19
   

What chances does Trump have to win the 2020 election?

 
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 05:53 am
@livinglava,
Forgiving student loans is a horribly regressive policy that will never pass the legislature if Warren becomes president.

If that hair-brained policy could ever pass and become law, then I would NOT support Warrens candidacy. As it stands it’s an impossible dream (and she knows it) so it won’t factor in my decision.
engineer
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 06:23 am
Trump has a lot of advantages he did not have in 2016. He has a ton of money (compared to the stripped down campaign he ran in 2016). He has the support of a unified party and control of all the state organizations. That and he still has the support of the base that elected him. No one who voted for Trump in 2016 is going to change his vote in 2020 so the Democrats will have to win on turnout.
revelette1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 06:37 am
@engineer,
Agreed. I haven't seen a lot of enthusiasm in my area, but it is still early yet.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 07:46 am
@engineer,
engineer wrote:

No one who voted for Trump in 2016 is going to change his vote in 2020 so the Democrats will have to win on turnout.


This is a ridiculous thing to say. Of course there are people who voted for Trump who are in play if the Democrats reach out to them. Trump's approval ratings are lower than his popular vote.

Obama reached out to White middle class voters. Clinton called them deplorable. These voters are absolutely in play if the Democrats stop playing to their angry, insulting wing.

The Democrats need to reach out to working class white voters to win key states like Ohio and Pennsylvania. This doesn't mean that Democrats need to abandon progressive values like health care and immigration. It means they have to build a coalition and treat voters with respect.

If the Democrats follow this circle the wagons, f*ck the the rest of the country strategy... they deserve to lose.
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 08:02 am
@maxdancona,
The Democrats will win in 2020 if they reach out to voters instead of insulting them. That is what is so frustrating about this.

The Democrats have about 35% of the electorate that they can count on as hard core supporters. The idea that you can focus on "turnout" while ignoring (or insulting) 65% of the electorate is laughable.

They are going to have to resch out to more voters, and they are going to have to figure out a way to push back on their more extreme base.


It is doubtful they will be able to do this, the ideological base won't allow it. That is very frustrating.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 01:29 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

engineer wrote:

No one who voted for Trump in 2016 is going to change his vote in 2020 so the Democrats will have to win on turnout.

This is a ridiculous thing to say. Of course there are people who voted for Trump who are in play ...

Not sure why you say that. Trump has overwhelmingly delivered on all his campaign commitments to all parts of his governing coalition and polls show they have gone from luke warm support to overwhelming support. He promised to beat the crap out of minorities and deliver conservative judges to the religious right and he delivered the judges in spades. He promised to beat the crap out of minorities and deliver a tax cut to the anti-tax crowd and he delivered the tax cut. He promised to beat the crap out of minorities and curtail free trade to the protectionist wing and he delivered massive tariffs and of course he promised to beat the crap out of minorities to those who want to beat the crap out of minorities and he delivered there too. We've got carrier groups and B52 bombers moving to the Persian gulf for the NeoCons to fight off the Iranian threat, no troops in Syria because we don't want foreign entanglements and we're out of the Paris climate accord because we don't kowtow to international organizations. I live in close to a 50/50 state and I don't know a single Trump voter who has the slightest remorse over their vote or who would consider voting for someone else this cycle.
Quote:
Trump's approval ratings are lower than his popular vote.

Sure. So were Obama's at this point in his first term (Gallup had Obama at 47 favorable, 47 unfavorable compared to Trump at 46/50). Trump's approval ratings were lower than his popular vote in the last election but he's President.
coldjoint
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 01:51 pm
Quote:
I live in close to a 50/50 state and I don't know a single Trump voter who has the slightest remorse over their vote or who would consider voting for someone else this cycle.

Honesty is quite refreshing. No ill will or innuendo meant to the poster.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 02:20 pm
@engineer,
What you seem to be saying is there is no point in Democrats reaching out to Trump voters. Correct me if that is not what you are saying. I find that ridiculous.

1. I took a quick look at the polls. There are recent polls, including Pew that say that people would again vote for Trump against Clinton. This doesn't mean that they won't vote for a Democratic candidate against Trump in 2020. It only means they would vote for Hillary Clinton.

2. Other polls suggest people think Trump is doing better than expected. This doesnt mean that people won't vote for a Democratic candidate I. 2020.

3. Trump's approval ratings are still below water. And polling on healthcare significantly favor the Democrats.

4. Polls including Pew also say that many of us reget having voted for Clinton. This suggests that your strategy is even worse.

There is no reason to think that the Democrats can't earn the votes of middle Americans if they sinply treat them with respect.... and every reason to think they will lose if they don't.



neptuneblue
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 02:53 pm
@maxdancona,
Question: Which of the 22, count them 22, candidates that are running on the Democratic ticket for 2020 are named Hilary Clinton?

Which one of the 22 candidates called anybody deplorable? Or wear pink hats? Or any hats?

Which of the 22 candidates have not treated middle Americans with respect?
revelette1
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 03:05 pm
@engineer,
True, my humble state of KY voted for 62.5% for Trump and I seriously doubt he is going to have trouble in KY no matter who wins. Going by the last time my husband's side of the family got together, they love him still.

Although looking back a minute ago on google, I see Sanders didn't lose too badly to Hillary. Sanders just don't seem to be getting quite the same excitement this time around. (48.8 to 48.3)
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  4  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 03:06 pm
@engineer,
All Trump supporters in my circle continue to be supporters. I don’t know anyone who is even considering another republican candidate should a primary occur, and they sure as **** are not considering a Democrat.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 03:14 pm
@neptuneblue,
Quote:
Which of the 22 candidates have not treated middle Americans with respect?

Salwell and Booker want their guns. That is disrespecting citizens, many want open borders that disrespects Americans. Deciding who is qualified based on gender or color disrespects Americans. I think you are looking at a landslide. New York, California and Illinois are your only sure things. I forgot New Jersey.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 03:58 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Correct me if that is not what you are saying.

Ok.
engineer wrote:

Trump has a lot of advantages he did not have in 2016. He has a ton of money (compared to the stripped down campaign he ran in 2016). He has the support of a unified party and control of all the state organizations. That and he still has the support of the base that elected him. No one who voted for Trump in 2016 is going to change his vote in 2020 so the Democrats will have to win on turnout.

Democrats will win not by playing Republican identity politics, but by putting an agenda out there that promotes all Americans, something that gets people off the couch and into the booth on election day.
maxdancona
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 03:58 pm
@neptuneblue,
Gillebrand has already jumped the shark by insulting voter outside of a narrow ideological bubble. There are a few others who are close behind.

We will have to see about the others.

The best candidate will earn my vote and the votes of people like me while doing enough to keep people like you cam enough to let them win.

Getting the angry white women in pink hats to shut up enough to not turn away middle American voters is the key to a Democratic victory.

maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 04:01 pm
@engineer,
Repúblican identity politics??? Lol. That is like talking about the Democratic gun nuts.

I agree with you .. If you are saying that Democrats need to reach out beyond their base and work for every vote.
0 Replies
 
neptuneblue
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 04:08 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
Gillebrand has already jumped the shark by insulting voter outside of a narrow ideological bubble. There are a few others who are close behind.


I must have missed that. Could you please link it?
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 06:31 pm
@neptuneblue,
Gillibrand annoyed me, any any other Americans with her attacks on Al Franken and her comments on the #MeToo movement that many of us found ridiculous. You can google it yourself. You will probably think that we are just ignorant sexist jerks who shouldn't be taken ... and that is exactly my point.

To win, the Democratic candidate is going to have to reach out to White working class voters in states like Ohio and Pennsylvania (and half of them will be White men). Obama convinced a significant number of these voters to vote for him twice... these voters are not out of reach.

Trump's strategy for these voters is simple. He isn't really popular. Trump will will tell these voters that the Democrats are an angry elitist self-righteous mob that hates them. Hillary made it easy for Trump to convince these voters that she didn't respect them. If he successfully does that again, he will win again.

The Democrats need to find a candidate who can reach out to a significant number of voters outside of their base. If the angry pink hat people have their way and this election becomes a referendum on the "patriarchy"... Trump will win again.

The Democrats can win this election... the burning question is whether they can can get their outraged base to calm down and let them talk to people outside their ideological bubble..
neptuneblue
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 06:53 pm
@maxdancona,
I think you forget that I reside in the Great State of Ohio. I knew Trump won the state. Outside Cleveland and sporadic parts of Columbus and Cincinnati, it was ALL Trump.

The DNC has all but given up on Ohio. It's a shame, Ohio has been known to be a swing state for a long time.

I also think you seem to forget half the population in America IS women. For all of your rhetoric about angry women in pink hats, you fail to recognize WHY that is. You can google domestic violence and rape statistics yourself. It's a problem, Max. A problem that needs addressed by ALL, including white males.

You're asking me to curb my anger about sweeping these issues under the rug. It's just not going to happen.

oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 06:58 pm
@neptuneblue,
neptuneblue wrote:
I think you forget that I reside in the Great State of Ohio.

You guys stole Toledo from us. Mad
neptuneblue
 
  2  
Reply Mon 13 May, 2019 07:03 pm
@oralloy,
Do you want it back?
 

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