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The Worst President in History?

 
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 12:34 pm
Quote:
Sorry to be a little too graphic for your tastes. Just look at the history of some of the people in politics now, going back to the 60's, check the universities where they studied, observe their current apparent affections and sympathies with communist leaders. Lets just say it causes red flags.


Hit # 2 googling "okie" and "universities"
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 12:36 pm
Quote:
mele42846 wrote:
Anyone who thinks that our colleges and Universities, especially those which are supposed to be the most desirable, have not been almost completely captured by left wing ideologies knows NOTHING about Education. We must remember that those who did the sit-ins at Harvard, Yale, U. of Chicago, Columbia, etc.form the core of the faculties in the most "desirable" schools.


okie wrote: This is not a rant. I regard it as a factual observation.


hit # 3
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okie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 12:39 pm
Keep it up Blatham. I asked you to find where I claimed American universities are superior to those in Europe. You won't find it. Is this how you debate, by making stuff up on your opponents? I don't mind debating somebody that can be honest, but if you can't, I am not very interested.

If you think there aren't a bunch of leftist professors these days, you need to pull your head out of the sand, blatham.

Wheres #4? I can hardly wait.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 01:01 pm
Yikes! Sorry, I apologize. That was massago, not you.

However, as regards universities, could you fill us all in on your personal experiences with them. Number of years attended, when, where, etc. There are a lot of folks here with extensive experience and great familiarity with higher education and perhaps we ought to compare and make some judgements on who actually knows what they are talking about.
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 02:13 pm
okie wrote:
Keep it up Blatham. I asked you to find where I claimed American universities are superior to those in Europe. You won't find it. Is this how you debate, by making stuff up on your opponents? I don't mind debating somebody that can be honest, but if you can't, I am not very interested.

If you think there aren't a bunch of leftist professors these days, you need to pull your head out of the sand, blatham.

Wheres #4? I can hardly wait.


I am beginning to think that you conservative folks think anyone who is not lock-step with your kneejerk conservatism...has to be a "leftist."

I am not a liberal...I am not a Democrat...I am not a leftist...and I think American conservatism is a cellpool.
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 02:36 pm
Frank Apisa wrote:
I am not a liberal...I am not a Democrat...I am not a leftist...and I think American conservatism is a cellpool.


You, sir, are a leftist. http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/2788/yes9yy.gif
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 02:49 pm
If not being a rightist is the leftist, I'm a leftist - with pride.
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 02:54 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
Frank Apisa wrote:
I am not a liberal...I am not a Democrat...I am not a leftist...and I think American conservatism is a cellpool.


You, sir, are a leftist. http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/2788/yes9yy.gif


Sorry to disappoint you, Ti...but the ONLY way I am a "leftist" is if I am right about you poor folks thinking anyone not in lock-step with your kneejerkism...is a leftist.

Short of that...I am NOT a leftist.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 03:09 pm
But, Frank, righties are good at labels; we are commies, America haters, leftists, and don't support our troops. The only thing righties understand are lables they apply to "everybody" else that do not support Bush. I'm not a leftist either, but I'm far from being a righty. In that regard, I'll live with their labels. Sticks and stones may break my bones....
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okie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 03:30 pm
blatham wrote:
Yikes! Sorry, I apologize. That was massago, not you.

However, as regards universities, could you fill us all in on your personal experiences with them. Number of years attended, when, where, etc. There are a lot of folks here with extensive experience and great familiarity with higher education and perhaps we ought to compare and make some judgements on who actually knows what they are talking about.


Thanks for the apology.

In regard to universities, I do not personally think they matter a great deal. My approach to this forum is to bring an opinion born out of experience, personal observation, and absorption of world events during my lifetime, which is pretty much what everybody brings to this forum. We may have a background of formal education, but as we gain years, it tends to fade into the background. I do not have first hand opinions of universities in recent years, except what friends and acquaintances tell me and what I read and hear through news accounts and so forth, and I certainly know little about what is taught in Europe about history.

To satisfy your curiosity, my degree is a BS in geology, Oklahoma State University, and a minor in math. My interest was science and to get through college as quickly as possible to find a good job in my area of interest, which is what I did. I was not greatly interested in history when I had to take the required courses in high school and college. I am not going to debate you or other learned individuals about the details of history. However, there are certain principles and major events of history that are pretty understandable by those of us that do not have degrees in history, and we are fully qualified to have correct and valid opinions concerning those things.

I have a childhood friend with a Phd in history, but talk about major confusion, it is my opinion he is, and he virtually admitted as much to me. He told me once not many years ago that he wasted 30 years or so halfway believing in something better than what the farmers he grew up with believed. He said they were right all along. He made simple concepts into confusion by being overeducated by a bunch of "piled higher and deepers," but he is recovering now I think. I am not contending that more education won't be an advantage, but I do not necessarily think it gives you a license to think you are more correct in regard to having the correct view of history and the political systems involved.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 03:35 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
But, Frank, righties are good at labels; we are commies, America haters, leftists, and don't support our troops. The only thing righties understand are lables they apply to "everybody" else that do not support Bush. I'm not a leftist either, but I'm far from being a righty. In that regard, I'll live with their labels. Sticks and stones may break my bones....


I don't mind when someone mistakes me for a "leftist." I can smile when the mistake is made.

Call me a "right winger" or a "conservative"...and I'll want to take a dump on you. I'd sooner be known as an animal abuser.
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hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 05:12 pm
What I've gleaned from this debate so far

Some say you cannot judge a presidency until it's over. [Sounds reasonable]

The president has done things that make many think his presidency will be considered the worst at some point in the future.

Someone said history begins when a presidential term ends [that's a pretty ludicrous assertion] but I guess I'll concede that the term itself hasn't finished - so while history starts now, in my view, the presidency hasn't ended, so, at least at the level of high falutin' logic, you can't honestly say it is the worst presidency in history - just that you strongly think it will be.

Someone is certain that the far right is just as cheesed with Bush as 'leftist' 'majority'.


I'm a bit weirded out by the rightist/leftist labels - the terms are bandied about a lot but is there agreement on what they mean. There does seem to be some 'anyone who doesn't agree with me is a rightist/leftist' stuff going on. So I thought I'd look it up in Wikipedia


Quote:
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(Redirected from Leftist)

In politics, left-wing, the political left or simply The Left are terms that refer to the segment of the political spectrum typically associated with any of several strains of socialism, communism, social democracy or social liberalism, and defined in contradistinction to its polar opposite, the right.

The term originates from the French Revolution, when liberal deputies from the Third Estate generally sat to the left of the president's chair, a habit which began in the Estates General of 1789. The nobility, members of the Second Estate, generally sat to the right. It is still the tradition in the French Assemblée Nationale for the representatives to be seated left-to-right (relative to the Assemblée president) according to their political alignment.

As this original reference became obsolete, the meaning of the term has changed, and is now used to denote a broad variety of political philosophies and principles. In contemporary Western political discourse, the term is most often used to describe forms of socialism, social democracy, or, in the sense in which the term is understood in the United States, liberalism.

The left-wing attribution is very broadly employed as a political descriptor, and a single definition is elusive. The use of the phrase in the democratic West is quite distinct from the usage in most Communist states - where the term has connotations associated with Bukharin and the democratization of all human activities (see also deviationism).

Communism, as well as the Marxist philosophy that many base it on, and most currents of traditional anarchism are often considered to be radical forms of left-wing politics. Many left-wingers reject any association with communism or anarchism. Others say that those who don't follow strict socialist or communist philosophies can't possibly be leftists.

The left is often seen to include secularism, as in the United States, India, the Middle East, and in many Catholic countries, although religion and left-wing politics have at times been allied historically, such as in the U.S. civil rights movement, or in the cases of liberation theology and Christian socialism.


Clearly it really is just a label - and if we don't agree on what it means it's pointless using it against each other. Call someone a communist if you want - at least has some shade of meaning.
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BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 05:22 pm
American Universities superior to European Universities?--YOU BET. Even if the erudite Mr. Blatam says they are not, the academic world thinks that they are.

But, but, but, the learned Mr.Blatham says--What about the charge that American Universities are filled with Commies and Socialists? Doesn't that make them worse?

l. The US Universities have fewer left wingers than the European Universities.

2. The US Universities' Commies and Socialists are primarily in the Social Sciences--History, Literature, Sociology and the useless crap like Woman's studies, Black studies etc. You will not find many Commies and Socialists in the Medical schools--Law Schools--Business Schools-Schools that concentrate in the hard sciences.

I know that Mr. Blatham is superbly schooled but it seems that he does not know that most surveys do indeed list the US Universities as superior--far superior..

For the perusal of those interested--even Mr. Blatham, who is pouting ever since I eviscerated him in an argument--I give the following link.

http://ed.sjtu.edu.cn/rank/2005/ARWU2005_Top100.htm

Those who access this link will find in the top 50 Universities listed, ONLY twelve are foreign--

#2- Cambridge #4 Oxford # 20 Tokyo University #22 Kyoto # 23 Imperial College London # 24 University of Toronto # 26 University College London # 27- Swiss Tech- Zurich # 37 University of British Columbia # 42 University of Utrecht- Netherlands # 45- Karolinska Institute--Stockholm #46 University of Paris # 48 University of Edinburgh.

In the top twenty five we find--#1-Harvard, #3 Stanford #4 University California- Berkeley # 5 MIT # 6 CIT # 7 Columbia #8-Princeton # 9-Chicago # 11-Yale #12- Cornell # 13- U. Cal, San Diego # 14- U CAL- LA # 15- U Penn # 16 U Wisconsin # 17 U Washington # 18 U CAl- SAn Fran. # 19- Johns Hopkins # 21 U. Michigan # U, Illinois


I am rather certain that the same general listing will be found in any other grouping of schools!!!
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hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 05:26 pm
BernardR wrote:


l. The US Universities have fewer left wingers than the European Universities.

2. The US Universities' Commies and Socialists are primarily in the Social Sciences--History, Literature, Sociology and the useless crap like Woman's studies, Black studies etc. You will not find many Commies and Socialists in the Medical schools--Law Schools--Business Schools-Schools that concentrate in the hard sciences.


Oh, I'd love to see the research you're citing for those two statements. Define left winger for me, Massagoto.
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BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 05:40 pm
Left Wingers in US Universities? Read the fascinating book- "The Professors" by David Horowitz. Here is what some of the 101 Left Wing Professors do--

a. Say they want to kill white people'

b. Promote the views of the mullahs

c. Support Osama Bin Laden

d. Lament the demise of the Soviet Union

e. Defend Pedophilia

f. Advocate the killing of ordinary Americans.


See if you can get the book, Hingehead--It's an eye-opener!

PS. There are a couple of other books( Not as good or recent as Horowitz's book who have a similar message--

The Shadow University by Kors and Silverglate.
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 05:43 pm
BernardR wrote:
Left Wingers in US Universities? Read the fascinating book- "The Professors" by David Horowitz. Here is what some of the 101 Left Wing Professors do--

a. Say they want to kill white people'

b. Promote the views of the mullahs

c. Support Osama Bin Laden

d. Lament the demise of the Soviet Union

e. Defend Pedophilia

f. Advocate the killing of ordinary Americans.


See if you can get the book, Hingehead--It's an eye-opener!

PS. There are a couple of other books( Not as good or recent as Horowitz's book who have a similar message--

The Shadow University by Kors and Silverglate.


Holy Jesus H. Ceerist...

...Bernie, boobie, baby...

...you just referred to Hingehead as "Hingehead"...not Mr. Hingehead.

What in hell is this world coming to?
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BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 05:47 pm
He's a personal friend, Frank Apisa. I never call my personal friends-Mr.
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 06:09 pm
BernardR wrote:
He's a personal friend, Frank Apisa. I never call my personal friends-Mr.


Do be careful with that word "never", Bernie. And while you are at it, be careful with the truth also.

From Bernie:
Quote:
Mr. Hingehead- President Bush's first term is History. His Second term, being unfinished( there are 28 months to go). He will hit the half way mark in November.

How did he do in his first term?


http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=2103389&highlight=#2103389
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BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 06:24 pm
I will repeat- I never call my personal friends- Mr.

Is that too difficult for you to understand Mr. Apisa?
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hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Jun, 2006 06:29 pm
BernardR wrote:


See if you can get the book, Hingehead--It's an eye-opener!



Sadly, Bernard, I don't think it opened your eyes at all.
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