1
   

How long will christians take this???

 
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 04:13 pm
Pauligirl wrote:
This is your God calling for violence.
Can a "True Christian" ignore the Old Testament?
Just curious.
P


When it is convenient to their mealy-mouthed arguments, have no doubt that they will.

I note that MOAN has not yet provided her source for Sura 2, ayat 191.
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 05:13 pm
Pauligirl wrote:
your God calling for violence.
Can a "True Christian" ignore the Old Testament?
Just curious.
P


That is the other side of the cross. That is under the law. We are no longer under the law. We are under grace.

Yep, God did all of that and more. But you know what? He had the right to. He did create everything. He did make the rules. It's His ballgame. I can't help it if people can't accept it for what it is.
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 05:14 pm
Setanta wrote:
I note that MOAN has not yet provided her source for Sura 2, ayat 191.


Note all you want Setanta. The truth is, I googled it, I found it and I haven't got the foggiest idea of where it is now. So, stone me! Laughing

Go put your bait somewhere else. You won't catch any fish here!
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 05:57 pm
No bait involved, i asked you for your source so that we could judge whether or not that source was reliable. You failed to provide a source. Your entry can therefore be dismissed as unreliable.
0 Replies
 
Pauligirl
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 08:50 pm
Quote:
That is the other side of the cross. That is under the law. We are no longer under the law. We are under grace.


Setanta is right. Jesus made it very clear that he did not come to destroy the law. So how did it get changed? Paul.

Paul make the changes, thus making the religion palatable to the non-Jews he preached to around the Mediterranean. Can't have a religion without followers and I can't help but wonder how would-be converts balked when circumcision was mentioned?

First would-be Convert: "No bacon, no lobster and you want me to cut off what??'
Paul: "errr...Let me get back to ya on that".


Quote:
Yep, God did all of that and more. But you know what? He had the right to. He did create everything. He did make the rules. It's His ballgame


No, not really. Vast majority of it is fiction.

Quote:
I can't help it if people can't accept it for what it is.


Yeah. Me neither.
0 Replies
 
kate4christ03
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 09:31 pm
Quote:
Setanta is right. Jesus made it very clear that he did not come to destroy the law. So how did it get changed? Paul.


Jesus said he didnt come to destroy the law but to fulfill it..(matt 5:17)
and he did, so we dont have to...(john 8)
Paul didnt change anything. He was writing what was given to him by God and was acknowledged by the other apostles...(2peter 3:15-16)
The law was given under the first covenant...
in jeremiah (31)and zecheriah (8),God told of a time he would make a new covenant.
The new covenant was ushered in after Christ became the sacrificial lamb for the sins of the world...(john 1:29)
In this covenant we arent under the law anymore but under grace(hebrews)
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 10:02 pm
...makes sense. to me.
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 10:03 pm
Setanta wrote:
No bait involved, i asked you for your source so that we could judge whether or not that source was reliable. You failed to provide a source. Your entry can therefore be dismissed as unreliable.


Fair enough.
0 Replies
 
Pauligirl
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 10:50 pm
Here's the whole thing.
(Verse 17) 'Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfil.
(Verse 18) For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.
(Verse 19) Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
(Matthew 5:17-19 - NKJV).

Quote:
Paul didnt change anything. He was writing what was given to him by God and was acknowledged by the other apostles...(2peter 3:15-16)


Not really. James and the other apostles were not friends of Paul.

When Jesus came, many Jews wondered if he was the reincarnation of one of the prophets. Some wondered the same thing about John the Baptist. Jesus affirmed to His disciples that John the Baptist was the reincarnation of Elijah the Prophet.

The beginning of Christianity stands two figures: Jesus and Paul. Jesus is regarded by Christians as the founder of their religion, in that the events of his life comprise the foundation story of Christianity; but Paul is regarded as the great interpreter of Jesus' mission, who explained, in a way that Jesus himself never did, how Jesus' life and death fitted into a cosmic scheme of salvation, stretching from the creation of Adam to the end of time. The doctrines of Christianity come mostly from the teaching of Paul, who claimed to be a Pharisee who rejected his Judaism and converted to his vision of Christ, thereby writing or influencing most the books chosen for the New Testament. There was in fact three main early churches, those of Paul, those of the Gnostics, and the Jewish-Christians sometimes called Ebionites. (Meaning "poor men?")

Jesus' actual apostles in the gospels are often portrayed as doubters and even stupid, never quite understanding what Jesus is saying. Their importance in the origins of Christianity, are at best marginalized. For example, we find immediately after Jesus' death that the leader of the Jerusalem Church is Jesus' brother James. (Acts) In the Gospels this James has almost nothing to do with Jesus' mission only given a brief mention as one of the brothers of Jesus, who allegedly opposed Jesus during his lifetime and regarded him as a nutcase. But Acts (supposed to be a historical narrative written by Luke) tells us after Jesus' death James, a brother who had been hostile to Jesus in his lifetime, suddenly became the revered leader of His Church. Like so much else, this isn't explained. Let us remember that according to scholars all the gospels were written after Paul's writings, there are no originals.

In fact James is a subject, some Protestants in particular, wish would just go away. The most likely explanation is that the near erasure of Jesus' brother James (and his other brothers) from any significant role in the gospel story is part of the downplaying of the early leaders who had been in close contact with Jesus whom regarded with great suspicion and dismay the Christological theories of Paul. Paul flaunted his brand new visions in interpretation of the Jesus whom he had never met in the flesh. The church fathers wanted the Jesus of Paul, a neoplatonic savior-god that offered salvation at no effort other than faith and through the church. They didn't want the Jesus of James, a Jew that wouldn't let them escape the Law, which held one directly responsible for their actions. James and the other apostles were in fact bitter enemies of Paul.

Jesus and his immediate followers were Pharisees who like the Zoroastrians (Persians) believed in the resurrection of the dead. (The Sadducees rejected this and were at odds with the Pharisees.) Jesus was a rabbi who probably had no intention of founding a new religion. He regarded himself as the Messiah in the normal Jewish sense of the term, i.e. a human leader who would restore the Jewish monarchy and inaugurate an era of peace, justice and prosperity (known as "the kingdom of God") for the whole world. Jesus believed himself to be the figure prophesied in the Hebrew Bible who would do all these things. He was not a militarist and did not build up an army to fight the Romans, since he believed that God would perform a great miracle to break the power of Rome. This miracle would take place on the Mount of Olives, as prophesied in the book of Zechariah. Note that Pharisee Judaism is the one that survives today.

The first followers of Jesus, under James and Peter, founded the Jerusalem Church after Jesus' death. They were called the Nazarenes, and in all their beliefs they were indistinguishable from the Pharisees, except that they believed in the resurrection of Jesus, and that Jesus was still the promised Messiah. They believed Jesus had been brought back to life after his death on the cross, and would soon come back to complete his mission of overthrowing the Romans and setting up the Messianic kingdom. The Nazarenes did not believe that Jesus had abrogated the Jewish religion, or Torah. Having known Jesus personally, they were aware that he had observed the Jewish religious law all his life and had never rebelled against it. His Sabbath cures were not against Pharisee law. The Nazarenes were themselves very observant of Jewish religious law. They practiced circumcision, did not eat the forbidden foods and showed great respect to the Temple.

The Nazarenes did not regard themselves as belonging to a new religion; their religion was Judaism. They set up synagogues of their own, but they also attended non-Nazarene synagogues on occasion, and performed the same kind of worship in their own synagogues as was practiced by all observant Jews. The Nazarenes became suspicious of Paul when they heard that he was preaching that Jesus was the founder of a new religion and that he had abrogated the Torah. After an attempt to reach an understanding with Paul, the Nazarenes (i.e. the Jerusalem Church under James and Peter) broke irrevocably with Paul and disowned him. Indeed, when Paul visited Jerusalem, Jews attacked and try to kill him. Paul is saved only by invoking his Roman citizenship, a citizenship that Jews fiercely hated in those days. Because Paul appeals to Rome, Paul is then taken to there where he undergoes a trial for his life.

Paul, not Jesus, was the founder of Christianity as a new religion which developed away from both normal Judaism and the Nazarene variety of Judaism. In this new religion, central myth was that of an atoning death of a Divine being. Belief in this sacrifice, and a mystical sharing of the death of the deity, formed the only path to salvation. Paul alone was the creator of this amalgam.

A source of information about Paul that has never been taken seriously enough is a group called the Ebionites. Their writings were suppressed by the Orthodox Church, but some of their views and traditions were preserved in the writings of their opponents, particularly in the huge "Treatise on Heresies" by Epiphanius. From this it appears that the Ebionites had a very different account to give of Paul's background and early life from that found in the New Testament and fostered by Paul himself. The Ebionites testified that Paul had no Pharisaic background or training; he was the son of Gentiles, converted to Judaism in Tarsus, came to Jerusalem when an adult, and attached himself to the High Priest as a henchman. Disappointed in his hopes of advancement, he broke with the High Priest and sought fame by founding a new religion. These accounts, while not reliable in all its details may be substantially correct. It makes far more sense of all the puzzling and contradictory features of the story of Paul than the account of the official documents of the Orthodox Church.

The Ebionites were stigmatized by the Orthodox Church as heretics who failed to understand that Jesus was a Divine person and asserted instead that he was a human being who came to inaugurate a new earthly age, as prophesied by the Jewish prophets of the Bible. Moreover, the Ebionites refused to accept the Orthodox Church doctrine derived from Paul, that Jesus abolished or abrogated the Jewish law. Instead, the Ebionites observed the law and regarded themselves as Jews. The Ebionites were not heretics, as the Church asserted, nor "re-Judaizers," as modern scholars call them, but the authentic successors of the immediate disciples and followers of Jesus, whose views and doctrines they faithfully transmitted, believing correctly that they were derived from Jesus himself. They were the same group that had earlier been called the Nazarenes, who were led by James and Peter, who had known Jesus during his lifetime, and were in a far better position to know his aims than Paul, who met Jesus only in dreams and visions. Thus the opinion held by the Ebionites about Paul is of extraordinary interest and deserves respectful consideration, instead of dismissal as 'scurrilous' propaganda -- the reaction of Christian scholars from ancient to modern times.
The Ebionites and the existence of the Jewish Church itself still haunt the churches of Paul (Protestant, Catholic, and Orthodox) to this day. The Ebionites and others were declared heretics only on the basis of the "say-so" of the church and its self-chosen counsels. God decides, not the churches.
http://www.sullivan-county.com/news/paul/je.htm

Even though it's on an atheist site, it's still interesting reading
Hyam Maccoby (1924-2004) was a British scholar, dramatist, and Orthodox Jew specializing in the study of the Jewish and Christian religious tradition. In retirement he moved to Leeds, where he held an academic position at the Centre for Jewish Studies, University of Leeds. Maccoby was widely known for his theories of the historical Jesus and the historical origins of Christianity
The Problem of Paul
excerpt from: The Mythmaker: Paul and the Invention of Christianity
by Hyam Maccoby
http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/maccoby2.htm
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 11:40 pm
Pauligirl Wrote:

Quote:
When Jesus came, many Jews wondered if he was the reincarnation of one of the prophets. Some wondered the same thing about John the Baptist. Jesus affirmed to His disciples that John the Baptist was the reincarnation of Elijah the Prophet.


Could you give book, chapter and verse for the reincarnation statement, please?
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Mar, 2007 11:44 pm
Pauligirl Wrote:

Quote:
When Jesus came, many Jews wondered if he was the reincarnation of one of the prophets. Some wondered the same thing about John the Baptist. Jesus affirmed to His disciples that John the Baptist was the reincarnation of Elijah the Prophet.


Was that supposed to be a joke? It's not funny. I do not find Christ on a cross with devil horns even slightly amusing.

Once I clicked on that site, I completely dismissed your entire post.
0 Replies
 
Cyracuz
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Mar, 2007 03:37 am
Hehe... That picture would make a cool avatar if you're the antichrist...
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Mar, 2007 05:56 am
Quote:
On this page we will quote some Scripture verses, examine them, ask some questions and make a few comments. We are not making any dogmatic conclusions, nor are we trying to set forth any changes in interpretations of the Scriptures. The purpose is to get Christians to think. The challenge is to go beyond what you have been taught and see for yourself what the Bible says.

Malachi 4:5 - Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet, before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord.

What did the Bible mean when it says that "I will send you Elijah the Prophet?" Is this a physical return? Is Elijah going to return in the same body that he had when he was here on earth? Or is it talking about his soul returning in another body? Is this talking about the reincarnation of Elijah?

Matthew 17:9-13 - And His disciples asked Him, saying, 'Why then say the scribes that Elijah must first come?' And Jesus answered and said unto them, 'Elijah truly shall first come, and restore all things. But I say unto you that Elijah is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of Man suffer of them.' Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.

Was John the Baptist the return of Elijah the prophet? It certainly seems the disciples understood that John the Baptist was the reincarnation of Elijah the prophet.

Matthew 11:13, 14 - For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John. And if ye will receive it, this is Elijah, which was to come.

Jesus made a plain statement about John the Baptist when he said he was the return of Elijah.

Luke 9:7, 8 - Now Herod the tetrarch heard of all that was done by Him; and he was perplexed, because that it was said of some, that John was risen from the dead; and of some that Elijah had appeared; and of others, that one of the old prophets was risen again. And Herod said, "John have I beheaded: but who is this of whom I hear such things?" and he desired to see Him.

Doesn't it seem that reincarnation was a common belief in Biblical days? Did Herod believe that Jesus was the return of John the Baptist? Did others believe that He was one of the prophets reincarnated?

John 9:1-3 - And as Jesus passed by, He saw a man which was blind from his birth. And His disciples asked him, saying, "Master, who did sin, this man or his parents; that he was born blind?"

This verse is very interesting in that the disciples asked a pertinent question. They said "who sinned, this man or his parents that caused him to be born blind." How could this man sin before he was born blind? Isn't it conventional Christian thinking to believe that his birth is the beginning for him? Why did they ask if he had sinned before he was born? Is it possible that he had a life before this one, and now the disciples believe he could have done something bad in a previous life and is now having to pay for it?

Matthew 16:13, 14 - When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, saying, "Whom do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?" And they said, "some say that Thou art John the Baptist; some Elijah; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets."

Again, it appears that it was a common belief in those days that personalities did re-appear in other bodily forms. Elijah and Jeremiah had lived hundreds of years before. And now the people thought that Jesus may be the return of one of them.

The purpose of this article is not to get you to change your mind, or to shoot holes in your favorite doctrines, nor to cause controversy, but to cause you to stop and consider what the Bible really says. If you really believe the Bible, then believe it all.


http://reincarnation2002.com/the_bible.htm
0 Replies
 
Pauligirl
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Mar, 2007 01:20 pm
Arella Mae wrote:
Pauligirl Wrote:

Quote:
When Jesus came, many Jews wondered if he was the reincarnation of one of the prophets. Some wondered the same thing about John the Baptist. Jesus affirmed to His disciples that John the Baptist was the reincarnation of Elijah the Prophet.


Was that supposed to be a joke? It's not funny. I do not find Christ on a cross with devil horns even slightly amusing.

Once I clicked on that site, I completely dismissed your entire post.


Look again. It's not horns, it's hair. From the fella that keeps the site:
Quote:
"I'm a Deist/Unitarian and classical liberal. I believe in reason combined with a belief in God, and I'm a lifelong evolutionist. (God and evolution are not at odds.) While I don't believe Jesus divine or God, He can serve as a moral leader and an example. In other words, being a Christian or Jew is just fine with me, I support a local Methodist Church on occasion and I'm a member of a small Jewish group. I reject radical Islam and those leftist/liberal apologists for Islam. I also strongly reject the political/social agenda of the Humanist Society and their "manifestos." I believe in personal freedom combined with personal responsibility."

Doesn't appear that he's a devil worshipping baby eater.

If you don't like the artwork, the article is here too. http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/maccoby2.htm
I don't know about you, but I find it hard to dismiss history with a wave of the hand or the click of a mouse.

P
0 Replies
 
kate4christ03
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Mar, 2007 03:19 pm
Pauligirl sorry that article is not factual and there is no proof behind any thing that guy wrote. The bible contradicts everything in that article.

first off, JEsus came to fulfill the law. How did he fulfill it? By dying for our sins. He is the sacrifical atonement to fulfill the law so that we dont have to. The second covenant didnt go into effect til he died and rose again, so of course the jews were still under the law while he was on earth. And Christ had to follow that law, while on earth, because he was perfect. But as you can see in the verses i gave in my previous post, God told of a future new covenant, which was ushered in by Christs substitutionary sacrifice. After Christ rose, christians werent under the law anymore but were under grace. Hebrews is an excellent book to go to, to get a better understanding of all this.

Quote:
The beginning of Christianity stands two figures: Jesus and Paul. Jesus is regarded by Christians as the founder of their religion, in that the events of his life comprise the foundation story of Christianity; but Paul is regarded as the great interpreter of Jesus' mission, who explained, in a way that Jesus himself never did, how Jesus' life and death fitted into a cosmic scheme of salvation, stretching from the creation of Adam to the end of time. The doctrines of Christianity come mostly from the teaching of Paul

the epistles also contain the writings of John, james peter..etc...from where we also receive doctorines.

Quote:
Jesus' actual apostles in the gospels are often portrayed as doubters and even stupid, never quite understanding what Jesus is saying. Their importance in the origins of Christianity, are at best marginalized

wrong...they were human men who werent perfect, but we see that when everyone else left him, these eleven apostles stood by him and loved him.

Quote:
In fact James is a subject, some Protestants in particular, wish would just go away. The most likely explanation is that the near erasure of Jesus' brother James (and his other brothers) from any significant role in the gospel story is part of the downplaying of the early leaders who had been in close contact with Jesus whom regarded with great suspicion and dismay the Christological theories of Paul. Paul flaunted his brand new visions in interpretation of the Jesus whom he had never met in the flesh. The church fathers wanted the Jesus of Paul, a neoplatonic savior-god that offered salvation at no effort other than faith and through the church. They didn't want the Jesus of James, a Jew that wouldn't let them escape the Law, which held one directly responsible for their actions. James and the other apostles were in fact bitter enemies of Paul.

this is totally off the wall and contradictory to the bible. In acts 15 we see Paul and James are in agreement that the gentiles dont have to be circumcised and its James' voice in the council that silences the jews that want the gentile christians under the law. Then its james that sends paul out as a missionairy. None of the epistles written by the other apostles, shows the teachings of the law.

Quote:
Jesus was a rabbi who probably had no intention of founding a new religion. He regarded himself as the Messiah in the normal Jewish sense of the term, i.e. a human leader who would restore the Jewish monarchy and inaugurate an era of peace, justice and prosperity (known as "the kingdom of God") for the whole world. Jesus believed himself to be the figure prophesied in the Hebrew Bible who would do all these things. He was not a militarist and did not build up an army to fight the Romans, since he believed that God would perform a great miracle to break the power of Rome. This miracle would take place on the Mount of Olives, as prophesied in the book of Zechariah. Note that Pharisee Judaism is the one that survives today.

the guy that wrote this obviously has never read the gospels. All throughtout the gospels Christ said he was the "IAM", he allowed men to worship him as God, he claimed the same attributes as God (all knowing and forgiving sins), He claimed to be salvation for all mankind...and i can go on and on and on .....

that whole article is silly.....if you want the truth about Jesus' life and christianity, read the bible.
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Mar, 2007 05:43 pm
Pauligirl wrote:
Look again. It's not horns, it's hair. From the fella that keeps the site:


The whole thing just proves to me that there are those that will believe anything except the Bible. That is yours and their choice to make. Hair? Rolling Eyes That's a good one. But, I did not fall off any turnip truck, wasn't born yesterday, and.....I think you get the picture.

Like Kate said, the Bible totally contradicts that site; and therefore, is nothing but lies.
0 Replies
 
mesquite
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Mar, 2007 11:28 am
Arella Mae wrote:
The whole thing just proves to me that there are those that will believe anything except the Bible. That is yours and their choice to make. Hair? Rolling Eyes That's a good one. But, I did not fall off any turnip truck, wasn't born yesterday, and.....I think you get the picture.


The picture.

http://dollnetmarket.com/jdolls/TTT2.jpg

Turnip Truck Tots[/u]
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Mar, 2007 11:36 am
Arella Mae wrote:


Once I clicked on that site, I completely dismissed your entire post.


What would you say to someone who came to your church and said something similar about the bible. Along the lines of: "I don't like how your bible said homosexuality is bad and because of that I dimiss the entire thing?"
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Mar, 2007 12:55 pm
maporsche wrote:
Arella Mae wrote:


Once I clicked on that site, I completely dismissed your entire post.


What would you say to someone who came to your church and said something similar about the bible. Along the lines of: "I don't like how your bible said homosexuality is bad and because of that I dimiss the entire thing?"


I completely dismissed that site because the Bible completely contradicts it and, therefore; it is nothing but lies and mocks and scoffs at God and the picture itself made that pretty clear to me. And that very scenario you just posted happens every single day. People try to find a reason not to believe, etc. If one has a problem with something in the Bible, I suggest they ask God about it so that He can show them the truth.

Maporsche, you or anyone else doesn't have to accept a single thing I say. You don't have to believe if you don't want to, or if you don't, etc. That is completely your choice and no one else's. Personally, I give no credence to something the Bible so strongly contradicts.
0 Replies
 
Pauligirl
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Mar, 2007 05:28 pm
There a lot of thing that contradict the bible, things that can't be dismissed.

Evidence-based reasoning of science and academia contradicts the "bare assertions" of the Bible on many fronts. Cosmology contradicts the biblical assertion that the earth is older than the sun, moon, and stars (Gen. 1:10-18). Astronomy contradicts the bible's claim that the earth is immovable (Ps. 93:1), that the sun revolves around the earth (Jos. 10:12). Paleontology and evolutionary biology contradict the creation story (Gen. 1 & 2). Geology and paleontology contradict the Bible's 6,000 year genealogical record (Lk. 3:23-38). Archaeology gives clear evidence of sites in Turkey, Egypt, and Persia existing before, during, and after the worldwide destruction of Noah's Flood (Gen. 7:4). Ornithology contradicts the Bible's claim that bats are birds (Lev. 11:13-19). Herpetology finds no evidence of talking snakes (Gen. 3: 1-5). Veterinary science finds no evidence for talking donkeys (Num. 22:28-30). Mathematical contradictions abound in the bible (Ezra 1:9-11). Geographers find errors of incorrect locations(Gal. 4:25) and distances (Acts 1:12). Physics and the Law of Gravity contradict the possibility of the ascension of human bodies from the earth (II Kg. 2:11, Acts 1:9, I Thess. 4:17).
Historians too are troubled with the Bible's Jesus story because surviving non-Christian 1st Century manuscripts give no reliable confirmation of Jesus' historicity. Of the 35 to 40 surviving writings of 1st Century Jewish, Greek, Egyptian, and Roman theologians, historians, philosophers and poets, except for a fraudulent three sentence entry in the Jewish historian Josephus' Antiquities of The Jews, 93 AD, not one single mention is found of a Jewish Messiah named Jesus of Nazareth (Mt. 4:24; Jn 21:25). In spite of these facts and multitudinous contradictions by science and academia, not to mention the multiplicity of contradictions argued amongst fundamentalist theologians, Christian fundamentalists still insist the Bible is inerrant.

Lee Salisbury, former bible-believing pastor

Aug 24, 2004,
http://www.axisoflogic.com/cgi-bin/exec/view.pl?archive=66&num=11210

And to add to the list, archaeology shows no evidence of the Exodus. Geology shows no evidence of a worldwide flood. Rabbits do not chew cud, mustard seeds are not the smallest of seeds, the moon does not produce its own light, and the earth does not have four corners


I read the bible. I just found it pretty much unbelievable as a whole. It has some good things like love one another and some horrible things like slavery. Parts of it contain genuine (verifiable) history. Parts of it doesn't.

Gone with the Wind mentions the Civil War and Atlanta, but it doesn't make Scarlet O'Hara a real person. And if you think the bible is the literal truth, then you have a problem with reality.
P
0 Replies
 
 

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