being the scarlet woman to my 45 year old geo teacher....

... um, if you read some of the earlier posts, Mintcake has been rather encouraging of her teacher's attentions, too. Not thayt I'm excusing his behaviour for a minute!

I know. Im not being judgemental. Its where does she go from here, thats my focus

Yes, it is a 2 way street ;-)

I didn't say you were being judgemental, farmerman. Perish the thought! :wink:

I'm curious about where Mintcake gets the information about what the fella's wife thinks and says and does. Have the two women sat down together to talk about this? If not - then she's only got one side of a story - told by someone with a very specific goal in mind.

Dangerous stuff.

Her teacher friend tells her.

I'll be stuffy.

What would your parents say and why would they say that?

Mintcake-- please, please, please think of his kids and wife. You do not want to be the kind of woman that steals another woman's husband. If we women would only think of each other and not mess each other over, there would be a lot fewer marriages split up by cheating.

You need to realize that, even if she's made a mistake too, even if he feels like he's not in love with her right now, if you don't get in the way, they might be able to save their marriage and preserve their family. If he doesn't have someone else to leave her for, maybe he'll stay and they can work things out. As a person whose parents split, thanks in large part to the interference of "the other woman" (someone you do not want to be like), and whose family life is now in shreds, I wish you would not take part in helping to destroy some one else's family.

Stay away and let them heal their marriage if they can. Find your own man, for your sake and his family's sake.

msolga, you asked if it's the secrecy aspect that I find attractive : no. It is not attractive. It is ugly and difficult and means I cannot talk to Stephen even close to the amount that I would like to. Granted, it's extra nice when I do get to spend time with him because time is so hard to get but as far as 'ooh ahh how mysterious' goes... no. It is not glamourous. Because it is so difficult we occasionally end up having ridiculous liasons in his office which are extremely dangerous and risky for him especially, but that is the 'nature of the beast' as it were. Later this year I'm going on a sports trip with him and some other students down South which is planning to be 'interesting' :wink: ... and were going on a school trip which he is going to drop me home afterwards... so there are a few things planned... but the secrecy.. it is not attractive.

Secondly: phoenix was saying I should get someone my own age. Alright... nice theory... but for one- I don't want anyone else. and for two- everyone my age I find exceedingly boring and immature... taking drugs, getting drunk, getting grounded, petty arguments, sex obsessed..... 18 year olds... well, I don't really like A LOT of them.

Farmersman, you were saying about how I'd get bored in future. We've known one another for a fair while and were great friends before any of this 'romantic' stuff ever occured. He is incredibly intelligent and I am very quick witted and we share many common interests. We know eachother very well, he says he thinks I'm wonderful and interesting... and likewise.

ehBeth... I get the info, as msolga stated, from Steve himself. I have met his wife a couple of times however... and he appears to show no signs of sexual attraction toward her. I am very observant and he definitely doesn't show her the same deep concentration and thought that he shows me.

Noddy asked about my parents... My parents are extremely understanding and I have beaten about the bush on this subject and the gist of what they said was "If it makes you happy, it's okay. Although we would be upset that you have split up a marriage and we would be concerned that he is so much older and you'll have to care for him." However, they have no idea there's something between Stephen and I, they believe my queries were simply about some related thing- age-gaps or something...

Lastly I was advised to think very carefully about his children and his wife... Yes... It would be very upsetting for his children to have a part-time dad. He does not love his wife and is always bitching about what a cow she is. He has said, if we were to get found out be mistake he would definitely stay with me (that could just be because he wouldn't have a wife to go to anymore... ). And also, he doesn't have twin boys as I said before (I'M SORRY!!!) ... (I said that because I was worried about him finding this and reading it) he actually has 2 girls. A four year old and a 6 monther. The 6 monther, he doesn't love and hasn't bonded with at all... and he thinks it may be because she was concieved after he fell out of love with his wife... but the loss to those little girls would be felt far more by the elder and as he does not love his second child, I can't see it very likely that he will make a very good father to her.

Update: today... in geo... his wife came in with his younger daughter- still in a carrier. The last time I saw her (his wife) was about a year and a half ago and I hadn't remembered her being so happy and pretty. He was not all that happy to see her and showed the baby no affection. But I could see when he looked at me he was saying sorry for making me feel bad. He apologised profusely afterwards and said, nothing has changed, I think youre absolutely wonderful and I will always feel this way.

he tells YOU he doesn't love his wife!!! you do not know what he tells her. Men in his situation often tell the other woman that their wife "just doesn't understand me" and they've fallen out of love (boo hoo, poor me), those are pretty classic lines. You do not know the intimate details of their marriage, no one but the two of them knows what is really between them. many relationships go thru difficult times and people even feel that they don't love each other for a time. But if you get out of the picture, maybe he will put his energy into fixing his marriage and his familylife.

Yeah... youre right that only the two of them truly know what's going on- and even then, only the individual knows how they feel....... and I have no idea what would happen to their marriage if I backed off... He has come into work a couple of times extremely angry with her and has almost walked out..... but then even so... how do you ever know anything at unless you have an aspect of trust in people?

Mintcake

I've read what you have to say & here's what I think after all this:

* You are a bright & perceptive young woman. I really hope you make the most of your talents & do the best for your future via your education. No matter what happens in your life, later on, this will stand you in good stead. Don't be diverted. I can't state this more strongly. This is going to have a HUGE impact on the rest of your life! Focus!

* Stephen needs to address the problems in his own life. They're not going to go away. And he MUST stop using you as a crutch to ease his own pain & confusion. What he is doing is not fair to you (especially!) & also his family. Sometimes things get difficult in "adult lives" & we just have to cope with the problems as best we can. Stephen is not exactly doing this & I believe it's wrong of him to use one of his best students to help him through the confusion. His family is not going to go away. Remember that.

Good luck in this, Mintcake. It's a very difficult position to be in.

Everyone, especially msolga... Thank you so much for this. Everyone's made sure I completely understand everything that's going on that I may have missed and although I've thought about everything for so long, after a while I started getting paranoid, confused and going round in circles. I'm not sure what steps I'll take from here... I think maybe I'll discuss it with him and tell him that he needs to have very solid, firm grounding as to where he stands and how he feels in his own life before I can go any further or even contemplate progress. It's so difficult because I'm so attached... I'm not about to run a mile- as some people suggested was in my best interest... I want to be there for him (as he's a really good friend and means a great deal to me) and when he knows what's going on... PROPERLY... maybe I can start to have an idea. Thank you again, this site is really awesome. I'll return your help asap where ever I can.

Just one last thing, Mintcake: Let your head rule your heart a little more! And do take your time! (You have lots of it, after all!) Think very carefully before you commit yourself to something very serious with long-term consequences. And never, ever lose track of your own, personal long term goals in all of this. THAT is the important thing.

Good luck!

Hey Mintcake, you know what? I was reading along and thought, "5 y-o twins? Huh. Sounds like a baby situation." And lo and behold...

If this guy's wife has a 6-month-old baby, you came along right when she was pregnant, an absolutely prime time for this sort of thing. He could have an OK but not great relationship with his wife, but is not getting as much nookie as usual because of the pregnancy and aftermath.

This is really all terribly textbook. Everything you say makes me like him less. I am very, very suspicious of the "my wife had an affair" line -- in addition to what farmerman says about interest, it is a nice way to allay guilt. He might be doing something wrong, sure, but she did first... :-?

My mom was in a very, very similar situation, same age, same circumstances except the man was a church figure. It messed her up in deep and persistent ways. It later developed that while she thought she was the only one, she wasn't, by a long shot -- it was a pattern that started before her and continued after her, along with some concurrent liasons.

I also dated my teacher when I was in high school. He wasn't married though. I was 16, he was 32. We dated during my junoir and senoir years.
Thankfully, we never had sex. We decided we would wait until I turned 18 which didn't happen until the Oct. after gradutation. I was away at college at the time and we ended up breaking up before I came home for Christmas break. I would call him from school and tell about everything that was going on, and he would get upset because he had experienced that such a long time before I did. That's when we realized it would never work out. It was very painful for me. When I think back about it I get very angry at him. I was just a young girl, very impressionable, and he was a grown man. He knew better, and I feel very used by him. I would meet him at different places on the weekends while all of my friends were out having fun that teenagers should be having at that age. I missed out on a lot of wonderful things.
You might think you're in love but trust me, you're just being minipulated.
I thought I would die with out him. Now I am sickened by him.
You deserve to grow old with your husband, not watch him grow old.
His golden years will not be yours.....ever!

Mintcake, I don't give a rat's arse about the age difference. What I do care about is that you are getting involved with a man who has a prior commitment. He has some business to take care of before he is able to have a relationship with you ro anyone else for that matter. If he doesn't love his wife ad wants to get out of the marriage, let him prove it. If not, you're going to be just another broken heart.

What you are feeling is flattery at an older man's attention. Don't be fooled into thinking it's love.

hey minty, i was re-reading what you said about not liking 18 year olds for various reasons, and i know EXACTLY how you feel about that part anyway.. i could never meet a guy when I was in high school (actually, this is still true even into my twenties) that wasn't all about drinking, drugs, or just plain stupid. Thought I would never meet anyone, kept going out with losers just to be with anyone at all, but would be driven off by the stupid behavior.

But in time i met a guy who felt just like I did about all that, and we're still together five years later. We have an age diff. too (although I'm the older one) because I felt, just like you, that I had to look outside my immediate age group to find anyone. I see where you're coming from, and it is hard to not fit in w/ your age group, but it just doesn't make it okay to mess up someone else's relationship. When you do find a boy who is yours and yours alone, think how much you'd hate someone who came between you. Don't give Stephen an excuse to give up on his marriage.

Hang in there, you'll find someone that is a great match for you that isn't already with someone else.

I think you should date me instead. I'm so much younger than he is!

Ahhh... kickycan. You didn't let me down. Excellent post. haha.