Reply Mon 25 Jun, 2007 08:35 am
What do you think? Wink
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Type: Discussion • Score: 4 • Views: 5,306 • Replies: 17
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Ragman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Jun, 2007 08:58 am
Which God are you referring to?
Montana
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Jun, 2007 09:00 am
My god doesn't. Only the ones I like Cool
0 Replies
 
IFeelFree
 
  0  
Reply Mon 25 Jun, 2007 10:55 am
The word God means different things to different people. Some people say that God is love. With the possible exception of psychopaths, I suppose everyone has experienced love.

What I think the question is really asking, has everyone experienced a benign, supportive force in their lives, to which they attribute an external all-encompassing presence or intelligence? No. Does such a thing exist? It depends on who you ask. Personally, I don't think that God is external, but within. I have experienced a loving, blissful Presence that I associate with the word God. Whether others have had this experience I can't say. Has this experienced directed my life in certain beneficial ways? Most likely.
Johnjohnjohn
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 1 Sep, 2015 10:39 am
@IFeelFree,
God really means God. The father. Our creator.

Satan blinds us from the truth.
0 Replies
 
Gwyneth Elms
 
  0  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2015 12:34 pm
@Ragman,
There is only one God - he created all things and he unconditionally loves us all - so much so that he sent his only son Jesus Christ to die on a cross, not for sins he'd committed but to pay the price which a holy God required for the remission of sin - just as in the Old Testament times an animal would be sacrificed as a sin offering now Jesus has paid the price for our sin once and for all but this only applies to us as we come to him personally and receive his forgiveness. He,loves us so much that he offers us a whole new life with our sin forgiven and a place in heaven for all eternity - there's no greater love than that!
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2015 01:23 pm
@Gwyneth Elms,
Gwyneth Elms wrote:

There is only one God - he created all things and he unconditionally loves us all - so much so that he sent his only son Jesus Christ to die on a cross, not for sins he'd committed but to pay the price which a holy God required for the remission of sin - just as in the Old Testament times an animal would be sacrificed as a sin offering now Jesus has paid the price for our sin once and for all but this only applies to us as we come to him personally and receive his forgiveness. He,loves us so much that he offers us a whole new life with our sin forgiven and a place in heaven for all eternity - there's no greater love than that!


So...your god decided to forgive our sins (doing things that offend him)...but in order for him to do so, we must first torture and kill his son.

Hummm.

I would think torturing and killing his son would be one of those many, many, many things that offend him...but...

...what do I know.

Strange god.

Really tough love.

I wonder how we'd all react if someone said to us, "I will forgive the money you owe me, but only if you first torture and kill one of my kids."
Gwyneth Elms
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2015 04:10 am
@Frank Apisa,
Indeed how would we react - we would not be willing to sacrifice our sons but that was the price God was willing to pay to redeem us - God had to turn his back on his own son as that son WILLINGLY bore the sin of the whole world on the cross however on the third day God resurrected Jesus who appeared to his disciples and then ascended into heaven where he sits on the right hand of God forever and as we put our trust in him individually we come into relationship with God, our sin is forgiven and ultimately we will spend eternity in God's presence
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2015 04:13 am
@Gwyneth Elms,
Gwyneth Elms wrote:

Indeed how would we react - we would not be willing to sacrifice our sons but that was the price God was willing to pay to redeem us - God had to turn his back on his own son as that son WILLINGLY bore the sin of the whole world on the cross however on the third day God resurrected Jesus who appeared to his disciples and then ascended into heaven where he sits on the right hand of God forever and as we put our trust in him individually we come into relationship with God, our sin is forgiven and ultimately we will spend eternity in God's presence


One...there is no need for a sacrifice. That simply is something your god supposedly demanded.

Two...any person who would suggest "I will forgive your offenses against me, but first you have to torture and kill my son"...would be locked in an insane asylum.

The story is an abomination...as is the god. Anyone who would want to spend eternity with that abomination...is sick.

Get over it.
Gwyneth Elms
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2015 04:27 am
@Frank Apisa,
There was always a need for sacrifice - in Old Testament times it was animals but people's hearts were never changed - God sent Jesus to be a once and for all sacrifice for our sin that if we acknowledge him in our own lives will not only give us forgiveness of sins but will change our hearts so that there isn't the tendency to sin anymore - God is not a mere man but he is God so you cannot liken him to a man - if a person asks God to show himself to him he will do that and then that person will understand
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2015 11:17 am
@Gwyneth Elms,
Gwyneth Elms wrote:

There was always a need for sacrifice - in Old Testament times it was animals but people's hearts were never changed - God sent Jesus to be a once and for all sacrifice for our sin that if we acknowledge him in our own lives will not only give us forgiveness of sins but will change our hearts so that there isn't the tendency to sin anymore - God is not a mere man but he is God so you cannot liken him to a man - if a person asks God to show himself to him he will do that and then that person will understand


The only reason there "always was a need for sacrifice"...is because the god demanded it.

If the god did not demand "sacrifice"...it would not be needed.

A sin...is something a human being does that offends your god.

If your god wanted to forgive a human for "sinning"...the god could do it without requiring a sacrifice. (In fact, it could do it by not being "offended" by so damn many things we humans do.)

YOUR GOD apparently said it would forgive humans for their "sins"...but only if you tortured and killed its son first.

If you want to think of that as "loving"...do so.

I think it is barbaric to a comic book degree.

Want to talk about it a bit more?
onevoice
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Oct, 2015 07:24 am
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
The only reason there "always was a need for sacrifice"...is because the god demanded it.


Obedience is always better than sacrifice.

Quote:
If the god did not demand "sacrifice"...it would not be needed.


False. If not for SIN, sacrifice would not be needed.

Quote:
If your god wanted to forgive a human for "sinning"...the god could do it without requiring a sacrifice. (In fact, it could do it by not being "offended" by so damn many things we humans do.)


Frank you've got it all twisted up in that brain of yours! Oh my goodness! WE required the sacrifice... Because WE sinned. God did not sin. WE did. God did it for our benefit not our condemnation. Does sin offend Him? Of course it does. What you are failing to see here Frank is His unconditional love looks beyond that sin... beyond the offence that it causes... And sees the very purpose you were created for.

Quote:
YOUR GOD apparently said it would forgive humans for their "sins"...but only if you tortured and killed its son first.


My God sacrificed His Son to pay for our sins. Sacrificed. Do you understand that word Frank? Sacrifice. To lay something down... That is important to you... For the sake of someone else. Jesus... Sacrificed His will... For the sake of us.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Oct, 2015 07:40 am
@onevoice,
onevoice wrote:

Quote:
The only reason there "always was a need for sacrifice"...is because the god demanded it.


Obedience is always better than sacrifice.


"Obedience" the way you are using it...is delusion.

Quote:
Quote:
If the god did not demand "sacrifice"...it would not be needed.


False. If not for SIN, sacrifice would not be needed.


Sin...is a human doing something that offends your god.

Your god needs to get a grip...and stop being offended by so much.

And because we offend a god...there is no need for a sacrifice. That is something the god apparently wants.


Quote:
Quote:
If your god wanted to forgive a human for "sinning"...the god could do it without requiring a sacrifice. (In fact, it could do it by not being "offended" by so damn many things we humans do.)


Frank you've got it all twisted up in that brain of yours! Oh my goodness! WE required the sacrifice... Because WE sinned. God did not sin. WE did. God did it for our benefit not our condemnation. Does sin offend Him? Of course it does. What you are failing to see here Frank is His unconditional love looks beyond that sin... beyond the offence that it causes... And sees the very purpose you were created for.


Yeah...you sin because you offend your god.

Your god needs to get a grip on itself.

As for the god's "unconditional love"...I laughed out loud. There is absolutely nothing "unconditional" about anything your god is involved in.


Quote:
Quote:
YOUR GOD apparently said it would forgive humans for their "sins"...but only if you tortured and killed its son first.


My God sacrificed His Son to pay for our sins. Sacrificed. Do you understand that word Frank? Sacrifice. To lay something down... That is important to you... For the sake of someone else. Jesus... Sacrificed His will... For the sake of us.


The story of Jesus dying because we offended your god...is an absurdity. Get over it.

Or don't. Either way...the story is an abomination.
onevoice
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Oct, 2015 08:04 am
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
"Obedience" the way you are using it...is delusion


Really Frank? If you were to have a teenage son with a drivers license would you rather he obey the rule to ask before he takes that shiney black BMW on a joy ride with some friends, or would you rather he just hop in and ask for forgiveness later... After he crashes it?

Quote:
Sin...is a human doing something that offends your god.

Your god needs to get a grip...and stop being offended by so much.

And because we offend a god...there is no need for a sacrifice. That is something the god apparently wants.


Yep. I bet you wouldn't mind a bit if he just asked for forgiveness later. Wouldn't offend you a bit!

Quote:
As for the god's "unconditional love"...I laughed out loud. There is absolutely nothing "unconditional" about anything your god is involved in.


Just because you can't see it, and choose to believe it's not real... Does not in fact ban it from existence. Keep those blinders on Frank. They've served you well.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Oct, 2015 08:13 am
@onevoice,
onevoice wrote:

Quote:
"Obedience" the way you are using it...is delusion


Really Frank? If you were to have a teenage son with a drivers license would you rather he obey the rule to ask before he takes that shiney black BMW on a joy ride with some friends, or would you rather he just hop in and ask for forgiveness later... After he crashes it?


No I would not.

But..."obedience" the way you are using it...is delusion. In fact, it is delusion on a cosmic scale.


Quote:
Quote:
Sin...is a human doing something that offends your god.

Your god needs to get a grip...and stop being offended by so much.

And because we offend a god...there is no need for a sacrifice. That is something the god apparently wants.


Yep. I bet you wouldn't mind a bit if he just asked for forgiveness later. Wouldn't offend you a bit!


Any god who wants as much arbitrary "obedience" as your god...is a joke.

Sorry you cannot see that...but I think you are afraid to actually look.

If the god wants to be offended by everything a human does...it should not have invented humans. The god, Onevoice...IS A JOKE. The best guess that can be made about it...is that it is an invention of primitive, unsophisticated ancient Hebrews...who went way overboard.

Get over it.


Quote:
Quote:
As for the god's "unconditional love"...I laughed out loud. There is absolutely nothing "unconditional" about anything your god is involved in.


Just because you can't see it, and choose to believe it's not real... Does not in fact ban it from existence. Keep those blinders on Frank. They've served you well.


I am not the one with blinders on. You are .

Take 'em off...and look around.




onevoice
 
  2  
Reply Fri 2 Oct, 2015 08:22 am
@Frank Apisa,
We shall see. Smile
Pumnellmoo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 30 Jun, 2017 08:45 am
@onevoice,
I totally agree with you. If no words could take that blinders off, WE SHALL SEE. Questioning too much of God's wisdom, when we are mere humans.
0 Replies
 
Andyinuk
 
  1  
Reply Mon 2 Oct, 2017 09:23 pm
@Bartikus,
God Loves us all because he died for us all, that’s the measure of his love. If you reject that love, fair enough, God has done what He can for you but you’ve spurned that love. But if you do, you cannot legitimately claim to be on route to Heaven. If so urge you to reconsider and seek God out through prayer and reading the gospel of John in the bible.
0 Replies
 
 

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