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SUPPORT Cindy and OUR TROOPS! Countrywide Vigils Tonight

 
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 09:34 pm
The MSM is largely silent on all that stuff, and none of them are asking any Democrat leader if they condone or support what she is doing. (They know darn well how politically unprofitable that would be whatever they answered.)

Fortunately the internet is not silent and the word keeps getting out and out and out. I hope our brave guys and gals putting it all on the lne over there are getting the information on the support for them and not just the Cindy Sheehan supporters progaganda.
0 Replies
 
squinney
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 09:36 pm
Quote:
Cindy Sheehan (Military Families Speak Out; Goldstar Families for Peace; her son Casey was killed in the Iraq War)

First, I want to give my little story about Lynne. Of course, you all have read To Kill a Mockingbird. Lynne is my human Atticus Finch. He did what he knew was right, but wasn't popular. And that's what Lynne is doing. {applause}

We are not waging a war on terror in this country. We're waging a war of terror. The biggest terrorist in the world is George W. Bush. {applause}

How many more people are we going to let him kill before we stop him? I'm going to talk about free speech and recruitment. Do you know that it costs $66,000 to recruit one recruit? That's continuing all of their - you know, the recruiter's salary, the recruiter's bonus, the place that they rent to recruit and things like that. All the perks they get and everything. That's not even training the recruit. It costs our government about $6,000 a year on each child in California. $46,000 a year to house a prisoner in our state. Our priorities are seriously screwed up, as I mentioned.

I really want to thank you guys for doing this, especially the young people. It gives me so much hope to know that there's young people who care more about who's our next American Idol - less about that. You guys care more about people being killed. There's too many that care more about the next American Idol. Too many people in our country that don't even really know we have a war going on. You know, they never have to think of the war, and I'll never, ever forget this war. I can never forget it, even when I'm sleeping {tears} I know that we're in a war and I know that George Bush and his band of neo-cons and their neo-con agenda killed my son. And I'll never, ever, ever forget.

I take responsibility partly for my son's death, too. I was raised in a country by a public school system that taught us that America was good, that America was just. America has been killing people, like my sister over here says, since we first stepped on this continent, we have been responsible for death and destruction. I passed on that bullshit to my son and my son enlisted. I'm going all over the country telling moms: "This country is not worth dying for. If we're attacked, we would all go out. We'd all take whatever we had. I'd take my rolling pin and I'd beat the attackers over the head with it. But we were not attacked by Iraq. {applause} We might not even have been attacked by Osama bin Laden if {applause}. 9/11 was their Pearl Harbor to get their neo-con agenda through and, if I would have known that before my son was killed, I would have taken him to Canada. I would never have let him go and try and defend this morally repugnant system we have. The people are good, the system is morally repugnant. {applause}

Please - teach your babies, teach your babies better than I taught my babies. When Congress gave George Bush the right to go to war, they abrogated their constitutional responsibilities and they basically made our constitution null and void. We have no checks and balances in this country. We have no recourse. If they're going to what they did to Lynne, they don't have backs they call names, what we need to be is, we the people, we're their checks and balances. We're the only checks and balances. We have to stand up and say, Not only is this our school, this is our country. We want our country back and, if we have to impeach everybody from George Bush down to the person who picks up dog **** in Washington, we will impeach all those people. Our country needs to {unintelligible} we need to start over again.

I just want to say that you students, Students Against War, you have all my support and all my organization's support. I told Kristen if you have any actions and you need a ringleader, that I only live about an hour away. I'll be here. If I can sleep on somebody's floor, we can have this, we can camp out, do whatever we need.

And I just want to way to George Bush and I want to say to the people who are here, that are still sheep {unintelligible} and following him blindly: if George Bush believes his rhetoric and his bullshit, that this is a war for freedom and democracy, that he is spreading freedom and democracy, does he think every person he kills makes Iraq more free? It doesn't make us more free. It damages our humanity. The whole world is damaged. Our humanity is damaged. If he thinks that it's so important for Iraq to have a U.S.-imposed sense of freedom and democracy, then he needs to sign up his two little party-animal girls. They need to go this war. They need to fight because a just war, the definition of a just war, and maybe you people here who still think this is a just war, the definition of a just war is one that you would send your own children to die in. That you would go die in yourself. And you aren't willing to send your own children, or if you're not willing to go die yourself, then you bring there rest of our kids home now. It is despicable what they're doing. {applause}

What they're saying, too, is like, it's okay for Israel to have nuclear weapons. But Iran or Syria better not get nuclear weapons. It's okay for the United States to have nuclear weapons. It's okay for the countries that we say it's okay for. We are waging a nuclear war in Iraq right now. That country is contaminated. It will be contaminated for practically eternity now. It's okay for them to have them, but Iran or Syria can't have them. It's okay for Israel to occupy Palestine, but it's - yeah - and it's okay for Iraq to occupy - I mean, for the United States to occupy Iraq, but it's not okay for Syria to be in Lebanon. They're a bunch of ******* hypocrites! And we need to, we just need to rise up. We need a revolution and make it be peaceful and make it be loving and let's just show them all the love we have for humanity because we want to stop the inhumane slaughter.


I must be missing something, cause I get what she's saying and don't find it anti-jew.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 09:38 pm
Lol - it is dumb to say that a parent's moral authority over a son killed in war is absolute - but I don't really see what - from the Slat equote I have read so far - you guys have your knickers in a twist about. Especially for some of you in such a vicious one.

" We were told that we were attacked on 9/11 because the terrorists hate our freedoms and democracy … not for the real reason, because the Arab Muslims who attacked us hate our middle-eastern foreign policy."

I agree that is a major reason - and the crap about "hating our freedom" was utterly contemptible and Goebbles-esque crap.

" Yes, he was killed for lies and for a PNAC Neo-Con agenda to benefit Israel."

Yeah - American foreign policy IS to protect Israel - though I have to admit I am happy about the recent policy for America to put pressure on Israel to behave with some reasonable degree of flexibility vis a vis the Palestinians.


She's not the smartest crayon in the pack - but you'll need a lot more than that to convince me she is an anti-semite. She may be anti-zionist for all I know - the two are not the same.

Got anything better than the Slate quote?

I see no reason for the slime so far.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 09:48 pm
squinney wrote:
I must be missing something, cause I get what she's saying and don't find it anti-jew.


She has said, "You get America out of Iraq and Israel out of Palestine and you'll stop the terrorism." In my book, that is "anti-jew," because it's certainly anti-Israel.

LINK
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 09:55 pm
It's anti-Zionist.

So?


It's silly, cos - though I do not believe Israel had any right to grab that land - they are there - just like we live in the lands of those we dis-possessed, and there is no point trying to make us go home - it's just silly. We need to move on from where things are.


I see her as naive and impassioned.

I don't think she deserves the crap you two are heaping on her.


You just don't like it that there is such a stir about her.


I can see how dumb Nazis might have their eyes light up and all - but peopple that pathetic have their eyes light up over all kinds of stuff.


But - slime away - you have made up your minds.


Me thinking you're over-acting won't stop anything.


Frankly, I would prefer a cleverer more well-read and measured person to be an icon for your peace movement - but she is a woman who has lost her son and had a lot of comfortable illusions stripped away, and is in shock.


It's sad and I think the right vilification is pretty foul, unless you have something way better than that. She's saying some dumb things - but I do not think she is malevolent at all.



Given the appalling crap some of you heap on Muslims, you ought to be getting the beam out of your own eyes before daring to slime someone for what she has said re Jews.

But - enjoy.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:22 pm
Make up what you require.

We heaped crap on terrorists and Korans. When did you take to task Frank or any number of people here who routinely insult Christians and Bibles?

Get the beam out of your own eye.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:33 pm
Let's go for it Lash.


You get started on creaming all th efolk on your side who you think are unfair and mean.


When you get - oh say - a hundredth of the way through, let me know - and I'll start on the left.

Fair?


So far, I think I am WAY up on you in taking on the excesses of my lot.

Until then, stop with that pathetic tactic.

It is meaningless and you make yourself ridiculous with it.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:43 pm
She's anti-Jew. You think pointing that out is "sliming" her? If you feel that "crap" is being heaped upon her, it's simply because she has decided to appear before the cameras and in the national spotlight and make the crap known. It should come as no surprise that some don't agree with her views, and choose to point out why.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:45 pm
Yep.



I think that to equate anti-Zionism with anti-semitism is the worst kind of intellectual whoredom.


Some anti-zionists are anti-jew.

Prove that she is.

Enjoy.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 10:47 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
She's anti-Jew. You think pointing that out is "sliming" her? If you feel that "crap" is being heaped upon her, it's simply because she has decided to appear before the cameras and in the national spotlight and make the crap known. It should come as no surprise that some don't agree with her views, and choose to point out why.


What ****!

I have no problem with people pointing out that they disagree with her.

Hell, I do an a number of things so far.


How dare you infer that questioning the appalling sliming of her is cavilling with reasoned questioning of her views?


You lower yourself.

Jesus.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:01 pm
dlowan wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
She's anti-Jew. You think pointing that out is "sliming" her? If you feel that "crap" is being heaped upon her, it's simply because she has decided to appear before the cameras and in the national spotlight and make the crap known. It should come as no surprise that some don't agree with her views, and choose to point out why.


What ****!

I have no problem with people pointing out that they disagree with her.

Hell, I do an a number of things so far.


How dare you infer that questioning the appalling sliming of her is cavilling with reasoned questioning of her views?


You lower yourself.

Jesus.


Get over yourself, Deb. Since thrusting herself into the national spotlight, Sheehan has taken the opportunity to reveal her true views of the US and Israel. This lady is being held up by many as a leader of the anti-war movement. "Mother Sheehan" she's being called. Guess what? She happens to have some wacko views, which in my view are anti-US and anti-Israel. These views are being highlighted because that's who she is. I like to point them out. Deal with it.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:06 pm
Anti-US?

Who gives a ****.

Not me.


Get over yourself.

Your country is currwntly world bully. Enjoy. It won't last. Sad, really, cos you're a nicer bully than most.


Deal with it.


Anti-Zionist?

Crap on as you will, that doesn't mean anti-jew.

I don't give a **** what she is called,


You and Slash (and the rest of the loony right, no doubt) have slimed her as anti-semitic.


You are full of it.


Deal with it.

Put up, or shut up.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:11 pm
Seems to me that Tico, Lash, (and she me) have put up quite a lot. Those defending Cindy Sheehan have put up....what?
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:12 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
squinney wrote:
I must be missing something, cause I get what she's saying and don't find it anti-jew.


She has said, "You get America out of Iraq and Israel out of Palestine and you'll stop the terrorism." In my book, that is "anti-jew," because it's certainly anti-Israel.

LINK



Well, hasn't the term "Palestine" various meanings? As far as I'm aware, the biblical sense is not the only one, right? It's been widely used to refer to the region governed by the Palestinian National Authority, or to the State of Palestine, declared in Algiers in 1988.

Maybe what she meant was what Sharon is doing at the moment, at least partly: remove the illegal settlements as well as the military from the land surrounding the State of Israel, the land that belongs to the Palestinians.

No?
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:12 pm
dlowan wrote:
Anti-US?

Who gives a ****.

Not me.


Not a surprise.

Quote:
Get over yourself.


Perhaps later.

Quote:
I don't give a **** what she is called,


You appear to very much, as shown by how frequently you pop in here complaining that she's being "slimed."

Quote:
You and Slash (and the rest of the loony right, no doubt) have slimed her as anti-semitic.


She manages to do the trick herself by opening her mouth.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:12 pm
Make a point - or be still.
0 Replies
 
Amigo
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:15 pm
Nice job winning over the Aussie.Whata team. Team America, Thats what well call you guys. Laughing
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:16 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
dlowan wrote:
Anti-US?

Who gives a ****.

Not me.


Not a surprise.

Quote:
Get over yourself.


Perhaps later.

Quote:
I don't give a **** what she is called,


You appear to very much, as shown by how frequently you pop in here complaining that she's being "slimed."

Quote:
You and Slash (and the rest of the loony right, no doubt) have slimed her as anti-semitic.


She manages to do the trick herself by opening her mouth.



Nah. She is an ordinary grunt.

Anti-American? Anti the loony right America, perhaps.

I value much that is American - not he arrogant **** stuff.


BE surprised. You know nothing of my feelings about the USA. Just your fantasies. Shrugs. Whatever.

You people slime yourselves by battening on her naivete.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:20 pm
dlowan wrote:
You people slime yourselves by battening on her naivete.


Her "naivete"? Who are you trying to kid? What on earth lead you to that conclusion? She knows exactly what she's doing. And she could teach you some swear words.

Naive my a**.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Aug, 2005 11:22 pm
Lol. While I have no doubt it is a cute ass, demonstrate how that makes Cindy a Machiavellian?

The whole ******* thing reminds me of "Being There".
0 Replies
 
 

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