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CHIRAC, SARKOZY The French Right prepares for presidentials

 
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2007 08:33 pm
nimh wrote:

Hey, you just had two of us Euros say that you'd gotten the situation right. I'd count my blessings if I were you Twisted Evil


Nimh,
After some reflection I can see that you are entirely correct. Indeed I can't recall this or anything like it happening before. Have I screwed up the only positive feedback I'm likely to get from you surly Euros?

I'll confess to getting a bit hyper indignant myself on occasion. However, overall I am the soul of warm-hearted discretion and consideration. Now I fear I may have unleashed the dogs of war.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2007 12:44 am
I'm still holding my position, george. :wink:

But, seriously, I don't bet one "old Franc" on what and how the politics of any French government will develop - they're always good for any surprise.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2007 06:19 am
georgeob1 wrote:
After some reflection I can see that you are entirely correct. Indeed I can't recall this or anything like it happening before. Have I screwed up the only positive feedback I'm likely to get from you surly Euros?

I'll confess to getting a bit hyper indignant myself on occasion. However, overall I am the soul of warm-hearted discretion and consideration. Now I fear I may have unleashed the dogs of war.

Smile
0 Replies
 
High Seas
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 May, 2007 10:07 am
Quote:
In the economic field, Europe is celebrating a growth rate of 2.5% annually; in the U.S. a similar pace is regarded as a crisis.


Quote:
The demographic problem is by now so familiar that it hardly bears restating. Mr. Laqueur notes that the average European family had five children in the 19th century; today it has fewer than two, a trend that will shrink the continent's population in the next century on a scale unprecedented in modern history.


http://www.opinionjournal.com/la/?id=110010144

The innumerate should be barred from policy recommendations - especially in the WJS!

If anyone here is inclined to sending letters to editors, pls advise this reviewer to look up "per capita" as it applies to economic data.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 May, 2007 02:30 pm
Quote:
Big win looms for French "Hyper President" Sarkozy

Thu May 31, 2007

(Reuters) - Less than a month into office, Nicolas Sarkozy is being dubbed the "hyper president" for an energetic governing style that appears set to win him a huge parliamentary majority in June legislative elections.

Since his May 6 election Sarkozy has popped up on all fronts, meeting unions and business chiefs, slapping down ministers who contradict him on policy, urging EU leaders to back his solution to an EU crisis and attacking the strong euro.

"Certainly there's a hyperactivity with Nicolas Sarkozy, that's his style," said Paul Bacot, politics professor at Lyon's Sciences Po institute. [..]

In a break with tradition, Sarkozy actively campaigned for the June 10 and 17 lower house elections this week, vowing to be the "president who governs" rather than a remote figure who leaves day-to-day matters to Prime Minister Francois Fillon.

At Tuesday's rally he vowed tax relief on mortgage interest payments for all home owners, an open put down to Public Accounts Minister Eric Woerth, who had suggested limiting it to sales agreed only after Sarkozy's election. [..]

The Socialists, in disarray since their third straight presidential defeat, say the tax break is a shameless piece of populism that hands billions of euros to the better off instead of helping the homeless and badly housed.


Yes - can I just interject that this is a really bad idea?

We have this system in Holland - you can deduct the interest to your mortgage from your taxes. It's basically a massive give-away to home-owners - eg, the top half of society. But its too hot a potato for politicians to tackle - even in the Labour Party the subject was taboo for many years, only recently has it come out in favour of striking it. Not gonna happen any time soon.

Dont go down that way!

Quote:
SARKOZY LANDSLIDE?

Sarkozy's style has gone down well with voters, and his victory has boosted consumer confidence to its highest point in more than three years in May. [..]

A TNS-Sofres survey on Thursday suggested the ruling Union for a Popular Movement (UMP) party and its allies would win 410-430 seats in the 577-member National Assembly, versus 101-142 for the main opposition Socialist Party and partners.

The conservative Le Figaro daily said Sarkozy was reaping the reward of drafting a centrist, an independent and two leftists into his cabinet, including popular Socialist Bernard Kouchner as foreign minister.

Socialists saw the appointment as an attempt to demoralize their voters. But some say the left could still confound the pundits, as defeated Socialist presidential candidate Segolene Royal came top in around 200 parliamentary constituencies.

"If the left manages to mobilize to about the same level as in the presidential election they could have a very good score," said Bacot. "It's not very likely, but on paper they have a chance."

Fillon has said any minister running for parliament, including himself, must quit if they lose, a decision that has put pressure on government number two Alain Juppe.

Royal topped the presidential poll in the seat the former prime minister is contesting in Bordeaux.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 10 Jun, 2007 02:37 pm
Preliminary results are coming in for the Parliamentary Elections today in France. It is reported that Sarkozy's party has captured about 40% of the vote with roughly 60% of the ballots counted. I don't know enough to judge what that might mean in the multi party legislature of France, but it appears to be generally consistent with the outcome in the Presidential election.

My impression is that Sarkozy has played his hand very wisely so far, particularly in reaching out for other voices in his ministerial appointments. For all you unforgiving, tough-minded and grouchy Euros out there - I would like to hear your interpretations of the elections and what it likely indicates for the future.
0 Replies
 
Francis
 
  1  
Reply Sun 10 Jun, 2007 02:48 pm
Thank you for the tough-minded and grouchy but I readily put those epithets on your selfish "righteousness"...


The proportional system in France makes it appear that the Sarkozy party is going to have about 430 representatives (deputés) on 577..

That's enough as a majority...
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 10 Jun, 2007 02:49 pm
Sarkozy certainly has done the popular things first, and is saving the unpopular ones for later.

And now he can do what he wants, with a relatively secure majority in parliament.

We'll see how madame Marianne and monsieur Jacques will react when things really start.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 10 Jun, 2007 03:15 pm
Francis wrote:
Thank you for the tough-minded and grouchy but I readily put those epithets on your selfish "righteousness"...


The proportional system in France makes it appear that the Sarkozy party is going to have about 430 representatives (deputés) on 577..

That's enough as a majority...


Thank you - for the warm-hearted and agreeable. 430 out of 577 representatives seems a large majority for the 40% of the popular vote - as was reported here. Frankly the reporting we get here seems to consistently miss the essential points. That, in part, is why I asked. A 75% share of the parliamentary vote is certainly a dominant majority - leading me to suspect that the greatest political dangers facing Sarkozy now might be those of hubris among his most ardent supporters and failed expectations among the people.

You are being unkind, Francis. While I may well be selfish and (shudder) self-righteous (though I really don't think so) I do not believe I have revealed those qualities here. I'll concede I have a particular point of view and that I argue for it frequently. However, that is not the same thing as intolerance or personal judgement on those who disagree with me. Hell, I even like Walter, and he is a thoroughly unrepentant Social Democrat.

You Euros really are a difficult lot. :wink:
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 10 Jun, 2007 07:35 pm
I might be an unrepentant Social Democrat ..... but we've got one cabinet minister more than the conservatives in our government Laughing
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georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 10 Jun, 2007 07:38 pm
Quod Erat Demonstratum
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Jun, 2007 04:55 am
Embarrassed

My mathematics are on vacation as well while I'm here in the USA
0 Replies
 
Francis
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Jun, 2007 09:36 am
georgeob1 wrote:
For all you unforgiving, tough-minded and grouchy Euros out there - I would like to hear your interpretations of the elections and what it likely indicates for the future.


georgeob1 wrote:
However, that is not the same thing as... personal judgement on those who disagree with me. .


No? What is it, then?
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Jun, 2007 10:00 am
I was keeping the light-hearted spirit of Nimh's earlier comment alive.

Besides - a little hypocrisy among friends can be a good thing.
0 Replies
 
Francis
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Jun, 2007 10:49 am
georgeob1 wrote:
a little...


Ok, I will not take it as an euphemism (my friend)!
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2007 04:50 pm
georgeob1 wrote:
430 out of 577 representatives seems a large majority for the 40% of the popular vote - as was reported here.

The district system in France leads to vagaries of unrepresentativeness that put even those of the UK in the shadow...

Yes, according to the Le Monde election map, Sarkozy's UMP and allies received 42,3% of the vote - and yet it is predicted (by Le Figaro) to get about three-quarters of the seats in parliament (405-445 seats out of a total of 577).

Bayrou's Democratic Movement, on the other hand, got about 7% of the vote and yet is estimated to win 1-4 seats - or less than 1% of the parliamentary vote.

None of this is new. Last time round, the UMP got 62% of the seats, after winning just 33% of the first-round vote. And in 1993, the last time that the right won as big as it has now, the Gaullist RPR and liberal UDF together won 472 seats, which amounted to a parliamentary majority of over 80% - even though their pooled first-round vote had been no more than 40,0%.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2007 05:08 pm
did you see Sarkozy (not) drunk? very funny...for a sober guy of course
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2007 05:19 pm
nimh wrote:
None of this is new. Last time round, the UMP got 62% of the seats, after winning just 33% of the first-round vote. And in 1993, the last time that the right won as big as it has now, the Gaullist RPR and liberal UDF together won 472 seats, which amounted to a parliamentary majority of over 80% - even though their pooled first-round vote had been no more than 40,0%.

This makes the changes from election to election seem much larger than they actually are, in terms of voter preference.

This year's "blue wave" for Sarkozy and his allies is certainly impressive. But almost all of it has come at the expense of the Front National, which has done spectacularly badly, with less than 5% of the vote. That's the worst result it's gotten since 1981 - at every election since, the FN had received 10-15%.

Consider this: the pooled vote for the rightwing parties - using the Wikipedia page now, which has more detailed info - is this time round 51,1%. That is not actually very impressive at all. Back in 1997, when the right lost its parliamentary majority to Jospin's "pluralist left", the combined rightwing parties received 51,5%.

In fact, it is considerably less than what the rightwing parties received in previous "blue waves". In 1993, the right polled 56,6% of the vote. And last time round, in 2002, the right actually pooled 57,7%.

All this suggests that while Sarkozy's UMP may have benefited from the implosion of the National Front, the right overall hemmoraged votes to Bayrou's reinvented centrist force MoDem. MoDem must have pulled most all of its 8% from the right.

That leaves the support of the leftwing parties relatively stable - despite the howls of despair among Socialist partisans, who are already set to be at its each others throats over the defeat. The left's total of 39,8% in these elections is definitely very weak. But it's pretty much in line with the 41,3% of 2002 and the 39,9% of 1993. Only in 1997 did the left do noticeably better, with 47,0%.
0 Replies
 
Francis
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Jun, 2007 12:43 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
they're always good for any surprise.



Well, the surprises begin: The majority is not as overwhelming as it seemed...
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Jun, 2007 12:51 pm
Pleas elaborate. Nothing on this reported here. Are the final numbers different from thiose posted above?
0 Replies
 
 

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