive, yes, which wouldn't put her in the mood to help.

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sozobe wrote:

They might not know about hubby's new business, or kids in school -- it's a blow for everyone but not necessarily an equal blow. And it's a good segue to getting any possible local leads.

But there is a danger of putting the boss3 on the defensive, yes, which wouldn't put her in the mood to help.

Yes - she is well aware of the kids and of the business - When she first started in this department, she held a one-on-one - since then we frequently have discussed our children as she has two daughters (teens) like me.

The business as my name is on it - needed to be approved as an o-k outside activity. In conversations she is well aware that it has started and the location.

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Then I agree that positive and only positive is the way to go, since there won't be any new info for her.

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Well I'm going in now - she was in the middle of another meeting - I'll see if she is available now.

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Stressed!!! My job may be sent out of state!!

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