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Trump's Tax Returns are Finally Public

 
 
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 08:44 am
Copied over from the Trump thread since it really deserves it's own. The NY times has obtained years of Trump's tax returns.

Quote:
Donald J. Trump paid $750 in federal income taxes the year he won the presidency. In his first year in the White House, he paid another $750.

He had paid no income taxes at all in 10 of the previous 15 years — largely because he reported losing much more money than he made.

As the president wages a re-election campaign that polls say he is in danger of losing, his finances are under stress, beset by losses and hundreds of millions of dollars in debt coming due that he has personally guaranteed. Also hanging over him is a decade-long audit battle with the Internal Revenue Service over the legitimacy of a $72.9 million tax refund that he claimed, and received, after declaring huge losses. An adverse ruling could cost him more than $100 million.

The tax returns that Mr. Trump has long fought to keep private tell a story fundamentally different from the one he has sold to the American public. His reports to the I.R.S. portray a businessman who takes in hundreds of millions of dollars a year yet racks up chronic losses that he aggressively employs to avoid paying taxes. Now, with his financial challenges mounting, the records show that he depends more and more on making money from businesses that put him in potential and often direct conflict of interest with his job as president.

The New York Times has obtained tax-return data extending over more than two decades for Mr. Trump and the hundreds of companies that make up his business organization, including detailed information from his first two years in office. It does not include his personal returns for 2018 or 2019. This article offers an overview of The Times’s findings; additional articles will be published in the coming weeks.
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Type: Discussion • Score: 17 • Views: 2,017 • Replies: 111

 
engineer
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 08:45 am
@engineer,
Bloomberg conclusion on looking at Trump's taxes.

Trump's Taxes Show He's a National Security Threat

Quote:
The Times, in a news story published Sunday evening that disclosed years of the president’s tax returns, also put a lot of clothing on things we didn’t know. Trump paid just $750 in federal income taxes in 2016, the year he was elected president, and the same amount the following year, when he entered the White House. In many years recently he hasn’t paid anything at all. He has played so fast and loose with the taxman that he’s entangled in an audit. He paid his daughter Ivanka lush consulting fees that he deducted as a business expense even though she helped him manage the Trump Organization. And he’s taken questionable tax write-offs on everything from getting his hair coifed to managing his personal residences.

Step away from the tragicomic tawdriness and grift that the tax returns define, however, and focus on what they reveal about Trump as the most powerful man in the world and occupant of the Oval Office.

Due to his indebtedness, his reliance on income from overseas and his refusal to authentically distance himself from his hodgepodge of business, Trump represents a profound national security threat – a threat that will only escalate if he’s re-elected. The tax returns also show the extent to which Trump has repeatedly betrayed the interests of many of the average Americans who elected him and remain his most loyal supporters.

engineer
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 08:46 am
@engineer,
Key take aways from Trump's taxes from the Guardian.

Quote:
Trump pays little tax
The Times reported that Trump paid no federal income taxes in 11 of 18 years the newspaper looked at. In 2017, after he became president, his tax bill was only $750. This is despite Trump often railing against taxes in America and ushering through a series of tax cuts that critics say mostly helps the rich and big business.

Barack Obama and George W Bush each regularly paid more than $100,000 a year.

A long audit – with potentially hefty costs
Trump is involved in a decade-long audit with the Internal Revenue Service over a $72.9m tax refund he claimed, and received, after declaring huge losses. A ruling against him could cost him more than $100m, the Times reported.

It added: “In 2011, the IRS began an audit reviewing the legitimacy of the refund. Almost a decade later, the case remains unresolved, for unknown reasons, and could ultimately end up in federal court, where it could become a matter of public record.”

Ivanka helps reduce Trump’s tax burden
The president’s oldest daughter, while working as an employee of the Trump Organization, appears to have received “consulting fees” that helped reduce the family’s tax bill, the Times said. Such a revelation might further tarnish the reputation of Ivanka, a senior White House adviser married to another, Jared Kushner, who often tries to distance herself from some of the biggest scandals of her father’s administration. She is widely believed to harbor political ambitions of her own after Trump leaves office.

The Times reported: “Trump’s private records show that his company once paid $747,622 in fees to an unnamed consultant for hotel projects in Hawaii and Vancouver, British Columbia. Ivanka Trump’s public disclosure forms – which she filed when joining the White House staff in 2017 – show that she had received an identical amount through a consulting company she co-owned.”

Trump businesses lose money
The Times was brutal in its assessment of Trump’s businesses, about which he often boasts and on the back of which he sought to promote a carefully curated image as a master businessman. “Trump’s core enterprises – from his constellation of golf courses to his conservative-magnet hotel in Washington – report losing millions, if not tens of millions, of dollars year after year,” the newspaper said.

It detailed how since 2000, Trump has reported losing more than $315m at his golf courses, with much of that coming from Trump National Doral in Florida. His Washington hotel, which opened in 2016 and has been the subject of much speculation regarding federal ethics laws, has lost more than $55m.

Trump has a big bill to pay
The newspaper also reported that Trump is facing a major financial bill, as within the next four years, hundreds of millions of dollars in loans will come due. The paper said Trump is personally responsible for many of those obligations.

The paper reported: “In the 1990s, Mr Trump nearly ruined himself by personally guaranteeing hundreds of millions of dollars in loans, and he has since said that he regretted doing so. But he has taken the same step again, his tax records show. He appears to be responsible for loans totaling $421m, most of which is coming due within four years.”

In a blunt summary of the problem, the Times speculated: “Should he win re-election, his lenders could be placed in the unprecedented position of weighing whether to foreclose on a sitting president.”
0 Replies
 
jespah
 
  0  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 08:51 am
@engineer,
The company where I work offers help to small businesses. One of the first things we tell them to never, ever do, to do whatever it takes not to do - is give out personal guarantees. The president evidently gave out more than one, even after PGs were nearly catastrophic for him in the 90s.

A PG puts your house on the line in the event that you default on a loan. As in, repo.
farmerman
 
  0  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 09:02 am
@jespah,
A liddle Schadenfreude?? Hah?

When a lir get cught up by hi own poopity, he not only looks felonious , he looks downright stupid??

This draws a grand jury hen hes out of office. Thats a shame to tarnish the office. I still think they should give him a NIXON as long as he just disappears from public. Anybody with an IQ over body temp will get what a clown he is.
engineer
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 09:12 am
@farmerman,
At this point, a pardon would just allow him to lose all "his" money to taxes and foreclosure. No jail time but his reputation and wealth gone. Of course, he would still have millions tucked away in various places but likely not multimillions.
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  0  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 11:14 am
That lying Michael Cohen — nothing in these tax returns undercuts stories he's told or charges he's made!

The personal indebtedness angle sure goes a long way to explaining his behavior towards Putin.

I think this is one of the most significant revelations of 45's presidency. The Constitutional, security, and diplomatic concerns which sparked his impeachment were simply too principled for the MAGAtards to accept and the legal arguments were too idealistic and abstruse to provoke outrage. The "Amur'ka First" crowd may be slow to recognize a traitor but they'll be right on a lying huckster who's bragged about his wealth and business acumen but is actually in debt up to his neck and cheats on his taxes. The media will be coming out with follow-ups and the disorganized White House will be clumsily generating negative repercussions right until the election. <pulling up a chair>

Of course, Trump himself could simply reveal his tax returns and prove that the whole story actually is "fake news".
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 12:14 pm
The real problem for America is that none of this matters at all for the devoted Trump morons.

Trump could sit on the White House lawn and torture puppies...and they would find a way to make that okay. In fact, they would find a way to make that beneficial for America.

Trump is the second worst bit of garbage our nation has ever had to deal with. Trump's continuing supporters and enablers are the worst.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  4  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 12:21 pm
Let me ask the question...

Is this honestly an important issue to anyone?

If it was Biden who were having these tax problems... would it change your vote? Of all of the issues relating to the future of the country, the tax returns of the candidates are almost near the bottom for me.

Not that taxes aren't important... but this campaign should be about Immigration and Health Care and Civil rights and Climate Change. These outrage stories about tax returns on the Trump side and Ukrainian gas companies on the Biden side seem a little silly.



hightor
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 12:57 pm
@maxdancona,
Quote:
Is this honestly an important issue to anyone?

Well, yes. Recklessness and dishonesty aren't quite the characteristics I'd look for in a national leader given the state of our country.

Quote:

If it was Biden who were having these tax problems... would it change your vote?

The thing is, it wouldn't have happened to Biden. Not because he's a better human being (he is) but because a long successful career in public service usually indicates that someone was circumspect in business and financial activities. Politicians have lawyers and ethics consultants precisely to avoid being exposed in a compromising situation.

Quote:
...but this campaign should be about Immigration and Health Care and Civil rights and Climate Change.

I don't think this issue really supplants concern with any other.

Quote:
These outrage stories about tax returns on the Trump side and Ukrainian gas companies on the Biden side seem a little silly.

I think they might have an effect on undecided voters. The Biden/Ukraine stuff really looks unconvincing and rather petty in comparison.
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 01:11 pm
@hightor,
That is a partisan dodge, Hightor. I have no problem answering this question.

1. There is no way this type of story would change my vote. If we find out that Biden has tax problem, even outright fraud, I am still voting for Biden.

2. Joe Biden's son was paid a ridiculous sum by a Ukrainian gas company for no discernable reason other than his connection to the Vice President. It this doesn't bother you then nothing matters to you outside of your partisan bubble.

The undecided voters are undecided because they are afraid of liberal extremism. People who love Trump are not undecided voters, to be undecided you need to have been pushed away by both sides.

To win their votes, Biden needs to reach out to these undecided voters who have been alienated by the left. The key is for Biden to convince these voters that he understands their fears and won't kowtow to the angry women in pink hats.

These stories don't help. These undecided voters already know who Trump is, that isn't the problem. The problem is the on the left.



Sturgis
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 01:48 pm
@farmerman,
I would rather he doesn't get the Nixon treatment.

Placing Trump in a prison outfit and putting him away for an extended time, might serve as a warning and wake-up for others who are doing or considering similar stunts.

Politicians have been given an easy time for far too long. It's about time they faced the same thing that the average person has to. Especially, since the politicians crafted most of these laws that they now disrespect.
hightor
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 02:37 pm
@maxdancona,
Quote:
That is a partisan dodge, Hightor.

No it isn't. Your trolling, posturing, and holier than thou attitude get tiresome. I don't have to play your games. I simply wished to make a point about career politicians versus outsiders. I've never understood the appeal of having a businessman in high political office. Especially someone with Trump's limited experience in real estate and reality TV.
Quote:
Joe Biden's son was paid a ridiculous sum by a Ukrainian gas company for no discernable reason other than his connection to the Vice President. It this doesn't bother you then nothing matters to you outside of your partisan bubble.

I've dealt with the Hunter Biden stories during the impeachment. There's no "partisan bubble"; it's a problem which is endemic to international corporatism, not an indictment of Joe Biden's candidacy. It appears trivial, an attempt to smear the candidate by trying to tar his son.
maxdancona
 
  4  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 02:46 pm
@hightor,
You are right, Hightor. You don't have to play my games. You are playing because you choose to. By the way "holier than thou" is a new one... I will add it to my ever increasing list.

The game is this.

People on the left are making a big deal over Trump's taxes (which don't really matter to the country).

People on the right are making a big deal over Hunter Biden selling access to his father (which doesn't really matter to the country.

It does, in fact, seem like an awfully silly game, especially given the fact that we have important things to talk. And that the only effect this story has is to make the far left more smug.

And yet here we are.


0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  5  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 02:59 pm
@engineer,
Let's see them. I don't want to see someone's opinion over stolen documents, I want to see them to make an informed opinion myself.

There is no evidence that they actually have Trump's actual tax returns or something made up on a computer somewhere and are now calling them Trump's tax returns.

Hell, they may just have a fart in the wind.

Let's see the NYT print the tax returns please.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  4  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 04:00 pm
@Sturgis,
Sturgis wrote:

I would rather he doesn't get the Nixon treatment.

Placing Trump in a prison outfit and putting him away for an extended time, might serve as a warning and wake-up for others who are doing or considering similar stunts.

Politicians have been given an easy time for far too long. It's about time they faced the same thing that the average person has to. Especially, since the politicians crafted most of these laws that they now disrespect.

Obama first.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  4  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 04:05 pm
Quote:
NYT ‘Refused To Listen’ Says Trump Atty Over ‘Fake News’ Trump Tax Returns

The NYT has been called out. They cannot produce what they do not have.

Quote:
While we tried to explain this to the Times, they refused to listen and rejected our repeated request that they show us any of the documentation they purport to be relying on to substantiate their claims” added Garten. “Obviously this is just part of the Times’ ongoing smear campaign in the run up to the election” he added.

https://thegreggjarrett.com/nyt-refused-to-listen-says-trump-atty-over-fake-news-trump-tax-returns/?utm_source=socialflow
farmerman
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 05:20 pm
@coldjoint,
you guys are really panicking over these tax docs. It does make Trump a valuable asset to those to whom he owes th money eh? Conversely hes a danger to us.

I think the folks who are seeing this reasonably (lots of time spent on this very subject by two separate jurisdictions).
coldjoint
 
  5  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 05:22 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:

you guys are really panicking over these tax docs. It does make Trump a asset to those to whom he owes th money eh? Conversely hes a danger to us.

I think the folks who are seeing this reasonably (lots of time spent on this very subject by two separate jurisdictions).

Not at all. The panic is media manufactured bullshit. Anything else?
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2020 05:26 pm
Personally... I think the military story, where Trump insulted veterans, is a far more important story.
 

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