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Sex Education and Applied Psychology?

 
 
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 09:59 am
This is going to be a real, real dumb sort of question here.....

It's been decades and not years since the last time I had any sort of an experience involving highschools.

I know that in theory at least they have reassonable sex education classes, which never existed in the 50s or 60s. The question is this: Do they teach any sort of a course in the theory of dating, or in what you're actually dealing with in trying to deal with women?

In other words, it's not clear that most highschool boys are going to benefit over much from understanding how women's bodies work, if they don't understand how their minds work.

Some of what I read lately strongly indicates that women are basically hardwired to respond to certain kinds of authority figures and certain kinds of behavior, and that in particular, trying to act or behave too much like a Christian, like a nice guy, or like any sort of a guy who's attended one too many political correctness or women's studies classes in front of them is basically a formula for failure.

Thus I'd be curious: what if anything do they teach on such topics?
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Acquiunk
 
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Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:25 am
Re: Sex Education and Applied Psychology?
gungasnake wrote:



Some of what I read lately strongly indicates that women are basically hardwired to respond to certain kinds of authority figures and certain kinds of behavior,


"Let such as say our sex is void of reason,
Know 'tis a slander now, but once was treason".

Ann Bradstreet (1612-1672) on Elizabeth I

The only thing cultural that humans are hardwired for is the ability to use language. Beyond that each of us is on our own. Your attitude could have cost you your head at one time.
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MinDSaY
 
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Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:28 am
Hmm your post really made me think why they don't do Psychology lessons at school.

I think its a must have subject to do and may be it can reduce bullying?
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gungasnake
 
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Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:47 am
MinDSaY wrote:
Hmm your post really made me think why they don't do Psychology lessons at school.

I think its a must have subject to do and may be it can reduce bullying?


If I were running a highschool in today's world, the curriculum would be very long on survival skills since it's entirely possible that today's teenagers could end up living in some sort of a post WW-IV world or something in which a lot of the things we take for granted simply aren't there. Some would view applied psychology as a sort of a survival skill.
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squinney
 
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Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:49 am
Many high schools do offer psychology / sociology classes as electives. They are not, that I'm aware of, tied to sex education, though some differences between the sexes are likely discussed in the soc/psych class.

That women desire an authority figure is hopefully NOT taught. It would be misinformation.

So, I'd be interested in knowing what you've been reading lately, Gungasnake.
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gungasnake
 
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Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:55 am
Re: Sex Education and Applied Psychology?
Acquiunk wrote:


The only thing cultural that humans are hardwired for is the ability to use language. Beyond that each of us is on our own. Your attitude could have cost you your head at one time.


I give women the benefit of the doubt and assume that they operate on two levels, i.e. an intellectual level not noticably different from mine and also on the hardwired biological level I mentioned. It's common knowledge that too many desirable women end up in relationships with assholes and losers and some people view that as the biological hardwiring winning out over reason in an age which puts too many impediments in front of women trying to lead biologically natural lives.
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Acquiunk
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:45 am
Re: Sex Education and Applied Psychology?
gungasnake wrote:
some people view that as the biological hardwiring winning out over reason in an age which puts too many impediments in front of women trying to lead biologically natural lives.


Your argument is exactly the same argument used to justify apartheid. That Africans are biologically incapable of meeting European cultural standards and must be separated on reservations so they could lead , as you put it, "biologically natural lives" That was tried in South Africa and didn't work, although they gave it a try for 40 years.
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ebrown p
 
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Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 12:50 pm
I am going to throw my lot in with gunga on this topic (I am pretty sure I have never done that before).

But I think the point the Gunga is making is this.

Women, especially in issues of mating, often act in ways that are very difficult to explain logically-- until you try to understand the psychology behind it.

The courtship rituals that have always been foisted on men (even the modern ones) are a good example. They are both difficult and often emotionally painful for the young suitor.

This has nothing to do with political issues such as apartheid. It is just realizing that mating rituals have developed over thousands of years are based on basic human psychology. These rituals are not equal for men and women. They are based on the emotional needs of women more than any of the needs of men (which could actually be satisfied very efficiently without courtship).

I think gunga is saying that If men have to play the game... it is only fair that they know the rules.
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parados
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 01:17 pm
Re: Sex Education and Applied Psychology?
gungasnake wrote:


In other words, it's not clear that most highschool boys are going to benefit over much from understanding how women's bodies work, if they don't understand how their minds work.

Some of what I read lately strongly indicates that women are basically hardwired to respond to certain kinds of authority figures and certain kinds of behavior, and that in particular, trying to act or behave too much like a Christian, like a nice guy, or like any sort of a guy who's attended one too many political correctness or women's studies classes in front of them is basically a formula for failure.

Thus I'd be curious: what if anything do they teach on such topics?


2 completely seperate issues here Gunga. One is the way the body works and the other is who you are attracted to. There is no class in the world that can teach young (or old) men how to attract any woman they want and keep them happy once they have them. That requres field work and a lot of trial and error. (Mostly error.) It's a life's work and most of us will probably never get beyond the basics.

I'll agree with Gunga and ebrown on this -
The sociological studies seem to point to women being hardwired to want a man that will provide for them and their children. Men seem to want to spread their genes around. Not that either sex is tied to that completely.

When it comes to what is attractive it isn't just based on hardwiring. It is based on socialization. Why do women or men want someone like "dear ole Dad" or "Just like Mom?" Probably because they are trained to think that is normal. If you are a nice guy, or a Christian, or attend too many womens studies classes doesn't preclude you from being attractive to some people. The kicker might be it isn't the types of women you are attracted to, but in the case of men does it really matter at that age?
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shewolfnm
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 01:32 pm
When I was in high school about 15 years ago, there was absolutly nothing about the psychology of dating. I guess it was still sort of 'against the rules' because NO SEX was always the lesson.
To promote or teach anything about -dating- would undermine that rule. Truthfully.. I dont even remember the subject of masturbation ever coming up either.

Our sex ed was 6 weeks and it was centered around the physical aspects of sex.
Sperm + egg = baby.
Sperm gets to the egg by ejaculation in the vagina.
very simple , basic and informative..but boring.
Much more then in the 50's yes, but I agree with the thought you are getting at Gunga.
It shouldnt be wrong to teach kids how to interact with each other on a level that deals with sexual diffrences.
By the time kids arrive in high school they are just getting over the -' Im pulling your hair because I like you '- style of behavior and trying to learn to be adults.
But in that idea comes the sexist thoughts and statements .
Women only cry.
Men only fight.

As adults we know those kinds of statements are crap. But how would you aviod such 'type casting' teaching while still addressing the large diffrences in the 2 sexes?
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ebrown p
 
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Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 01:40 pm
Quote:

When it comes to what is attractive it isn't just based on hardwiring. It is based on socialization. Why do women or men want someone like "dear ole Dad" or "Just like Mom?" Probably because they are trained to think that is normal. If you are a nice guy, or a Christian, or attend too many womens studies classes doesn't preclude you from being attractive to some people. The kicker might be it isn't the types of women you are attracted to, but in the case of men does it really matter at that age?


Females of any mammal want to find a male who can take care of, and provide for them.

I think there are three types of men that women find attractive for three different reasons, but the underlying idea is finding a man who will take care of and provide for them.

The strong man is a good defender, the caring man will help raise young, and the wealthy man can provide. Are there any other traits that are widely seen as attractive by women?
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squinney
 
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Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 02:10 pm
In Psych I (college) or at the high school level there is a study of personal interactions, discussions about cultural differences, and other topics that would, if allowed or encouraged, lead to discussions of differences in hardwiring v. upbringing as you suggest, gunga.

I remember watching videos and reading about Jane Goodall and her work with primates. We compared their behavior to that of humans. We learned about societal hierarchies,both human and within the animal kingdom at large, nature verses nurture, how it is likely that one will choose a mate unkowingly based on your own parent of the opposite sex even if you insist you can't stand that parent and would never do such a thing, etc. We were also introduced to studies that show what women and men look for in mates, including that woman look for protection and being provided for. But, it certainly wasn't tied into sex education.

In general, I found my soc /psych studies to be more of an exploration of possibilities than a study of absolutes. A course or lesson plan based on what you are suggesting might be part of one or all of the topics above, but might seem a little closed minded for those that know there are way more considerations and factors than just the hardwiring.
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arji
 
  1  
Reply Sat 15 Oct, 2005 05:42 pm
I find that it is the job of schools to relay facts, and the job of parents to relay social skills. But I could be wrong.

I learned ZERO social skills in high school.

Just my opinion ...
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