aside from Edgar (cause i already know) is anyone else familiar with Philip Wylie's "Generation of Vipers"? He wrote this in 1942;
Quote:It is asinine to presume that we can offer freedom of any sort to the world outside America, when we are steadily abdicating the basis of all freedom in our own communities. This, again, is a fact which has not been made apparent, evidently, to the Washington sachems, who continue to design great and statesmenlike plans for liberty and, at the same time, to usurp American liberty at every turn, not by any will of their own but because of public default.
There is a truly extraordinary and revelation-producing definition of 'myth' from Richard Hofstadter which I cannot locate. It begins (if memory serves) 'by myth, I do not mean...' and I will send five dollars to anyone who can find that for me.
Vietnamnurse<
Thank you for a very interesting post on Dubya.
Tartarin<
A more correct reading of Dubya's personality is that he is entitled to drive the country in his direction without any dissent.
Dubya's personality closely resembles the Divine Right of Kings philosophy of British history.
wh3, I almost called you tonight! I thought, heck it is probably 11 pm over there and maybe he is in bed, but nooooooooooo, *here* you are, lol!
I need some help over in that Google thread if you would be so inclined, or for that matter anyone *here*.
Perhaps I am rather on a roll tonight, but there has been some good **** rolling off the typing digits today on posts and blogs and such! Now, I must be a masochist for I may have offended two folks I care about here in a2k (Craven and sozobe) and I actually posted a political thread in abuzz. Well, it is a BIT hidden over there - I officially sent it to "History", and several other categories, NOT politics. It contains Mark Twain's War Prayer and the link to the full context, written about 1904. It came to mind since several posters here are mentioning some great passages.
Now, off to try to earn that 5 bucks.....such an offer I can't refuse!
On American Anti-Imperialism, see Richard
Hofstadter, "Cuba, the Philippines, and Manifest Destiny," in The Paranoid Style in American
Politics and Other Essays (Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1965)
betcha it is in here, edgar....
cobalt))))
I stepped in before I read your request here for help at the Google thread.
I did what I could . . . but those of us who are "old hands" at protests often write to those who refuse to comprehend.
I am up well past my bedtime. The TV gurus were all aghast that U.S. troops made it into Iraq. My, oh my.
Now to bed . . .
I'll give ten bucks to anyone who can come over here to my house and find my Hofstader book. I've just spent about 5 minutes looking for it and I can't find it anywhere. Otherwise, Blatham, I would be glad to help you out.
<ok! Now cobalt is rubbing her hands together anticipating the great fortune she may earn if she can just keep it together and find that quote and find that book! Wowie zowie, that $15 would come in handy now!>
OK, Lola? Did you try the back hallway shelves near the bedroom with the pretty wallpaper? I'm thinkin' the second shelf from the top, and maybe next to The Lord of the Flies? I know this is a 'reach' here, with this suggestion, but heck, it could just tip you off...lol!
Blatham, I will keep at it! Um.... tomorrow.... after I get some sleep. Like edgarblythe mentionned, I could show some restraint by not getting online with a2k before noon, my time. But then again....lol!
Thanks Cobalt, but I expect it's more likely in one of my book bags along with a lot of unpaid bills and a bank statement. Does that give you any little nudges as to where I might look for it further?
uh - oh! I think this means you left it in Claremont, right? I bet the young man that took over your apartment tossed it out and then a curb-shopper snagged it and sold it to the local used bookstore for a quarter (big money then, eh?) ahahahahhahahaha, I crack me up...lol!
Good night to you Dear Lady!
Cobalt
Yes, Hofstadter was an exceptional American historian, and as a side benefit, a very very good writer. "Anti-Intellectualism in American Life" ought to be compulsory reading (Lola has it...somewhere). But any book, portion, or essay will reward the reader.
The definition I refer to was first told me by an English prof, but whatever notes I had it written down in are no longer to be found. A few years ago, I found it via google, but lost the hard drive where it was stored. Yesterday, google failed me. Tartarin's quote from Faludi brought it to mind, of course.
Yay!!! I found it. My mistake was to put it on the bookshelf where it belongs. When I finally decided to look in this unlikely place, there it was right between Rush Limbaugh Is A Big Fat Idiot and The Joy of Sex. Perfect place for it. ....................
Well, I've just read the book from front to back and have failed to find the quote. But here's a good one for everybody:"as that indefatigable saver of souls, Dwight L. Moody, once put it: 'It makes no difference how you get a man to God, provided you get him there."
Went looking for Hofstadter on myths just for the big prize and found some interesting stuff, noodling and googling around:
Anatol Lieven is writing about American academics, but he might as well be discussing philosophers and economists more generally. And that reference to the "reality of others" has the same effect on my anti-relativist sensibilities as someone running their fingernails down the school blackboard has on my insides. That said, I found his piece in OpenDemocracy both powerful and unsettling. I believe - unlike Lieven it would seem - that peoples everywhere have a right of a democratic and law-governed state. But does Richard Perle believe that? Probably not. Lieven's piece is a warning about the dangers of a "liberal imperialist" project. Here's a typically provocative paragraph:
I'm sure that, contra Lieven, plenty of liberal Americans will speak for themselves, but as to the rhetoric of co-option, I think he's got a point.
http://junius.blogspot.com/
Actually, I figure whoever wins it gets to call it what they want. I see it as nothing more or less than a battle in the War on Terrorism. Some folks don't see it that way. I disagree with them, but whattayagonnado? Interpersonally parsing arguments and trading clever jibes hasn't got much to do with whether the current Persian Gulf Unpleasantness is properly called a war or not, as far as I can see.
timber<
So many names have been bandied about for this current war. I think historians will be the judge of which one sticks.
I'm sure there will be two names (if not more) that will be commonly used in the near future. It will be the act of history that decides the final name, as williamhenry so aptly points out.
"Actually, I figure whoever wins it gets to call it what they want."
That's true, Timber, they do. And then ol' history comes along and proves them bloody fools or just another bunch of venal politicians...
