Can Souls in Hell be Forgiven and Saved and Go to Heaven?

@neologist,

More than that, you should come up with some different bullsh*t which doesn't rely on people just taking your word for the meaning of scripture, or just swallowing your belief set whole.

0 Replies

@neologist,

neologist wrote:

Actually, I was dismissing the possibility

On what basis?

Since none of us have any real knowledge of the nature of God if he exists, or of any afterlife that might exist, there doesn't seem to be any basis for dismissing any possibility.

0 Replies

@neologist,

Quote:

I'm a bit confused by your argument about the mortality of the soul. I contend the soul loses consciousness at death. and can hope only in the resurrection and the time when death will be destroyed.

Thank you...that is all I wanted to know...

Quote:

I'm having some difficulty unwrapping the thoughts behind your questions. I'll try this one:

I suspected that you would...no offense...because I wanted to show you that one can only know what they personally believe, or personally do not believe...and why they do, or do not...and as long as one is willing to be intellectually honest and acknowledge God...and even if they do not since God is everything...one can not know what another does believe or does not...nor do they know what one should believe or should not...and why...

Would they not live on forever, as you have asked me if I was willing to deny about Adam and Eve? What is the difference? . .

Quote:

I believe the question centered around Adam and Eve - would they still be here had they not sinned? My answer is yes and the difference is we would not have experienced centuries of human travail and misery. Does that answer your question?

I already knew my answer, and what you were asking me...I had given you my answers in question forms...so that you would ask yourself your own question that you had asked me...

Your question was: Am I ready to deny that Adam and Eve would still be alive had they not sinned?

My answer: Never...the penalty of sin is death...

I agree with exactly what you are saying, and I know exactly why I am...but I could never explain why you believe what you do...unless you wanted to explain why...

My personal answer about Adam and Eve is the reason I believe that Jesus Christ is who he is...Who do you think that Jesus Christ is? And why?

0 Replies

@neologist,

neologist wrote:

You could say that, of course, but my 'prejudices' are based on biblical fact.

Your prejudices are based on your biblical interpretations which you try to pass off as fact.

Quote:

The difference between spiritual and actual death should be obvious.

Obviously it is not, otherwise we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

Quote:

The Bible is clear about the condition of those who have died. And it is clear that the 'sons of the (true) God' mentioned in Genesis 6:2 were (are) spirits who may no longer materialize as before. They are not dead (yet); but they are restricted, or 'in prison'.

Neither 1 Peter 3 or 4 make reference to “the sons of God.” You are making a logical leap to support your theological presuppositions.

1 Reply

@SN95,

First, there is no point to discussing the afterlife as we are currently not there, and cannot communicate with anyone who is there. As far as your comment is concerned, you make the assumption that you can even have thought in heaven. From what I understand and makes sense, is that heaven is some sort of perfect place. In order for it to be perfect, you need to have mindless entities living there, because as soon as you beccome concious and have free will, and free disire, you can no longer be entirely happy because for happiness and good to exist you must have evil. Therefore to be in heaven, you will just have to be a happy robot without real thoughts or conciousness.

If the soul exsist, it is simply an energy and not a conciousness. If you go to heaven, you will not have pain because your family is not there, you will actually not feel anything, if its truely heaven. You will just be close to the creator which makes it heaven. This is my theory, but it is just pointless to discuss, as it cannot be proved, but it sure is interesting. Hope this helps.

1 Reply

@carlosc2dbz,

An interesting thought Carlos, a couple of questions to perhaps help you consider your theory

Can you be happy without thoughts or conciousness?
What is your definition of evil?

0 Replies

@InfraBlue,

InfraBlue wrote:

. . . Neither 1 Peter 3 or 4 make reference to “the sons of God.” You are making a logical leap to support your theological presuppositions.

Read 1 Peter 3:19,20 again. If you still don't see it, we are not in the same library

0 Replies

@extra medium,

You go there to be cleansed of your sins so your soul changes since you don't think or do things the same anymore and became a new you

0 Replies

@extra medium,

Extra Medium asked- "I did read the Bible, and I don't recall it actually explicitly stating "Once you are in Hell, you no longer have any chance for forgiveness, for Redemption."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Once in hell, never out!
Check Luke 16:26- "..between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us".
Seems logical to me, I mean people have the free will to become Jesus's buddy during their lifetimes, so it's Game Over at the point of death, they had their chance.. Wink

1 Reply

@Romeo Fabulini,

Acts 24:15 (KJV)

And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.

1 Reply

@Intrepid,

Also:
(John 5:28, 29)" . . .Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear his voice 29 and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life, those who practiced vile things to a resurrection of judgment."

As far as I can tell, judgment of the unrighteous is not effected until after they have had a chance to learn the truth. After all, many millions, if not billions, have gone through life without the benefit of scripture.

0 Replies

There are cults and individuals around who desperately patch together obscure bible verses to try to "prove" that God is going to give everybody a "second chance" to accept him, so according to them, it'll go something like this on judgment day-
GOD- "Okay you lot, I've got mansions in paradise waiting for you IF you now admit you were wrong to reject me and Jesus all your lives"
THEM- "Yes yes yes we were wrong!"
GOD- "That's alright then, come on!".. Smile

The stark reality is that hell is NOT fitted with a revolving door!
Once in never out!-
Jesus parable - "..between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us" (Luke 16:26)

No chance for them to play it again.. Smile

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/ricks.jpg~original

2 Replies

@Romeo Fabulini,

Note the expression 'memorial tombs'. Not all who have died are in the memorial tombs. Also, many who are brought back in the resurrection will eventually experience the second death.

You are dancing around with the parable of the rich man and Lazarus as if it were not a parable.

0 Replies

On Judgement day we ALL get a wake-up call, christians, atheists, nonchristians, EVERYBODY!-
Jesus said:- "All in the graves shall come out,to resurrection or damnation" (John 5:28/29)
"Boiiing!"

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/ack-in-the-boxB.gif~original

Then true christians are airlifted off to that great Disneyland in the sky-
Jesus said "In my fathers house are many mansions..for you.." (John 14:2-6)

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/mansion.jpg~original

And sentence is pronounced on the rest-
"How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God under foot,....it is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God" (Hebrews 10:29-31)

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/fury.gif

And they get sent to the slammer with no chance of parole, but at least will be able to make lots of new friends there.. Wink

Jesus said:-"..they will go away to eternal punishment.." (Matt 25:46)

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/prison-dorm_zpsa33f0b0d.jpg~original

Waddya say Jimmy?
"Huuh....huuh...huuh"

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/White-Heat_zpseafd4ca5.jpg~original

1 Reply

@Romeo Fabulini,

No, not EVERYBODY.
But many.
I did a search of about 10 different translations and found that most render the last few words of vs 29 as “resurrection of judgment”.Since the majority of the world's population have not had the benefit of scripture, one should then ask “On what should they be judged?” If on their past life, what is the purpose of resurrection? If they are first to be taught, then judged, that would make sense according to God's mercy. It would also be in keeping with Isaiah 65:20

I'm glad you are not God

0 Replies

@Romeo Fabulini,

Romeo Fabulini wrote:

There are cults and individuals around who desperately patch together obscure bible verses to try to "prove" that God is going to give everybody a "second chance" to accept him, so according to them, it'll go something like this on judgment day-

There are individuals around who desperately patch together obscure bible verses to "prove" that God does not exist or that the believers do not have a future based on redemption.

0 Replies

God said- "Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? Do not I fill heaven and earth? "(Jer 23:24)
"For in him we live and move and have our being" (Acts 17:28)
so in a sense God is like "The Force" in Star Wars, a force of decency and honour that humans have always been able to tap into if they really wanted to, and no doubt people sensed that Force and tried tapping into it before Jesus was born.
Jesus simply made it easier to tap in by being an "iconic front man" a solid flesh-and-blood human figure we could relate to.
As for those who lived before he was born, God will cut them some slack-
"In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent." (Acts 17:30)
JC was an alright guy, so who would want to reject him anyway? You want an iconic figure? Here ya go.. Smile

Jesus said to the snooty priests-
"You're full of ****!"

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/Jesus-v-snoots.gif

"The prostitutes are entering God's kingdom ahead of you, you think you look good in your fancy robes but inside you're full of filth and corruption!" (Matt 21:32/Matt 23:27)

1 Reply

@Romeo Fabulini,

While it's true the word '****' appears in the KJV, it does not appear in words attributed to Jesus. His words to the scribes and Pharisees are no less scathing without it, however. I just wonder why you felt it necessary to us it.

You mention those who lived before Jesus was born would be cut some slack. Since they had not part in the New Covenant and only a very few had a part in the Old Covenant, what do you say is their eventuality?

0 Replies

Neologist mate, you're a Jehovah's Witness aren't you?
That certainly explains why you're always trying to over-complicate the Bible and put a new slant on it in line with this JW doctrine-
"If you try to study the Bible without our help,you go into darkness" (Watchtower 15 Sep 1910,page 298 )

JW-ism is a "vanity cult" that appeals to those who like to think they know better than the rest of us.
For example JW's think Jesus was crucified on a stake instead of a cross, you gotta be kidding us boy.. Wink

2 Replies

@Romeo Fabulini,

Romeo Fabulini wrote:

Neologist mate, you're a Jehovah's Witness aren't you?

You figured that out in a hurry.

Romeo Fabulini wrote:

. . . ..For example JW's think Jesus was crucified on a stake instead of a cross, you gotta be kidding us boy.. .

Well, he was executed on a 'stauros'. Look it up yourself. Plenty of argument both ways, (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_of_Jesus'_crucifixion)

But why the controversy?
Could it have anything to do with the use of the cross as a phallic representation in pagan worship?

0 Replies

Can Souls in Hell be Forgiven and Saved and Go to Heaven?

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know