Meh, I have to go sleep now anyway, but I will be looking out for your reply, which you have successfully avoided giving for quite some time now.
Wolfy -
Quote:English is a racial term reserved for Caucasians born in England.
Oh, brother. I hate these free kicks. I don't like to win on own-goals... it spoils any sense of achievement. It's like eating trout from the shop instead of from the stream...
... "a racial term... ".
Being 'English' is a cultural term - with certain racial implications
at this time in history.
After a 400-year history I perceive snood to be 100% American.
But I do not consider the johnny-come-latelies to the British Isles over the past 40-years to be anything other than hyphenated pretenders whose only motivation for being in England is for economic improvement under a benign political regime.
Incidentally, Wolf - there are no immigrant people more insular, and more racially-motivated to stick together in their ghettoes than are the Chinese.
Whether it is San Francisco, or London, or Sydney Australia - the Chinese community has an appalling record of being the least willing to integrate and assimilate into mainstream society.... generation after generation after generation.
.... and what really pisses me off big time are Third World immigrants to European societies who promptly alienate their babies from identifying with the local citizenry by naming them Mustafa[/i]... or Mohammed[/i]... or Ahmed[/i]... or Gunaratna[/i]... or Balachandra[/i]...
This is a bloody insult to the host people who have accepted these Third World peasants to be a part of their national community. This is a slap in the face to the national identity and traditional culture of the host people.
Acceptance for immigration implies the newcomer has the obligation to assimilate as 'English' as soon as is practicable - and this does not mean having your wife lie in an English maternity ward and name the UK-born baby 'Mustafa'... or 'Jiang'... or 'Gunga Din'...
And what of the "president" of Iran?
"Nuts" is very charitable, for this critter.
Also nuts.
Why do you ask? (Fail to see the connection.)
And Russia:
Russian racism 'out of control'
Racist killings in Russia are "out of control", according to a report by international human rights watchdog Amnesty International.
The report into violent racism shows that at least 28 people were killed and 366 were assaulted in 2005.
This year there have already been a number of high profile cases, including the death of nine-year-old Tajik girl.
Amnesty condemns discrimination by the authorities and a failure to properly record or investigate racist crimes.
Russia's police and prosecutors need to tackle head-on the growing scourge of violent racism in Russia
Kate Allen
Amnesty International
The Amnesty report, entitled Russian Federation: Violent racism out of control, includes examples of police and prosecutors routinely classifying murders and serious assaults by skinhead extremists as lesser crimes of "hooliganism".
Amnesty International UK Director Kate Allen said racist killings and violent attacks against foreigners, visible ethnic minorities and anti-racist campaigners in Russia were out of control.
"Some Russian authorities are turning a blind eye," she said. "Instead of seeing only 'hooliganism' in vicious organised attacks on students from African, south-east Asian countries and non-Slavic Russians from Chechnya, Russia's police and prosecutors need to tackle head-on the growing scourge of violent racism in Russia."
She said President Vladimir Putin's government should adopt a comprehensive "plan of action" to combat racism and anti-Semitism.
Protests
Cases highlighted in the Amnesty report include the killing of nine-year-old Tajik girl Khursheda Sultonovawho.
She was attacked with other members of her family in St Petersburg in February 2004 by a gang. Khursheda was stabbed nine times in the chest, stomach and arms and died at the scene.
Another victim was Vu Anh Tuan, a 20-year-old Vietnamese student, stabbed to death in October 2004 by a gang of 18 skinheads near a metro station in St Petersburg.
Dmitrii Kraiukhin, head of anti-racist organisation United Europe, told Amnesty he had received threats to "cut off your head".
He has repeatedly been denied protection from the authorities in Orel, western Russia.
The report also heard from members of the Roma community who have stopped travelling into St Petersburg city centre, having been the victims of attacks.
Russian citizens and foreigners living in the big cities have led demonstrations against the attacks and the authorities' failure to tackle the problem.
Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/europe/4969296.stm
Published: 2006/05/03 23:53:16 GMT
May 4, 2006
Growing Unease for Some Blacks on Immigration
By RACHEL L. SWARNS
WASHINGTON, May 3 ?- In their demonstrations across the country, some Hispanic immigrants have compared the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.'s struggle to their own, singing "We Shall Overcome" and declaring a new civil rights movement to win citizenship for millions of illegal immigrants.
Civil rights stalwarts like the Rev. Jesse Jackson; Representative John Lewis, Democrat of Georgia; Julian Bond and the Rev. Joseph E. Lowery have hailed the recent protests as the natural progression of their movement in the 1960's.
But despite some sympathy for the nation's illegal immigrants, many black professionals, academics and blue-collar workers feel increasingly uneasy as they watch Hispanics flex their political muscle while assuming the mantle of a seminal black struggle for justice.
Some blacks bristle at the comparison between the civil rights movement and the immigrant demonstrations, pointing out that black protesters in the 1960's were American citizens and had endured centuries of enslavement, rapes, lynchings and discrimination before they started marching.
Others worry about the plight of low-skilled black workers, who sometimes compete with immigrants for entry-level jobs.
And some fear the unfinished business of the civil rights movement will fall to the wayside as America turns its attention to a newly energized Hispanic minority with growing political and economic clout.
"All of this has made me start thinking, 'What's going to happen to African-Americans?' " said Brendon L. Laster, 32, a black fund-raiser at Howard University here, who has been watching the marches. "What's going to happen to our unfinished agenda?"
Mr. Laster is dapper and cosmopolitan, a part-time professor and Democratic activist who drinks and dines with a wide circle of black, white and Hispanic friends. He said he marveled at first as the images of cheering, flag-waving immigrants flickered across his television screen. But as some demonstrators proclaimed a new civil rights movement, he grew uncomfortable.
He says that immigrant protesters who claim the legacy of Dr. King and Rosa Parks are going too far. And he has begun to worry about the impact that the emerging immigrant activism will have on black Americans, many of whom still face poverty, high rates of unemployment and discrimination in the workplace.
"I think what they were able to do, the level of organization they were able to pull off, that was phenomenal," said Mr. Laster, who is also a part-time sociology professor at a community college in Baltimore. "But I do think their struggle is, in fundamental ways, very different from ours. We didn't chose to come here; we came here as slaves. And we were denied, even though we were legal citizens, our basic rights."
"There are a still lot of unresolved issues from the civil rights era," he said. "Perhaps we're going to be pushed to the back burner."
This painful debate is bubbling up in church halls and classrooms, on call-in radio programs and across dining room tables. Some blacks prefer to discuss the issue privately for fear of alienating their Hispanic allies. But others are publicly airing their misgivings, saying they are too worried to stay silent.
"We will have no power, no clout," warned Linda Carter-Lewis, 62, a human resources manager and the branch president of the N.A.A.C.P. in Des Moines. "That's where I see this immigrant movement going. Even though so many thousands and thousands of them have no legal status and no right to vote right now, that day is coming."
Immigrant leaders defend their use of civil rights language, saying strong parallels exist between the two struggles. And they argue that their movement will ultimately become a powerful vehicle to fight for the rights of all American workers, regardless of national origin.
"African-Americans during the civil rights movement were in search of the American dream and that's what our movement is trying to achieve for our community," said Jaime Contreras, president of the National Capital Immigration Coalition, which organized the April 10 demonstration that drew tens of thousands of people to Washington.
"We face the same issues even if we speak different languages," said Mr. Contreras, who is from El Salvador and listens to Dr. King's speeches for inspiration.
Mr. Jackson, who addressed the immigrant rally on Monday in New York, echoed those views. He noted that Dr. King, at the end of his life, focused on improving economic conditions for all Americans, regardless of race. And he said the similarities between African-Americans and illegal immigrants were too powerful to ignore.
"We too were denied citizenship," Mr. Jackson said. "We too were undocumented workers working without wages, without benefits, without the vote. "We should feel honored that other people are using tactics and strategies from our struggle. We shouldn't say they're stealing from us. They're learning from us."
Mr. Jackson said corporate employers were fueling the tensions between blacks and immigrants by refusing to pay a living wage to all workers. John Campbell, a black steel worker and labor activist from Iowa, agreed.
"This is a class issue," said Mr. Campbell, who has been disheartened by black critics of the immigrant marches. "We need to join forces. We can't improve our lot in life as African-Americans by suppressing the rights of anyone else."
But blacks and immigrants have long had a history of uneasy relations in the United States.
W.E.B. DuBois, a founder of the N.A.A.C.P., and other prominent black leaders worried that immigrants would displace blacks in the workplace. Ronald Walters, director of the African-American Leadership Institute at the University of Maryland, said blacks cheered when the government restricted Asian immigration to the United States after World War I. And many Europeans who came to this country discriminated against blacks.
Blacks and Hispanics have also been allies. In the 1960's, Dr. King and Cesar Chavez, the Mexican-American farm labor leader, corresponded with each other. And when Mr. Chavez was jailed, Dr. King's widow, Coretta Scott King, visited him in jail, Mr. Walters said. In recent years, blacks and Hispanics have been influential partners in the Democratic Party.
A recent poll conducted by the Pew Hispanic Center captured the ambivalence among blacks over immigration. Nearly 80 percent said immigrants from Latin American work very hard and have strong family values.
But nearly twice as many blacks as whites said that they or a family member had lost a job, or not gotten a job, because an employer hired an immigrant worker. Blacks were also more likely than whites to feel that immigrants take jobs away from American citizens.
Mr. Walters said he understood those conflicting emotions, saying he feels torn himself because of his concerns about the competition between immigrants and low-skilled black men for jobs. In 2004, 72 percent of black male high school dropouts in their 20's were jobless, compared with 34 percent of white and 19 percent of Hispanic dropouts.
"I applaud them moving out of the shadows and into the light because of the human rights issues involved," Mr. Walters said of illegal immigrants. "I've given my entire life to issues of social justice as an activist and an academic. In that sense, I'm with them.
"But they also represent a powerful ingredient to the perpetuation of our struggle," he said. "We have a problem where half of black males are unemployed in several cities. I can't ignore that and simply be my old progressive self and say it's not an issue. It is an issue."
snood...
Quote:"Nuts" is very charitable, for this critter.
It might be time for you to climb down off that high platform of moral indignation, snood... and take a closer look at the racism which exists within your own ethnic community.
From my own readings on the internet there is a huge groundswell of racist resentment amongst America's blacks toward the millions of Hispanics and illegals who have come swanning in from across the southern borders, and Cuba, to steal the jobs which once were the traditional employment of millions of Afro-Americans.
And I don't at all blame America's blacks for feeling mighty pissed off about this.
Those illegals who we have just witnessed marching in the streets across the US of A in a froth of outrage over not having yet been granted citizenship rights - are the very people who are most responsible for having robbed the American blacks of their jobs...
A sizeable portion of black crime across the US can be directly apportioned to the fact that many blacks of all ages have found themselves made redundant in the workplace by millions of Hispanics and illegals having migrated to occupy their jobs.
Am I nuts, snood... ?
cicerone - for God sake man stop posting up entries that are as long as a toilet roll! There's no way I'm going to drag myself through all that crap. Keep it simple, stupid.
(Some guys here are really nuts)
herberts ain't nuts, just plain racist...a racism born (as usual) of xenophobia I expect (although he/she may prefer the synonym, "patriotism")
herberts wrote:.....
*yawn*... okay Prince - you're next.
So you're an Indian in London. Were you born an 'Indian in London'... ? Are you, like Wolf, a part of a burgeoning colony of intransigent foreigners who are living in England under the false pretence of having been accepted as 'assimilable immigrants' but instead are nothing more than ghetto-fodder... ?
Speak up man! Leave nothing out! I can tell when you're lying, so tread softly.
So you finally decided to be a man
Nopes, I wasn't born in London. I came to London in '95 when I was transferred to UK by the company I used to work for on the specific request of the then *British* management. I orginally came on a 1 year assignment so clean up some of the mess which had been created over the years, but after my 1 year was completed, the *British* management of the company requested me to stay on. Everytime I made noises about leaving, the *British* management of the company increased my pay, gave me more responsibilities and made it clear that they did not want me to leave. After 10 yrs in that company (which was American), I was headhunted by a *British* company, under a *british* management where I now work.
I don't know what you mean by a ghetto-fodder, but unless you live in a castle (like Lord Ellpus), I don't think you can call a row of £500,000 houses in a nice conservation area (where I live - actually I own one of them, which I bought from a *british* family) - "ghettos"
As far as assimilation goes, not really sure what you mean? How do you define it? I have a huge circle of friends of all nationalities, I am pretty fluent in English language, I go to a pub, I live in a street full of white people...Does that make me assimiliated?
Eagerly awaiting yr next set of questions....
Reading some of the exchanges with herberts on this thread, I am reminded of this:
"It's of little use trying to wrestle with a pig. You only get covered in filth, and the pig probably enjoys it."
Morning, Herbie. You are quite mad, you know.
I could just about stomach Herberts views if he lived in Britain. But telling me how bloody awful this place is from Australia just sticks in my craw. Herberts is an agent for the British National Party who are a bunch of violent white supremacists. They are feeding off genuine concerns about Islamists and manipulating and directing that anger against all non white groups. Herberts might appear quite mad, but there is method there too. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he lives in Australia because he no longer has residency rights in the UK.
Quote:I am more interested in what you believe it means to be English and what English culture is.
I recognise Chinese culture and Chinese persons. A chinese person generally has a more olive skin, thinner eyes, flatter nose and normally speaks chinese. He is not English.
An Englishman (like me) has pail white skin. English culture is hard to describe from outside of the culture, and thus it would be described by Englishmen as "How we think and live" or something to that effect.
Americans, Englishmen and Australians differ very little as they are all decendants of Englishmen, and have been separate people for a very short amount of time. The same does not go for Africans or Asians.
The idea of you trying to justify that you are English finds my amusement.
If I go to China and say "im Chinese" ill get laughed at, and thus I laugh at you. I fancy if the lefties have England their way, the English culture will cease to exist and you will be right to make the above challenge with little chance of rebuttle - but not now.
And Yes Wolf, I am well versed with the principals of communism. I have been quoting it before that last post and it has remained unchallenged. Now that I have forgotton specifically why it was used, I have been picked up on it - thats the way it goes I guess.
Yes, it is quoted as a removal of the bourgeoisie, but its underlying concept is that of equallity amongst all people. The ideas people believe in here seemed to me to sound like the ideas of Marx, and thus I made my deduction.
Oh, and
people aren't equal!
Hi Prince - welcome to the Mickey Mouse Club. The way the game is played here is that I express my views - and everyone in the audience hisses and boos and stamp their feet and throw rotten vegetables at me.
And they're running out of insulting terminology for me too.
North West English git...
Quote:"It's of little use trying to wrestle with a pig. You only get covered in filth, and the pig probably enjoys it."
Isn't that an ironic piece of role-reversal... ? Here am I being accused of being a nazi - and yet it's these pinko reprobates who want to infer that I am a 'schwein'. It would complete the picture for you if I was Jewish, wouldn't it McTag... ?
Yes, RaceDriver, one of the principal tenents of Communism is that everyone is equal. However, that is also one of the principal tenents of Capitalism (but with a slightly different slant).
With Capitalism, everyone is equal, so everybody can potentially achieve greatness. No one person is inelligible to climb the ladder. Everyone is allowed to do so, but at their own pace.
And yes, I was kind of flip-flopping between what I normally think of as being English (as a racial term) and what I thought that Herberts thought was English. Shouldn't have done it. Such an action is illogical and confusing to say the least, hence my asking what Herberts thinks it means to be English and what English culture means.
I wanted terms clarified so I could clear up the mess I accidentally got myself into.
And Herberts does have a point in regards to the more recent Chinese immigrants. Boy has London Chinatown gone down hill since they've come along.
May I also remind Herberts that historically Chinatowns were created due to great prejudice against against Chinese people by whites (at least, in America anyway)? It was only natural for them to congregate.
Over time, however, Chinese families have frayed away from the main hub. The newer generations have wandered away from the main isolated group to become more assimilated. This has happened time and time again.
I have cousins that are half-Chinese, half-Irish. I have a new cousin once removed that is half-Chinese, half-English. I doubt I'll find a Chinese girlfriend myself, so I'm guessing I may have to marry an English girl too... if it weren't for the fact that I'm gay, but hey, maybe that's just a phase.
Leave well alone. If the history of what happened to the African slaves of Napoleon times are anything to go by, the minorities will be assimilated by the mother culture of England creating a nice monoculture with virtually no discernible foreign input.
