If Jesus died to forgive us, then why is there a Hell?

@Smileyrius,

Smileyrius wrote:

You are also right that when discussing scripture, I do indeed conflate the two. The Greek translators saw fit to equate the two in their rendering, and I wouldn't imagine that anyone taught from the Septuagint would do otherwise.

Do you have data that condemns the notion or is your line of thought that the notion is a stretch of the data available?

I wasn't referring to the Septuagint translators, I was referring to the New Testament writers.

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@InfraBlue,

I appreciate that Infra, from which texts were the authors and early translators of the Christian Greek Scripture taught from?

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@Smileyrius,

The Hebrew texts also make reference to the dead, their spirits and their abode, e.g. Job 26:5, Psalm 88:11, Isaiah 14:9, etc.

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@InfraBlue,

A lot like 'sleeping wiith the fish', but when sheol and the dead finally are stirred up, it will be in the resurrection promised by Jesus at John 5:28-29. Until then, the dead are unconscious, their thoughts having perished as noted in Psalm 146:4, knowing nothing as noted by Solomon at Ecclesiastes 9:5

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@Caesar,

Christ's vicarious sacrifice covers two issues: death and hell. Death is conquered for all regardless of how they lived; that is, all will be resurrected. Hell is defined as permanent separation from God. That is, one can only return to God on condition of repentance. In other words, Christ's atonement; the paying the debt of one's sins, only applies to those who repent. Since not everyone will choose to repent, not all will return to dwell with God.

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Insanity, cruelty. Brainwashing poor kids like that is nothing short of institutionalized child abuse.

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@FBM,

Jeffrey Dahmer was atheist just like you.

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@Patches,

Patches wrote:

Jeffrey Dahmer was atheist just like you.

What's your point? Hitler was a Christian. Neither of those statements have the slightest bearing on whether or not you can provide evidence for your god-heaven-hell claim. Got anything better than a logical fallacy (non sequitur) to offer?

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@FBM,

Quote:

Hitler was a Christian.

Hitler thought he was Christian until he discovered himself to be the second anti-Christ. Your story is similar. You do not believe that you could be against someone who does not exist. But God does exist and you are against Him and His people. You are just too stupid to see it.

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@Patches,

Patches wrote:

Quote:
Hitler was a Christian.
Hitler thought he was Christian until he discovered himself to be the second anti-Christ. Your story is similar. You do not believe that you could be against someone who does not exist. But God does exist and you are against Him and His people. You are just too stupid to see it.

Again, all of this is your claim, but the real question is whether or not you have any genuine evidence to support it. You seem to keep dodging that.

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@FBM,

Quote:

Again, all of this is your claim, but the real question is whether or not you have any genuine evidence to support it. You seem to keep dodging that.

You have no excuse because I have already shown you a photograph of the Holy Spirit.

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@Patches,

Patches wrote:

Quote:
Again, all of this is your claim, but the real question is whether or not you have any genuine evidence to support it. You seem to keep dodging that.
You have no excuse because I have already shown you a photograph of the Holy Spirit.

And you've been shown over and over and over again how and why that photograph is not evidence for anything. It's shocking that you would side with a church that protects pedophiles and terrifies young children with threats of eternal hellfire, all while having nothing more than an easily faked image and anecdotes about moments of personal mental confusion to go on. Shocking and sad. If you want me or anyone else to accept your claim and join up with the pedophile protectors and child terrorizers, you're going to have to do a helluva lot better than that. And a helluva lot better than pie-in-the-sky, feel-good videos of how wonderful it is to have your imaginary friend.

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@Patches,

Patches wrote:

Hitler thought he was Christian until he discovered himself to be the second anti-Christ. . .

When was that?

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@neologist,

Quote:

When was that?

Just before he went to visit his predecessor Napoleon's grave. What?...do you think that he was just a Christian who loved to burn bibles and slaughter Jews?

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http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb192/DinahFyre/we-tolerate-no-one-in-our-ranks-who-attacks-the-ideas-of-christianity-our-movement-is-christian-adolf-hitler1.jpg

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb192/DinahFyre/christian_hitler.jpg

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@neologist,

The passages I've cited contradict yours, your dogma notwithstanding.

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@InfraBlue,

My dogma just bit your ankle

Quote:

Psalm 6:6 (NIV)
Among the dead no one proclaims your name.
Who praises you from the grave?

Quote:

Psalm 88:10-11New International Version (NIV)
10 Do you show your wonders to the dead?
Do their spirits rise up and praise you?
11 Is your love declared in the grave,
your faithfulness in Destruction?

All seems to validate Solomon's observations.
None of those folks seem capable of anything.
Woof!

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@Patches,

I wrote:

When was that?

Patches wrote:

Just before he went to visit his predecessor Napoleon's grave. What?...do you think that he was just a Christian who loved to burn bibles and slaughter Jews?

Do you have any proof? News copy, etc.?

And are you saying Napoleon was also an antichrist?

How about Torquemada?

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@neologist,

Those passages are contradicted by the ones I've cited as well.

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@InfraBlue,

Arf

You cited Psalm 88:11
As did I
Bow Wow!

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If Jesus died to forgive us, then why is there a Hell?

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