More info on herpes.........
For info on both HSV 1 and 2, complications in health of those affected and complications in pregnancy and childbirth, and some stats on emotional effects of herpes.....
NYM
Here's a nice concise bit of writing in whcih it is explained that oral herpes can infect the reproductive area (last paragraph, cj).
Quote:Risk Factors
Everyone is at risk for herpes simplex virus. In fact, HSV-1 infects more than 85% of the world's population, although the risk varies by region. Still, a national survey that analyzed data from 1988 to 1994 found that 73% of Americans over 12 years old have evidence of infection with either form of the herpes virus. Just over half were infected only with HSV-1, 5% only with HSV-2, and almost 17% with both. Infection is lifelong, so once a person is infected he or she remains infected. Studies are mixed on whether being infected with HSV-1 protects against subsequent infection with HSV-2, although evidence indicates that prior infection with HSV-1 may result in milder initial outbreaks of HSV-2.
Individuals at Risk for Oral Herpes
Oral herpes is usually caused by HSV-1, which is easily transmitted and is the most common form of the herpes simplex virus. Most people with HSV-1 infection were first infected during childhood, with the highest incidence of first infection occurring between 6 months and 3 years of age. The incidence in children varies among regions and countries, with the highest rates occurring in crowded and unsanitary regions. Studies suggest that by age 5 more than a third of children in low-income areas are infected compared to 20% of children in middle-income areas. However, by the time this more privileged group reaches their thirties, about 60% have become infected with HSV-1. After age 40, socioeconomic differences in infection rates become even less pronounced.
Individuals at Risk for Genital Herpes
According to the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), at least 45 million Americans ages 12 and over have had genital herpes. Approximately 1 in 5 adolescents and adults are infected with genital herpes and the prevalence is increasing among young adolescents. In one study of sexually active adults, 5.1% developed herpes each year, although the incidence varies widely depending on the degree of sexual activity. Among monogamous heterosexual couples, for example, when one partner is infected with HSV-2, the risk to the other is about 10% per year, with a noninfected woman having a higher risk than a noninfected male. Less than 1% of American children younger than 15 have genital herpes. In such cases, sexual abuse should be considered.
It should be noted that HSV-1 is becoming a major cause of genital herpes as well, and in some studies it is now an even more common cause than HSV-2. Using only statistics on HSV-2 infection, then, may underestimate the actual prevalence of genital herpes.
Health Central
Here is another bit on HVS 1 infecting genitally. Also, it addresses the potential dangers of occular herpes.
Quote: "People don't understand that you can have type 1 genitally or orally, that the two types are essentially the same virus,' says Marshall Clover, manager of the National Herpes Hotline." One type is associated with stigma, the other is "'just a cold sore"- our society has a euphemism for it so we don't even have to acknowledge that it's herpes.''
The common myth is that HSV-1 causes a mild infection that is occasionally bothersome, but never dangerous. The reality? HSV-1 is usually mild, especially when it infects the lips, face, or genitals. However, in some cases type 1 can recur spontaneously in the eye, causing ocular herpes, a potentially serious infection which can lead to blindness. In very rare cases HSV- 1 can spread spontaneously to the brain, causing herpes encephalitis, a dangerous infection that can lead to death. HSV-1 is also the usual cause of herpes whitlow, an infection on the finger, and "wrestler's herpes," (herpes gladiatorum) a herpes infection on the chest or face.
herpes.com
Quote:People don't understand that you can have type 1 genitally or orally, that the two types are essentially the same virus,' says Marshall Clover, manager of the National Herpes Hotline." One type is associated with stigma, the other is "'just a cold sore"- our society has a euphemism for it so we don't even have to acknowledge that it's herpes.''
So, cj, who by his own admittance is getting cold sores, has actually the same herpes virus as the genital one. Interesting.
well, cjhsa has HSV 1. That's precisely what I have. Though not on my mouth. And it's not even that my partner (whom I was with for 8 years) would be ignorant or has not known like cjhsa. He was a doctor. The trick is that the sore is at its most contageous before it even breaks out. Before it even starts to tingle or anything - when you have no clue what's gonna hit you. So for people with cold sores on their mouth - that's DEFINITELY something to let partners know about and to exercise caution about. Grrrrrrrrr.
Well. I'm going to sleep well tonight.
This is interesting, littlek. Just last week, I was talking to a co-worker of mine who is a pharmaceuticals salesman (or drug rep as they are more commonly known).
He told me that HPV (genital warts) is an STD that is rampant at the moment -- and men can get it even if they use a condom.
He sees a lot of STD coordinators in public health departments and they told him you would not believe what they see every day!
I was actually thinking about doing a thread about this myself. How many people are out there thinking that as long as they use condoms they are "safe"?
I said the very same thing you did -- why isn't there more discussion about this?
A person can be infected and break out with herpes sores on any and every part of your body. Not just genitals, mouth, eyes and so on...
Quote:For myself, I've hopefully gotten past those hurdles, but who knows. If I'm ever on the market again for whatever reason (hope not), I'd be interested in the vaccine for myself.
Quote:"Giving the HPV vaccine to young women could be potentially harmful, because they may see it as a licence to engage in premarital sex," Maher claims, though it is arguable how many young women have even heard of the virus.
Don't count on marriage keeping you safe folks. I got HSV-2 from my unfaithful husband after 3 years of marriage. There wasn't a thing I could do to prevent it other than not marrying him in the first place.
And yes, the most painful part of having herpes is the shame, guilt, rejection and education; and the fact that it is a never-ending cycle of that if you are honest about it with potential mates. You never get to heal the emotional scars. The bandaid is constantly being ripped off unless you completely withdraw yourself from any potential contact with the dating community.
For the Cjhsa's of the world, I wasn't promiscuous, I wasn't careless and I followed the "Catholic doctrine" of faithful loyalty to the marriage. You can educate people all you want until you're blue in the face. You won't be safe from contracting herpes until science comes up with a vaccine that allows people to provide that protection for themselves rather than depend on the honesty and awareness of others to protect them. And I hope that you never ever have to experience the disease for yourself. It has been one of the most physically and emotionally painful life-changing experiences of my existence.
I am so sorry to hear that Butrflynet.
If I ever contracted herpes or any other STD from my partner,
I would be very vindictive
I actually had that in an earlier version of what you quote, (about hoping and believing that my partner is faithful, but ultimately, who knows -- kept the idea though in equivocal language. I know I have no guarantee).
Very curious about where the herpes vaccine is after at least 4 years of trials...
One thing I thought of after going to bed last night is that, if such a large segment of the population has it, isn't there some hope for some kind of way of connecting with OTHER people that already have herpes? Like, gal A has it, and is having a hard time finding and keeping a relationship because of it; guy B has it, and ditto. Wouldn't it to be everyone's benefit if gal A and guy B could hook up? It's not a death sentence, like AIDS (though even AIDS is less and less of a death sentence). Can herpes get worse through additional contact with a carrier, or is it just a matter of having it or not?
Just re-read littlek's informational post at the top, looks like someone with HSV-1 can get HSV-2, but if two people with HSV-1 hook up, can anything worse happen than what they already have?
Soz, I'd think that two people with HSV 1 would have a better chance to not get another strain... then again you can always contract it on a 'new' area.
As far as dating people with herpes, there are websites for herpes personals, sotospeak. I think littlek posted a link to one or few.
dagmaraka wrote:The trick is that the sore is at its most contageous before it even breaks out. Before it even starts to tingle or anything - when you have no clue what's gonna hit you. So for people with cold sores on their mouth - that's DEFINITELY something to let partners know about and to exercise caution about.
But how you do that? And what can your partner do with that info? Transmission from genital to genital you can use condoms against. And if you're having a cold sore, you can make sure to just not do sensitive contact at that time. But if you can transmit it from mouth to genital before you even have an outbreak, what you do against that?
If you're a girl, I guess you can make your partner always wear a condom when having oral sex, to protect him.. (but poor girl!! and poor boy..). And if you're a boy?
Not sure how much you can DO to prevent it... but I think you have an obligation to TELL person you're with that you have oral herpes even if you haven't had a cold sore for months... so that the partner can decide whether to take the risk or do without oral sex.. doesn't matter if you're a guy or a gal - both can give it to each other. i'm sure it's not common. it's not something you want to share on your first, second, whichever date, but... i'd say it's unfair not to.
Okay, oral to genital will transmit herpes, but then you also contract
herpes through kissing, don't you?
Which means, if one has a date and wants to kiss at the end of it,
one has to either abstain or tell the other, right?
CalamityJane wrote:Okay, oral to genital will transmit herpes, but then you also contract
herpes through kissing, don't you?
Which means, if one has a date and wants to kiss at the end of it,
one has to either abstain or tell the other, right?
We could always go back to kissing on the hand, but then we don't know where that hand has been either.
As for dating someone else with herpes, I've thought of that as a solution for me, but avoid it because I am too afraid of instigating another series of breakouts from a re-infection. I haven't had a breakout in about 15 years, but the severe breakouts I had the first 15 years were painful enough to make me not want to take the chance.
About the only hope for protection we really have is a vaccine for the various strains of the virus. If you're worried about how easily you might catch it yourself, raise your voice with the rest of us rather than saying "it will never happen to me so why should I care?"
Yeah I get your point Dag, I was just wondering what "to exercise caution about" could mean in this context - cause I think an equivalent phrase was used a couple of times already in this thread. So basically, with that, you mean have no more oral sex, period? Who ever's gonna do that, tho?
It was new info to me that cold sores could be transmitted into genital herpes, by the way, so I'm kinda taken aback by that. I mean, cold sores are not something people are particularly embarassed about, after all. I know at least three people (all women) who's had them.
I had a cold sore too, which returned in the same place (above my lip) a few times after I first got it, which was three or four years ago - but it stopped reappearing and hasnt returned in ... something like two years already.
(I was told it's much more likely to reappear if you're in a bad state physically generally, like exhausted or eating badly, vitamin-deficient etc, and I was definitely in a bad state back then.)
When I first had a cold sore I went to the doctor, and he warned about it being infectious, so not to be kissing at that time, and to be aware especially that contracting it can be dangerous for babies, so no peck on the cheek for my nephew then.
He was laconic, though, when I asked him about what to do at all other times, then - I mean, if it's already there even when you cant see/feel it yet, just before an outbreak (for a day or so?) - what, never give my nephew a peck ever again? (In fact, my sis is one of those three people, so what would she have been supposed to do then?) And he definitely didnt say anything about it being possible to give someone genital herpes.
I wouldnt have thought twice about oral sex with someone who has had, at some time, a cold sore but is not having one, myself either. Anyone know the data about what risk we're talking about?
when you don't have an outbreak, you are generally "pretty safe" - in parenthesis, because you never know... you are right that the cold sore can reappear when your immunity is at its lowest - stress, flu, whatever. all i'm saying it that it's information that has to be shared. i wouldn't particularly care if my partner had cold sore history, but was fine for months - i would gladly take the risks, for i know them and i know how it works. so i'd know that if he's stressed and tired, or coming down with a cold, i'd forego oral sex, but otherwise i'd feel pretty safe with him. But if i DIDN'T know and contracted herpes from him, i'd be pissed off. So it's about being able to make that choice.
it's same with kissing, isn't it. you don't forego it, but when you feel a cold sore coming, you don't kiss people. that's all one has to do with oral sex, plus tell partner about it soon in the relationship (heh, perfect first date conversation, isn't it...)
Quote:I wouldn't particularly care if my partner had cold sore history, but was fine for months - i would gladly take the risks, for i know them and i know how it works. so i'd know that if he's stressed and tired, or coming down with a cold, i'd forego oral sex, but otherwise i'd feel pretty safe with him.
it's same with kissing, isn't it. you don't forego it, but when you feel a cold sore coming, you don't kiss people. that's all one has to do with oral sex
Yeah, that makes sense, thats how I would approach it too.
Well, apart from telling it on the
first date ...
