THE US, THE UN AND IRAQ, TENTH THREAD.

Like when Nixon and Kisinger gave Pol Pot $24 million?

American Sponsored Terrorist Malignancy

Pol Pot's regime killed between 1.5 to 2.3 million people between 1975-1979, out of a population of approximately 8 million. The regime targeted Buddhist monks, Western educated intellectuals, people who appeared to be intelligent (for example, individuals with glasses), the crippled and lame, and ethnic minorities like ethnic Laotians and Vietnamese.

Holly crap ican!!!! Did you see Cicerones list on page 158???? Where does that fit into our foreign policy of Liberty for all?????

I believe terrorist malignancy is killing thousands of innocent civilians.

You appear incapable of correctly stating the truth or even what I advocate.

The number of non-combatant civilians killed by violence since 01/01/2000, as of:
12/31/2002 (1096 days) -- total = 56,049 -- approximate average monthly rate / daily rate = 1,556.9 / 51.1;

The number of non-combatant civilians killed by violence since 01/01/2003, as of:
12/31/2005 (1095 days) -- total = 31,319 -- approximate average monthly rate / daily rate = 870.0 / 28.6;
01/31/2006 (1126 days) -- total = 31,928 -- approximate average monthly rate / daily rate = 862.9 / 28.4;
02/28/2006 (1154 days) -- total = 32,506 -- approximate average monthly rate / daily rate = 855.4 / 28.2;
03/31/2006 (1185 days) -- total = 38,161 -- approximate average monthly rate / daily rate = 978.5 / 32.2;
04/30/2006 (1215 days) -- total = 39,024 -- approximate average monthly rate / daily rate = 975.6 / 32.1.

I believe this must be stopped or drastically curtailed. I believe the only way to stop or drastically curtail it, is to exterminate terrorist malignancy.

When do we start?


The following timeline describes just a few of the hundreds of atrocities and crimes committed by the CIA. (1)

CIA operations follow the same recurring script. First, American business interests abroad are threatened by a popular or democratically elected leader. The people support their leader because he intends to conduct land reform, strengthen unions, redistribute wealth, nationalize foreign-owned industry, and regulate business to protect workers, consumers and the environment. So, on behalf of American business, and often with their help, the CIA mobilizes the opposition. First it identifies right-wing groups within the country (usually the military), and offers them a deal: "We'll put you in power if you maintain a favorable business climate for us." The Agency then hires, trains and works with them to overthrow the existing government (usually a democracy). It uses every trick in the book: propaganda, stuffed ballot boxes, purchased elections, extortion, blackmail, sexual intrigue, false stories about opponents in the local media, infiltration and disruption of opposing political parties, kidnapping, beating, torture, intimidation, economic sabotage, death squads and even assassination. These efforts culminate in a military coup, which installs a right-wing dictator. The CIA trains the dictator's security apparatus to crack down on the traditional enemies of big business, using interrogation, torture and murder. The victims are said to be "communists," but almost always they are just peasants, liberals, moderates, labor union leaders, political opponents and advocates of free speech and democracy. Widespread human rights abuses follow.

This scenario has been repeated so many times that the CIA actually teaches it in a special school, the notorious "School of the Americas." (It opened in Panama but later moved to Fort Benning, Georgia.) Critics have nicknamed it the "School of the Dictators" and "School of the Assassins." Here, the CIA trains Latin American military officers how to conduct coups, including the use of interrogation, torture and murder.

The Association for Responsible Dissent estimates that by 1987, 6 million people had died as a result of CIA covert operations. (2) Former State Department official William Blum correctly calls this an "American Holocaust."

The CIA justifies these actions as part of its war against communism. But most coups do not involve a communist threat. Unlucky nations are targeted for a wide variety of reasons: not only threats to American business interests abroad, but also liberal or even moderate social reforms, political instability, the unwillingness of a leader to carry out Washington's dictates, and declarations of neutrality in the Cold War. Indeed, nothing has infuriated CIA Directors quite like a nation's desire to stay out of the Cold War.

The ironic thing about all this intervention is that it frequently fails to achieve American objectives. Often the newly installed dictator grows comfortable with the security apparatus the CIA has built for him. He becomes an expert at running a police state. And because the dictator knows he cannot be overthrown, he becomes independent and defiant of Washington's will. The CIA then finds it cannot overthrow him, because the police and military are under the dictator's control, afraid to cooperate with American spies for fear of torture and execution. The only two options for the U.S at this point are impotence or war. Examples of this "boomerang effect" include the Shah of Iran, General Noriega and Saddam Hussein. The boomerang effect also explains why the CIA has proven highly successful at overthrowing democracies, but a wretched failure at overthrowing dictatorships.

The following timeline should confirm that the CIA as we know it should be abolished and replaced by a true information-gathering and analysis organization. The CIA cannot be reformed ?- it is institutionally and culturally corrupt.


1975

Australia ?- The CIA helps topple the democratically elected, left-leaning government of Prime Minister Edward Whitlam. The CIA does this by giving an ultimatum to its Governor-General, John Kerr. Kerr, a longtime CIA collaborator, exercises his constitutional right to dissolve the Whitlam government. The Governor-General is a largely ceremonial position appointed by the Queen; the Prime Minister is democratically elected. The use of this archaic and never-used law stuns the nation.

Angola ?- Eager to demonstrate American military resolve after its defeat in Vietnam, Henry Kissinger launches a CIA-backed war in Angola. Contrary to Kissinger's assertions, Angola is a country of little strategic importance and not seriously threatened by communism. The CIA backs the brutal leader of UNITAS, Jonas Savimbi. This polarizes Angolan politics and drives his opponents into the arms of Cuba and the Soviet Union for survival. Congress will cut off funds in 1976, but the CIA is able to run the war off the books until 1984, when funding is legalized again. This entirely pointless war kills over 300,000 Angolans.

"The CIA and the Cult of Intelligence" ?- Victor Marchetti and John Marks publish this whistle-blowing history of CIA crimes and abuses. Marchetti has spent 14 years in the CIA, eventually becoming an executive assistant to the Deputy Director of Intelligence. Marks has spent five years as an intelligence official in the State Department.

"Inside the Company" ?- Philip Agee publishes a diary of his life inside the CIA. Agee has worked in covert operations in Latin America during the 60s, and details the crimes in which he took part.

Congress investigates CIA wrong-doing ?- Public outrage compels Congress to hold hearings on CIA crimes. Senator Frank Church heads the Senate investigation ("The Church Committee"), and Representative Otis Pike heads the House investigation. (Despite a 98 percent incumbency reelection rate, both Church and Pike are defeated in the next elections.) The investigations lead to a number of reforms intended to increase the CIA's accountability to Congress, including the creation of a standing Senate committee on intelligence. However, the reforms prove ineffective, as the Iran/Contra scandal will show. It turns out the CIA can control, deal with or sidestep Congress with ease.

The Rockefeller Commission ?- In an attempt to reduce the damage done by the Church Committee, President Ford creates the "Rockefeller Commission" to whitewash CIA history and propose toothless reforms. The commission's namesake, Vice President Nelson Rockefeller, is himself a major CIA figure. Five of the commission's eight members are also members of the Council on Foreign Relations, a CIA-dominated organization.

1979

Iran ?- The CIA fails to predict the fall of the Shah of Iran, a longtime CIA puppet, and the rise of Muslim fundamentalists who are furious at the CIA's backing of SAVAK, the Shah's bloodthirsty secret police. In revenge, the Muslims take 52 Americans hostage in the U.S. embassy in Tehran.

Afghanistan ?- The Soviets invade Afghanistan. The CIA immediately begins supplying arms to any faction willing to fight the occupying Soviets. Such indiscriminate arming means that when the Soviets leave Afghanistan, civil war will erupt. Also, fanatical Muslim extremists now possess state-of-the-art weaponry. One of these is Sheik Abdel Rahman, who will become involved in the World Trade Center bombing in New York.

El Salvador ?- An idealistic group of young military officers, repulsed by the massacre of the poor, overthrows the right-wing government. However, the U.S. compels the inexperienced officers to include many of the old guard in key positions in their new government. Soon, things are back to "normal" ?- the military government is repressing and killing poor civilian protesters. Many of the young military and civilian reformers, finding themselves powerless, resign in disgust.

Nicaragua ?- Anastasios Samoza II, the CIA-backed dictator, falls. The Marxist Sandinistas take over government, and they are initially popular because of their commitment to land and anti-poverty reform. Samoza had a murderous and hated personal army called the National Guard. Remnants of the Guard will become the Contras, who fight a CIA-backed guerilla war against the Sandinista government throughout the 1980s.

1980

El Salvador ?- The Archbishop of San Salvador, Oscar Romero, pleads with President Carter "Christian to Christian" to stop aiding the military government slaughtering his people. Carter refuses. Shortly afterwards, right-wing leader Roberto D'Aubuisson has Romero shot through the heart while saying Mass. The country soon dissolves into civil war, with the peasants in the hills fighting against the military government. The CIA and U.S. Armed Forces supply the government with overwhelming military and intelligence superiority. CIA-trained death squads roam the countryside, committing atrocities like that of El Mazote in 1982, where they massacre between 700 and 1000 men, women and children. By 1992, some 63,000 Salvadorans will be killed.

1981

Iran/Contra Begins ?- The CIA begins selling arms to Iran at high prices, using the profits to arm the Contras fighting the Sandinista government in Nicaragua. President Reagan vows that the Sandinistas will be "pressured" until "they say ?'uncle.'" The CIA's Freedom Fighter's Manual disbursed to the Contras includes instruction on economic sabotage, propaganda, extortion, bribery, blackmail, interrogation, torture, murder and political assassination.

1983

Honduras ?- The CIA gives Honduran military officers the Human Resource Exploitation Training Manual - 1983, which teaches how to torture people. Honduras' notorious "Battalion 316" then uses these techniques, with the CIA's full knowledge, on thousands of leftist dissidents. At least 184 are murdered.

1984

The Boland Amendment ?- The last of a series of Boland Amendments is passed. These amendments have reduced CIA aid to the Contras; the last one cuts it off completely. However, CIA Director William Casey is already prepared to "hand off" the operation to Colonel Oliver North, who illegally continues supplying the Contras through the CIA's informal, secret, and self-financing network. This includes "humanitarian aid" donated by Adolph Coors and William Simon, and military aid funded by Iranian arms sales.

1986

Eugene Hasenfus ?- Nicaragua shoots down a C-123 transport plane carrying military supplies to the Contras. The lone survivor, Eugene Hasenfus, turns out to be a CIA employee, as are the two dead pilots. The airplane belongs to Southern Air Transport, a CIA front. The incident makes a mockery of President Reagan's claims that the CIA is not illegally arming the Contras.

Iran/Contra Scandal ?- Although the details have long been known, the Iran/Contra scandal finally captures the media's attention in 1986. Congress holds hearings, and several key figures (like Oliver North) lie under oath to protect the intelligence community. CIA Director William Casey dies of brain cancer before Congress can question him. All reforms enacted by Congress after the scandal are purely cosmetic.

Haiti ?- Rising popular revolt in Haiti means that "Baby Doc" Duvalier will remain "President for Life" only if he has a short one. The U.S., which hates instability in a puppet country, flies the despotic Duvalier to the South of France for a comfortable retirement. The CIA then rigs the upcoming elections in favor of another right-wing military strongman. However, violence keeps the country in political turmoil for another four years. The CIA tries to strengthen the military by creating the National Intelligence Service (SIN), which suppresses popular revolt through torture and assassination.

1989

Panama ?- The U.S. invades Panama to overthrow a dictator of its own making, General Manuel Noriega. Noriega has been on the CIA's payroll since 1966, and has been transporting drugs with the CIA's knowledge since 1972. By the late 80s, Noriega's growing independence and intransigence have angered Washington… so out he goes.

1990

Haiti ?- Competing against 10 comparatively wealthy candidates, leftist priest Jean-Bertrand Aristide captures 68 percent of the vote. After only eight months in power, however, the CIA-backed military deposes him. More military dictators brutalize the country, as thousands of Haitian refugees escape the turmoil in barely seaworthy boats. As popular opinion calls for Aristide's return, the CIA begins a disinformation campaign painting the courageous priest as mentally unstable.

1991

The Gulf War ?- The U.S. liberates Kuwait from Iraq. But Iraq's dictator, Saddam Hussein, is another creature of the CIA. With U.S. encouragement, Hussein invaded Iran in 1980. During this costly eight-year war, the CIA built up Hussein's forces with sophisticated arms, intelligence, training and financial backing. This cemented Hussein's power at home, allowing him to crush the many internal rebellions that erupted from time to time, sometimes with poison gas. It also gave him all the military might he needed to conduct further adventurism ?- in Kuwait, for example.

The Fall of the Soviet Union ?- The CIA fails to predict this most important event of the Cold War. This suggests that it has been so busy undermining governments that it hasn't been doing its primary job: gathering and analyzing information. The fall of the Soviet Union also robs the CIA of its reason for existence: fighting communism. This leads some to accuse the CIA of intentionally failing to predict the downfall of the Soviet Union. Curiously, the intelligence community's budget is not significantly reduced after the demise of communism.

1992

Economic Espionage ?- In the years following the end of the Cold War, the CIA is increasingly used for economic espionage. This involves stealing the technological secrets of competing foreign companies and giving them to American ones. Given the CIA's clear preference for dirty tricks over mere information gathering, the possibility of serious criminal behavior is very great indeed.

1993

Haiti ?- The chaos in Haiti grows so bad that President Clinton has no choice but to remove the Haitian military dictator, Raoul Cedras, on threat of U.S. invasion. The U.S. occupiers do not arrest Haiti's military leaders for crimes against humanity, but instead ensure their safety and rich retirements. Aristide is returned to power only after being forced to accept an agenda favorable to the country's ruling class

Holy moly Amigo!!!! What the USA did before 9/11 is not what the USA is doing after 9/11.

What the USA did prior to 9/11 cannot be corrected. What the USA is doing after 9/11 can be corrected.

Now! Exterminate terrorist malignancy!

Well, ican, there's not much we can do about 9-11 either, because after five plus years, Osama is still missing, and the twin towers are gone forever. That's in the past, holy moly.

I believe that you are attempting to enlist youth to murder people. Most of the people you wish to murder are, in your eyes, less than human; some innocents will get in the way, which is regrettable, but neccessary for the survival of our society, in your eyes.

I believe that Al Qaeda is attempting to enlist youth to murder people. Most of the people they wish to murder are, in their eyes, less than human; some innocents will get in the way, which is regrettable, but neccessary for the survival of their society, in their eyes.

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America has repeatedly declared that we wish to control the world. We call it 'spreading democracy and freedom' but what they hear is 'make the rest of the world just like us.' They've seen the effects in other countries and don't want that for their country. They feel threatened and are fighting back in the way that they consider appropriate, and if some innocents get killed, it is regrettably a part of a war neccessary for survival.

Al Qaeda has repeatedly declared that they wish to control the world. They call it 'spreading the word of Allah' but what we hear is 'make the rest of the world just like them.' We've seen the effects in other countries and don't want that for our country. We feel threatened and are fighting back in the way that we consider appropriate, and if some innocents get killed, it is regrettably a part of a war neccessary for survival.

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When you say 'we' must do something about it, you mean 'our youth, directed by our leaders' must do something about it. We use high-tech and expensive means, funded by our people, to launch our attacks. They use low-tech and cheap means, funded by their people, to launch their attacks. There isn't much difference between what you advocate and what they advocate. They have an arbitrary list of events that lead them to believe that we need exterminating. You have presented an arbitrary list of events which lead you to believe that they need exterminating.


They believe we are responsible for the war.

We believe they are responsible for the war.

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Some of us believe a truce is possible. The extremist terrorists do not. The extremist ICan's also do not.

You agree with the enemy on pretty much every subject. You simply cannot agree who the enemy is. But most of us in the middle understand that both of you are the enemy. Extremism is the enemy, and those who advocate extremism to fight extremism, deserve to be treated the same as those whose attitudes they copy.

I have no doubt that there is a Muslim version of Ican, on a Muslim discussion board, who fevrently puts forward his theories that his state will never be safe while American interests are not fought. He will advocate the youth to fight in the manner that his culture determines appropriate.

As I said, you didn't used to be this extreme. Why have you become more extreme?

Cycloptichorn

There was American trained death squads in El Salvador to secure Corporate interest and now we have the same death squads in Iraq for corporate oil interest today. You see prior and current, pre and post 9/11. It's called the "El Salvador option". Thats why the Taliban was in Texas. Thats why Rumsfeld is shaking hands with Saddam. Thats why we have always supported dictators For greed not Liberty.

Terror for greed. It's History. You need to call it something else so you can escape the truth. I acknowledge the truth about our role in terror because I know it is the right thing to do for mankind and in the eyes of god. The god that is watching you say that you advocate your government terrorizing people even though the truth is presented to you.

"Terrorist malignancy" Thats you. You are part of it. You help perpetuate it and Me, you and god are a witness to it.

Ican, you are a total arse.

The totality of your arsefulness is astounding.

Good post; Cycloptichorn.

Shiite lawmaker threatens to form government unilaterally

BAGHDAD (AP) ?- Efforts to create a national unity government in Iraq stumbled Sunday as a member of an influential Shiite alliance bloc threatened to form a new government unilaterally if rival groups did not scale back their demands. Sunnis said they may withdraw from the process entirely.
Under the constitution, Prime Minister-designate Nouri al-Maliki faces a May 22 deadline to form a government. Lawmakers have struggled with this task for months, hoping a new government will cool escalating sectarian tensions between Iraq's Shiite majority and the Sunni Arab minority.

As the 275-member parliament convened Sunday, Bahaa al-Araji, a lawmaker loyal to the radical anti-American Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, denounced what he said was continued U.S. meddling in the selection of ministers for coveted Interior and Defense Ministry posts. He set a deadline of two days before the 130 alliance deputies act unilaterally.

"Within the past two days, the occupation forces have been interfering with certain names and certain posts," said al-Araji, whose group holds 30 seats. "There are also blocs participating in the (formation of) the government that have begun demanding more than what they are entitled to electorally."

"We have set a limit of within two days, and the (various) blocs should abide by this timeframe and act in accordance with the rules upon which we have agreed. Otherwise, we will form a government without regard to their demands," he said, singling out the Sunni Arab Accordance Front as one example.

Sunni lawmakers shot back with their own threats, with one member of the three-party Sunni Arab coalition that holds 44 seats threatening to walk out of the talks and the government.

"If we do not get what we deserve, we will end our participation in the political process," lawmaker Salman al-Jumali told The Associated Press. "Our representatives in parliament, and the officials already awarded ministerial posts will withdraw."

He said they wanted the Defense, Education, Planning and Health ministries, among others.

Earlier, another member of the United Iraqi Alliance, the Fadhila Party, rebuffed a call by al-Maliki to return to the Cabinet formation negotiations, saying the political process was marred and that the incoming government would be little more than an amalgam of personalities out of tune with the needs of Iraqis.

"We wish the people would understand our stance ?- a long-standing one for the party," said Sheik Sabah al-Saedi, a spokesman for the party which hold 15 seats. The parties "must be honest and just in evaluating the issues and reporting them to the people because history will bear witness."

Last week, Fadhila said it was withdrawing from the talks, arguing that the process was being driven by self-interests, sectarianism and U.S. pressure.

The group had earlier said that it was also frustrated by a rejection of its bid for the Oil Ministry. But in Sunday's news conference, al-Saedi said they would not come back, "even if we are given the Oil Ministry now."

Fadhila's withdrawal, coupled with the threats by the Sadrists and al-Jumaili, casts further doubts that al-Maliki can meet the May 22 deadline.

Lawmakers have said that without unanimity on key posts, al-Maliki may announce a partial Cabinet and hold temporary control of the Interior and Defense ministries until suitable candidates are agreed upon.

U.S. officials have said they would like to see independents, unaffiliated with Iraq's various violent militias, hold those two posts. This has led some lawmakers to accuse the United States of meddling.

Al-Araji said the Accordance Front is "demanding more than what they are entitled to," and stressed that the Iraqi List, a secular faction headed by former Prime Minister Ayad Allawi, was also evaluating its continued role in the negotiations.

"There are no problems within the alliance. But there is uncertainty within the Iraqi List whether to (continue) participating and today they will reach a decision," al-Araji said.

iraq
blueflame wrote :

"Shiite lawmaker threatens to form government unilaterally"

of course we can insert the word "iran" for "shiite" , can't we ?

btw i saw a CCB-TV report from iran last week . it appeared that most people lived fairly normal and decent lives by middle-eastern standards .
young people were seen "pairing off" and are apparently not much concerned about separation of the sexes . many stores carried westen goods of all kinds ... looked like any other middle-eastern country .

one thing was that most people had no interest in talking politics ; they were more interested in enjoying life . those that did speak , said that political activism was not welcome by the government (but it never is , is it ?) , but they also said that life in general wasn't unpleasaant - again if compared to other middle-eastern countries .

perhaps better allow them to find freedom their own way ?
hbg

I wonder how long it takes for people to become accustomed to seeing car bombs going off regularly and killing people?

To be able to live a "normal" life in that kind of environment takes a special kind of mind-set that I couldn't possibly understand.

iraq
c.i. :
the report was from iran - not iraq . they don't seem to have many problems with car bombs going off - they have not been "liberated" yet !
hbg

Ooops, senior moment 'again.' I think the younger generation of Iranians wants to have relations with the west. It's probably a matter of time when they take over the government.

ICAN BELIEVES:

So this includes the people who advocate and bear silent witness to the malignancies cicerone listed on page 158. Yes or No

All this rhetoric about "progress in Iraq" based on the new government seems to be falling apart at the seams. Bush doesn't listen to the experts, so what can we expect?