PARENTS BRINGING UP A SPOILED GENERATION!

What I mean is,children do need disciplence(sp?) and boundaries.

They should be taught social skills(I understand some children turn up at school,unable to do their shoelaces!),schools were not set up to be a substitue for parenting, either to be nursaries(sp?) for one's children.

When they grow up,they can't be tired when they work,nor have serious health problems because of their snacking.

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I just wish so many kids I work with were brought up rather differently. <sigh> There is so much me! me! me! & so little sense of being part of a broader community, a bigger picture. Many wouldn't question whether their own particular needs & wants are not necessarily the be-all & end-all. That there are other things, other people to be considered, too, sometimes. And I don't think this is entirely the fault of parents. This is a very self indulgent, instant gratification type of society we live in. We're all encouraged to be like that by the media, advertising interests, etc .... I really admire parents who are able to instill some sense of communal consciousness in their children. Some awareness of the needs of others & how an individual's actions could impact on others. It must take so much commitment to achieve that in spite of the pressures! Hats off to those parents!

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Recently I had a talk with a friend's daughter, she's 13 years old, and just lost her virginity to a 17 year old boy.

I have told her mother...repeatedly for months..., "If YOU DON'T HAVE A TALK with HER SOON, your going to be a GRANDMOTHER!

The mother...was in denial, didn't want to have the "talk", and did everything in her power to avoid it.

"She's not having sex!"
"She's 13!"
"She wouldn't do that!"
"I know my daughter, she isn't going to have sex!"

Ok.... Shocked

"Uhhummm, well I hope your right! But I would still have this talk with her for numerous reasons. Its past time...."

Can we all say..."WRONG WAY TO HANDLE THIS SITUATION?"

(Long story..and I know, it was probably none of my business, but mother tells me about 99% of the happenings in her house...so if she didn't want my opinion, than don't share with me, don't ask me for it!)

So...this goes on for months, till the mother caught the daughter missing one night, she found her on the ROOF...with her cell phone in hand, and the boyfriend driving up the drive way......(UHHUMMM Shocked

Can we say...BEAT THAT ASS?")

The mother gave me the opportunity to talk to the daughter... I explained to her that her every action had consquences, no matter what they were. That if she chose to loose her virginity, no one could stop her, but to be aware of the pitfalls to it. And SO ON.....and what consquences she was to endure from her actions would not only involve her, but the boyfriend, his family and of course...her mother.

About two hours later, to the mothers shocked and hurt heart, recieved a text message from the daughter, who told her via her cell phone that she had lost her virginity to her boyfriend!!!

So what I'm getting at is this:

We have to raise our children with teachings of respect, set boundaries, discipline and praise. And teach them that every aspect of their life, no matter what it is, there is consquences to every action they make. That it doesn't just involve or affect ME ME Me, its everyone....they are linked too.

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You know what I think it comes down to? No? Too bad.

Kids who don't get enough one-on-one attention from fully-grown human beings. Not all is the parents fault necessarily - but if you choose to have a kid (people it is a choice!) then it is your job to make sure the kid gets what they need. And that includes: finding healthy hobbies, learning how to eat, providing decent food, limiting media to protect their mental health, being there to talk to them and to show that someone cares about them as human beings, etc.

It does bother me to see kids who become brats. It makes me sad. It can't be fun being a brat, really.

What I see in my life is a lot of people who are falling through the world without anyone truly caring about them - not bc all these parents/others are plain mean, but bc they don't know who in the hell they are either.

I agree with msolga. Huge kudos to any parent who can do it. We need more. And any person who is not the childs parent - but who steps up to the plate and helps the kid out.

Love the story, makemeshiver lol. 'umm, can we say BEAT THAT ASS'. lol. Would be doing the kid a favor so he doesn't end up having to pay child support.

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Does anyone believe that a parent can adore a child so much that they can't say no to them, even when they should?

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eoe wrote:

Does anyone believe that a parent can adore a child so much that they can't say no to them, even when they should?

Of course they can, eoe! A couple of friends of mine did exactly that & their 2 children are now two very self-centred adults who still constantly run to mum & dad for resolution of their problems. (particularly when this involves money! :wink: ) It is like they've never grown up.

Then again, there are parents who can't say no because it's just too darn much time & trouble to argue why yes is not such a great idea! "Here's what you want. Now just go away!"

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Bravo makemeshiver! I completely agree with you (and many others who have spoken up here). Too many parents are relying on the school systems (and TV apparently) to do the raising for them and they are just meant to be the "providers".

"I supply you with a roof over your head and food on the table everything else you need you should get from school, what the hell do I pay all those taxes for!"

I have actually heard a parent say this, not to their child (although she was standing right there) but to her school counselor. I found out later it was problem with the girl being caught in a sexual nature with a boy on campus.

My mother is a security guard at a Junior High and some of the stories she tells me truly frighten me about ever sending any child I may have to a public school. The worst part isn't that the kids are 'bad' as it is that the parents have never instilled ANY sense of responsibility or respect for others in their children and the fact that they also seem completely barren of it themselves. To make it even worse they (parents) have made it so that no one else can help correct these deficiencies away from the home by stripping teachers of any authority in their own classrooms.

Oh, I could go on forever so I'll just end this with a quote from a bumper sticker I once saw:

"MORE PARENTS! LESS PEOPLE WITH KIDS!!!"

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I'm also interested in the notion that parents & children are somehow "equals". That a child has as much right to an equal say about what happens within the family as the parents. Not just about things like what television program are we going to watch, but really important decisions that IMHO children would simply not have the life experience or wisdom to fully understand the possible repercussions of.

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Quote:

Kids who don't get enough one-on-one attention from fully-grown human beings. Not all is the parents fault necessarily - but if you choose to have a kid (people it is a choice!) then it is your job to make sure the kid gets what they need. And that includes: finding healthy hobbies, learning how to eat, providing decent food, limiting media to protect their mental health, being there to talk to them and to show that someone cares about them as human beings, etc

AMEN FLUSHD!!!!

I get so sick and tired of watching woman spit kids out to give them away. It makes me SICK. Your adult enough to play, but your not adult enough to tend the the child that you create with another human? No excuses!

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Love the story, makemeshiver lol. 'umm, can we say BEAT THAT ASS'. lol. Would be doing the kid a favor so he doesn't end up having to pay child support.

Umm, if I'm not mistaken, in Arkansas...the mother can push the issue and have him charged with statutory rape....

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Too many parents are relying on the school systems (and TV apparently) to do the raising for them and they are just meant to be the "providers".

Yes...Aldistar, they are. Thats why I push sports...more SPORTS..and MORE SPORTS! WE all are involved in that area of my childrens lives!

~~~~~~~~

I have actually witnessed parents drive by the ball field, drop off the child and ask the coach.."What time is practice over?" Then load up, drive off.

~~~~~~~~~

I actually witnessed one woman, who'd I'd like to pummel......drop off three children one Sat. Morning,....these kids unbeknownst to myself at the time had been left alone, kept coming up and asking for drinks, food....

So finally, I questioned her, "Where is your mother?"

"She dropped us off this morning"..

"What time?"

"About 8, John has ball practice at noon, and I have it at three, she said she would send someone to pick us up around 5 or so...."

Shocked

She left those three children on that ball field in the HOT summer time with no food, no drinks...no adult whatsoever to be found..and expected them to sit there for 9 hours!!!! 9 hours!!!!

The ball field is 15 miles from one town, 20 from another, and about 18 to the only other town available. It sits out on a highway...inbetween all three towns, but we left those kids there?? July in Arkansas isn't pretty....no supervision...nothing!

Yes, I called DHS........and threatened to whoop her ass all in the same day! I still don't like that flamin' huzzy...and her day is coming....

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I'm also interested in the notion that parents & children are somehow "equals".

Ohhh yeah...that works well doesn't it? lol
I know of one that does that also. Drives me crazy to think that she condones her 18 year old sons drinking and driving. She buys him the alcohol.......Not to count, he ended up with a STD, and she thinks its funny. Shocked

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Quote:

My mother is a security guard at a Junior High and some of the stories she tells me truly frighten me about ever sending any child I may have to a public school. The worst part isn't that the kids are 'bad' as it is that the parents have never instilled ANY sense of responsibility or respect for others in their children and the fact that they also seem completely barren of it themselves. To make it even worse they (parents) have made it so that no one else can help correct these deficiencies away from the home by stripping teachers of any authority in their own classrooms.

Whatever happened to just going to school? To learn? Maybe stick bubblegum in a kids hair?

At our local school, K-12 there is probably, ummm 1200 students. And we have actual Sheriff's Deputies working there....

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To make it even worse they (parents) have made it so that no one else can help correct these deficiencies away from the home by stripping teachers of any authority in their own classrooms.

Yep! And its ashame, use too, they'd beat your ass then send ya home. Nowadays, they have to worry about some hatred lil **** , and the parents running to yank up a lawyer to sue!

About two weeks ago, they had the 8th graders take a confidential survey, and 7 of them admitted to trying cocaine, another handful admitted to smoking pot frequently, drinking, sex...it was all covered.

(probably 80...8th grade students)

My kids understand that we signed that waiver at the school...they can and will be paddled if needed, without having to call me first. And secondly, if they cause a disruption in the classroom/ playground...and are placed into any kind of trouble, they are punished when they get home. No questions about it....done deal! My kids will use their manners, show respect to the teachers and her authority and will not question it.

Of they can get their asses beat when they get home....lol Well, maybe not their asses beat, but they get enough things taken away, they'd wish it was a quicker sentencing method....just git-er-done.

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Go on MMS, beat those little asses. You pushed them out, they're yours 'til out from under your roof.

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Many of the parents I meet are well meaning towards their kids but they don't know when or how to draw the line. Many of my friends, my own parents sometimes do not agree with my style of parenting - no raising voices, no spanking and no forcing. But when they visit us, they will be the first to say, wow he cleans up the room without being asked. Wow how come he is not a picky eater. Wow he sets up the dinner table. Wow he never throws tantrum. Wow he cleans up the mess after himself.. They think he was born that way and has nothing to with my style of parenting.

No parent wants to have a spoilt child. Every parent is proud when their kids are talked about in a good way among their friends, teachers and social circle. The problem lies with their inability to understand what they can do in order to make that happen and not raise a confused child. Let me tell 2 stories:

My parents were visiting me. Always around this time I see a lot of rules being broken or taken slack of by my parents. As a consequences, my son starts testing some of the boundaries. One night we all sat down together for dinner and he kept on insisting for Soda. I said "Dinner time, no soda, only water". He asked couple times and after a while started shouting for soda. All the while my Mom kept on saying "what's the harm in little soda". I told my son, if he continued his bad behaviour, he will have to leave the table and go to bed immediately. He did not stop. I carried him to his room and told him you will be here until you decide to behave yourself. My parents were shocked that I took away dinner from him. But my son, cried for somemore time, went and washed his face, came out and quietly sat down at the dinner table. He never repeated this in future. My mom still does not agree that this was the right way to treat a 4 year old.

One of my friends, believe that you need to discipline kids by hitting and scolding them. This kid (5 now) is the sweetest kid I have seen. He helps me with cleaning and setting up the table whenever he is visiting me and his mom always ask "How come you do it here but refuse to do it at home?" So now one day, we are visiting them, and he brings out a box of leggos. My son and he together formulates a new game out of that leggo. They place 5 of them side by side and attempt to make a car pass through the gap between them. Each of them gets one chance. I was impressed with the creativity of these kids and I said it aloud. Of course the father was not happy with how these kids were playing with the leggo blocks. He calls his son and says "make blocks!! that is how you are supposed to play with them, otherwise I am going to pack this off and put it back in your cupboard." I mean.. hello.. you want your kid to always do how you want to do stuff? He is a human being with a mind of his own. Let him be creative. This kid is always force fed. This kid is slapped if he does not sleep by the time he should be sleeping. This kid is always being compared with my son by his parents. This kid is forced into the water because he does not enjoy swimming and his parents want him to learn swimming. This kid has to wear what his mom decide for him. I feel sorry for this kid.

The second story is about parents having no clue at all.

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Quote:

My parents were visiting me. Always around this time I see a lot of rules being broken or taken slack of by my parents. As a consequences, my son starts testing some of the boundaries. One night we all sat down together for dinner and he kept on insisting for Soda. I said "Dinner time, no soda, only water". He asked couple times and after a while started shouting for soda. All the while my Mom kept on saying "what's the harm in little soda". I told my son, if he continued his bad behaviour, he will have to leave the table and go to bed immediately. He did not stop. I carried him to his room and told him you will be here until you decide to behave yourself. My parents were shocked that I took away dinner from him. But my son, cried for somemore time, went and washed his face, came out and quietly sat down at the dinner table. He never repeated this in future. My mom still does not agree that this was the right way to treat a 4 year old.

With it working for you, it shows that you were consistent and true to your word..no idle threats on your part, reinforcing the idea that there are boundaries/ limits not to be broken and consquences for his actions.

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So now one day, we are visiting them, and he brings out a box of leggos. My son and he together formulates a new game out of that leggo. They place 5 of them side by side and attempt to make a car pass through the gap between them. Each of them gets one chance. I was impressed with the creativity of these kids and I said it aloud. Of course the father was not happy with how these kids were playing with the leggo blocks. He calls his son and says "make blocks!! that is how you are supposed to play with them, otherwise I am going to pack this off and put it back in your cupboard."

That shows imagination on the childrens part, and none on the father, who apparently doesn't think outside the box.

He'd stroke in my home! It never ceases to amaze me at what my two boys can think up....

I can't keep anything, because it becomes hay bales, or parts to tractors, dump trucks, or make shift toys. My Cambell soup cans usually end up becoming haybales..that they tote around on tractor trailors, my hair supplies such as combs, clips, or bands become some other part to a tractor where they have "enhanced" it. And God forbid me to try to hide them, they just seek them out....

My children and their imaginations run the gamut....sometimes its scary at what they can think of.

Let me just put it this way: Trampolines and climbing deer stands don't mix at my house! Get the picture???? lol

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The whole point of Legos is to spur the imagination. I'm sure it's included in the product description on the box they come in. That's a heartbreaking story.

MMS, it sounds like you've got some real boys on your hands. As they should be.

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I agree with most all of your post this is from, Chai (if you still can remember it cos I'm behind like five pages) except this one:

Chai Tea wrote:

Sure kids need computers today..for school. Not to sit in front of for hours so they can play.if anyone claims that kids are just soaking up the knowledge of the world and need all the time some of them spend.I'll say they are full of itWe know they're spending a lot of their time downloading tunes, playing games, looking for naked people and coming on to A2K.

My nephew, he's three now. Last summer, when he couldnt even yet properly talk, he surprised the heck out of my dad and me by being able to take the mouse and use it, to make the different pictures on a website make sounds. He could also open the program (clicking on the icon) and close it. He'd properly shut down the computer if you didnt stop him ("hey I was working on that!" Razz

)

I was kinda taken aback and then I realised - this is bleedin wonderful. Cause I'm guessing that, the world he's going to grow big in, having excellent computer skills is gonna be as important as much anything else.

It doesnt really matter whether the kids - older ones, I mean ;-) - are "downloading tunes, playing games" or reviewing some educationally sound website (I mean, ultra-violent games and the like aside). Some of these games involve a hell of a lot more dexterity, tactical thinking, and yes, group interactions as they team up with other players and opponents across the web, than any game I played when I was 8.

When I was 8, my friend and I cut out newspaper pictures of Tour de France cyclists or soccer players, and we would enact entire races/games on the floor. It was brilliant. Now two 8-year olds may be doing the same on the computer. I'm guessing they learn more skills from it that they can use later than I did sitting on the floor.

Not saying that its a good thing if your kid is behind his gameboy 10 hours a day. But not allowing one's kid to sit behind the computer except for at school or for homework will have him miss out on a lot of development that other kids will have up on him when they grow up and become graphic designers, office managers, Defence ministry officials or god knows what.

There - my two cents. :wink:

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Oh yeah, 3 year old are absolutely amazing in what they know!

Actually my computer statement was more to the point that they could be doing something just as stimulating that wasn't requiring them to obtain a lard ass.

Excuse me, I have to go have a mole removed, and my dermotologist gets cranky if she has to miss her nap time.

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Lord Ellpus wrote:

ADHD is now, what we used to call naughty and mischevious. It's just, for some strange reason, there are a lot more "naughty and mischevious" kids today.

I dont believe that for a second.

I myself was a studious, nerdy kid. But when I was in primary school - the 70s - kids went tearing all over the place. Even I did. Playing soldier in the park with "guns" from pieces of treebranch, tatatatatatata!! (Now someone would tut-tut and propose a more PC game I suppose.) Climbing through the various empty lots / yards / parks / random grassfields that there were many more of then (in the name of the "condensed city" concept, most of those places have been built up now). Getting up to all kinds of stuff that parents wouldnt ever know about. Getting bumps and scratches too.

Now, kids hardly get out of the house except for scheduled activities, it seems, I hardly ever saw kids outside by themselves anymore in Holland. Specially middle-class urban and suburban kids, the "backseat kids" who are driven to playhours and various classes by their mom or dad. Otherwise, lots more time being spent inside the house (yeh behind the gameboy I suppose). In suburban America they're building these new horrid-sounding giant houses that take up an entire plot, leaving only a narrow strip where there used to be a garden or a yard - theyve been posted about here. Part of the reason is that kids dont wanna go outside anymore anyway, and even if they wanted you wouldnt let them, not by their own.

Also, mt parents generation - there'd be four, five kids in a family. No way a mother could keep an eye on all those kids all the time - "go outside and play!", and here's to hoping the elder brother will keep an eye out. Now most families only have one kid (and a half, perhaps), and he's being spent "quality time" with, and a lot more expectations are hanging on to him turning out good, smart and succesful, cause there's only the one. Now you read articles about children already suffering from stress, what with the filled agenda and all that parental quality time. It sometimes seems that benign neglect woulda been a lot more relaxing.

That bit doesnt apply in inner city families of course, but then Hackney kids werent exactly angels back in the day either.

So I dont believe for a sec that kids get to be a lot more "naughty and mischevious" nowadays.

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oh DUH!

This thread is, like, ancient!

I didnt notice cos like, I'm ADHD

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Badboy wrote:

What I mean is,children do need disciplence(sp?) and boundaries.

They should be taught social skills(I understand some children turn up at school,unable to do their shoelaces!),schools were not set up to be a substitue for parenting, either to be nursaries(sp?) for one's children.

Discipline and social skills, yeah! And spelling, also, don't forget spelling.

(Sorry, couldnt resist that one ... Laughing

Bad, nimh, bad.)

(Hey Chai :wink: )

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OK, seeing as this has been re-activated, and seems to re-cast me into the role of grumpy old sod.......

Nimh, I know this is an ancient thread, but I would just like to draw your attention to the danger of only quoting certain snippets of what was, throughout the entire thread, quite a few paragraphs from me, basically saying that CERTAIN (the very small minority, as mentioned in the original link) kids do not get adequate sleep, are not given boundaries as to what is, and what is not, acceptable behaviour, and spend far too much time in front of computers and vid games, when they should be out getting some exercise.

An earlier snippet from my posts says ......"....and as far as ADHD children are concerned, in my school there were over 1000 pupils of all ability ranges. I don't remember any of them having ADHD. A few were badly behaved, but I believe that this was because they were naturally naughty and mischevious. None of us "bounced off walls" due to being hyperactive. "

NOTE ......in that snippet, I am referring to SCHOOL behaviour. I made no reference to their rowdy behaviour when out with their mates. Every generation of kids goes out and plays with their mates after school. The types of game may differ, but the amount of energy burnt off is the same, I'll warrant. The way you presented my argument would make me seem, to anyone coming in "fresh" to this thread, that I was some sort of grumpy old bugger who wants to hang draw and quarter every human under 21.

The point I was making, was that nowadays, it is all FAR too easy to just simply diagnose a kid with ADHD, as if it was just something that was unavoidable because of some medical condition in the body that MADE them be that way.

I was saying that this is utter tosh.

I will now ask you this.

1. When you were at school, how many kids were in your year?

2. How many of those demonstrated the behaviour (whilst at school) that would now be diagnosed as ADHD?

3. Would any of your year, in your opinion, required any form of medication, in order to moderate their behaviour?

The "naughty and mischevious" part of the snippet, is basically making the point that the medical profession has now found a nice acronym to replace what would have been called a naughty and mischevious child in my day, and probably yours.

What is happening today, to this small minority of kids, is that in many cases, it is the Parents that are causing their children to behave in an unnacceptable manner at school, because they have not set them any firm behavioural boundaries, are not seeing that they get adequate sleep, and are giving them a poor diet.

Unfortunately, with this new fangled acronym'd condition, many of these kids are getting a DOUBLE raw deal, by having the handicap of being raised by uncaring parents AND having a nice little tranquiliser pill to take each day, BECAUSE of the bad parenting.

I'm not saying for one minute that ADHD doesn't exist. What I AM saying is that there are a lot of ritalin takers out there, that just needed a good Mum and Dad.

Interesting exercise.

Anyone reading this, if you feel you want to, please answer the three questions I posed to Nimh. If you have any figures re. todays numbers, all the better.

My wife's school is about the same size as the one I went to as a teenager. In her school, her average number of pupils taking ADHD medication is four per class.
Average size class is thirty. There are four classes in a "year". That means there are 16 kids in a year supposedly suffering from ADHD and taking medication as a means of controlling their behaviour.

I certainly don't remember 16 kids in my year who would have required medication to control them.

ADHD is the easy way out, IMO, rather than the hard way which would be to see how they are being raised, and address any parenting problems that may be uncovered.

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PARENTS BRINGING UP A SPOILED GENERATION!

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