6
   

Immigration and Racism in Britain and USA

 
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Nov, 2007 11:21 am
Dined with them, then killed them off.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Nov, 2007 11:27 am
McTag wrote:
Dined with them, then killed them off.


That's history. I was talking about the meaning of the holiday, which emphasizes the positive.
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Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Nov, 2007 02:17 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Steve 41oo wrote:
Meanwhile the "British workers" which Brown now says he wants for "British jobs" (is this national socialism?) are leaving the country for warmer climes (e.g. Spain France Australia N America) in unprecedented numbers.


Or trying to to get some work here: today, there were (again) warnings by the local chamber of craftsmen and the polcie bout two British groups trying to fix (one) roofs here and yards (the other).
probably the same lot that did my roof and yard.

Bastards
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Nov, 2007 10:42 am
Foofie wrote:
McTag wrote:
Dined with them, then killed them off.


That's history. I was talking about the meaning of the holiday, which emphasizes the positive.


Dined with them, then killed them off, then romanticised the process.
0 Replies
 
hamburger
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Nov, 2007 12:17 pm
Quote:
Foofie wrote:
McTag wrote:
Dined with them, then killed them off.


That's history. I was talking about the meaning of the holiday, which emphasizes the positive.


Dined with them, then killed them off, then romanticised the process.


let's not waste time and effort talking about facts and history .
let's just talk about the meaning of it , so much more positive and enjoyable . Crying or Very sad
hbg
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Nov, 2007 01:18 pm
Sorry, hbg. Embarrassed

I always side with the underdog.

It's good to remember that, without the Indians, the original Virginia colony would not have survived.
Enjoy your celebrations.
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georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Nov, 2007 02:46 pm
The killing of the indians was true enough. Interestingly, at least East of the Mississippi, most of the extermination took place during the Seven Years War between the British and the French (or the French & Indian War as we knew it). Both European nations used allied Indian tribes to war against each other and, when they found it useful, the colonists themselves. This struggle ended whatever peaceful cohabitation there had been up to that point, and led to the demise of the Iriquois and Huron confederations of native tribes in the East.

It is also worth recognizing that, despite the traditional Anglo Saxon demonizing of the Spanish colonial system compared to their own, the survival of native populations as well as their languages and cultures was far greater in the Spanish colonies than in those dominated by the British.

What happened west of the Mississippi (and in areas of the southeast) was entirely of our own doing and responsibility. It was motivated by greed and fear.

McTag is, to a degree, a victim of British prejudice and ignorance (or perhaps, merely forgetfulness) of their own past. Not an uncommon thing over on that side of the Atlantic.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Nov, 2007 06:10 pm
Don't forget I'm a Scot, the sworn enemies of the English.

But I think we started the KKK. Embarrassed
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georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sat 24 Nov, 2007 09:41 pm
McTag wrote:
Don't forget I'm a Scot, the sworn enemies of the English.

But I think we started the KKK. Embarrassed


I wouldn't blame that on the Scots.

The so-called Scots Irish were the majority of the early frontier population: a tough, enduring breed, they were and generally very creative.

You are a bit dour though. However, with typical Irish cheer, and delight in irony, I enjoy it!
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Nov, 2007 05:47 am
Coming from you George, I consider that a compliment. Your heart is in the right place, even though you're Irish.

:wink:

Seriously though, reading about the Scots in America, we were heavily involved in the tobacco plantations and I daresay also in the cotton plantations. Even east of the Mississippi I am sure we have done our share of bad things...judged with 21st Century eyes.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Nov, 2007 11:43 am
This is relevant to the thread. As I've been saying for some while now, and been wrongly accused of being "racist" as a result, immigration has its problems

The Observer wrote:
Teachers: help us cope with migrants


Schools under strain, say heads
'Sudden influx stretches resources'

Jamie Doward, home affairs editor
Sunday November 25, 2007
The Observer

The debate over immigrant children in Britain's schools was reignited this weekend after the country's leading headteachers told The Observer that rising numbers of foreign pupils are putting some schools near breaking point because they do not have the resources to cope.

Members of the highly respected National Association of Headteachers will this week tell Parliament that the issue is starting to change the culture of some schools. Some heads said the issue was 'out of control'.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Nov, 2007 11:53 am
Of course it does. My sister-in-law teaches at an inner-city London school, and most of the intake children's parents do not speak English at home. Different languages too. There is a tremendous ethnic mix, and teachers have to contend with widely varying social customs, expectations and even diets.

How can they get much teaching done? Class sizes need to be much smaller, and numer of classroom assistants increased.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Nov, 2007 12:17 pm
We've classes here with 90% non-native German speakers as pupils.

And even in our small part of the town (which both of you know), the primery school is only attended by 60% German (as first language) speaking pupils.

Problems, we've got here since the 70's ...
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Nov, 2007 12:57 pm
McTag wrote:
Coming from you George, I consider that a compliment. Your heart is in the right place, even though you're Irish.

:wink:

Seriously though, reading about the Scots in America, we were heavily involved in the tobacco plantations and I daresay also in the cotton plantations. Even east of the Mississippi I am sure we have done our share of bad things...judged with 21st Century eyes.


Well, I suppose Andrew Jackson could serve as the archtype - he's the one who at New Orleans defeated the British army that had achieved so much in the fight against Napoleon in Spain (the only land battle we really won in that war). He also drove the Seminole Indians (and the Spanish) out of Florida and suppressed the Cherokee in the Carolinas. Jacksonville Florida is named after him. An interesting figure who generally opposed what may be called the establishment aristocracy of the period, championing instead the more adventurous types on the frontier (as it then stood).

I read a book some time ago about the many contributions of the so-called Scots-Irish to America. Don't recall many of the details but a surprising fraction of the leaders of the industrial revolution and higher education here emerged from among them. Indeed a similar thing can be observed in the history of the UK during the period.

If these hearty folk were included with the Irish they would displace Walter's beloved Germans as the largest ethnic group in America. I, of course, would never suggest that.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Nov, 2007 01:22 pm
georgeob1 wrote:

If these hearty folk were included with the Irish they would displace Walter's beloved Germans as the largest ethnic group in America. I, of course, would never suggest that.


If the Irish and Scottish missionaries - from Columba over Columbanus to the monks founding the Schottenklöster (Hiberno-Scottish monasteries) had worked properly, you didn't have to have this problem, George :wink:
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Nov, 2007 01:37 pm
Now Walter. They weren't trying to alter the culture of the Germans to whom they brought such enlightenment. True to the political tradition of the Celts, they never thought much past local government.

In truth the Irish always got on well with the Germans (except for a few tribes - the Angles, Saxons, and Jutes).
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 08:30 pm

Summary:

Quote:
The British equalities watchdog and council chiefs will commission an independent inquiry into whether white families face discrimination when they apply for social housing, said Trevor Phillips, the chairman of the Commission for Equality and Human Rights (CEHR). A widespread perception that newcomers receive unfair advantages, "specifically, that white families are cheated out of their right to social housing by newly-arrived migrants," is driving tensions, he explained.

"I have never seen any reliable evidence to back up this claim. And there can be no doubt that much of the public feeling is driven by the careless media and racist parties." But he proposed a study by "dispassionate academics" into whether the housing system is being abused "to the detriment of anyone - including white families."

Sir Simon Milton, chairman of the Local Government Association (LGA), added: "It's in the public interest to understand how these things work and .. to clear up any misunderstandings."

The CEHR subsequently said that the inquiry would be into the relative treatment of migrants and longstanding residents, rather than of different ethnic groups. It added that black Britons and British Asians had also expressed concerns that recent migrants - many from eastern Europe - were unfairly privileged.

Meanwhile, the LGA is arguing for a £250m government contingency fund to help councils cope with sudden changes in need. But Communities secretary Blears has said her department already created a £50m fund to promote integration and cohesion.
0 Replies
 
hildar
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Dec, 2007 05:44 pm
I have no intention of reading over 130 pages of views on this matter but I read about 10 pages. I live in the US born and raised, I dont agree with all they are doing lately. There have many people saying that Mexicans dont pay taxes, well they are wrong like everyone else they pay taxes, its taken out of there pay every week. Yet they dont get there income tax back at the end of the year. Which means the government keeps the extra cash.

Lots of people complain saying the mexicans are getting food stamps, health care, housing, ect from the state. Thats the biggest bull out there. You cant get any of that without having a real Social security number its been that way for 30 years.

I think of illegals this way.

I found a tunnel that goes to heaven, and I am going thru it with my family and live there where its a better life for us. We live there for 20 years. We have children there My oldest children have children, then God says. You cant stay here. You must leave and go back to your old home. But you can not take your children with you that were born here in heaven. Only those of you that came in without my permission will have to go. And you can never come back.

Would God treat us like this? I dont think so. So why are we treating people like this?

I cant figure it out but the US is getting really bad. I know in Wake county they are doing a door to door thing checking for illegals. I am sorry but that is against our rights as US citizens.

Hilda
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Dec, 2007 05:57 pm
hildar, Isn't is also interesting that over 85 percent of Americans claim to be christians?
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Jan, 2008 01:15 am
Quote:
When Ed Jones found a cheap and spacious house to buy in Salford, he thought his luck was in. Then a gang of teenagers took up residence on his doorstep. He got on with them well enough at first - but life soon descended into a cycle of vandalism, racist abuse and violence that eventually drove him from his home.

In today's The Guardian: 'Get them Polish out of your house or I'll burn it down'
0 Replies
 
 

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