0
   

Should DeLay resign

 
 
chiczaira
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 09:54 pm
Ticomaya has nailed it--He said the important thing is "why the death".

Were the martyrs of the Catholic Church stupid when they offered themselves up for slaughter rather than give up their religion?

Were the Japanese Kamakazi stupid when they committed suicide for their country?

Were the thousands of Russians who fought at Stalingrad crazy when they died in the bitter cold?

Were the true believers in abolition out of their heads when they offered up their lives to abolish slavery in the Civil War.
Ticomaya has it right...The WHY is important.

As for the the rationale for the present conflict in Iraq, History will be the judge but it must be noted that unlike LBJ, President Bush has not been abandoned by the votes because of the war. Bush was re-elected to a second term.

Now, in the minds of some, the voters may have been naive or mistaken, but that does not count. What counts is being re-elected.
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Apr, 2005 02:56 pm
Search AP Story Archive Apr 14, 2:13 PM EDT
Bush Calls DeLay an Effective Leader

By LAURIE KELLMAN
Quote:
Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) -- President Bush said Thursday that embattled House Majority Leader Tom DeLay has been an effective leader and he looks forward to continue working with him despite the charges of ethical violations that the congressman is fighting.

DeLay has come under close scrutiny in recent weeks following news stories questioning the financing behind a few of his overseas trips. The congressman and his aides have consistently denied he knowingly violating the law and the House ethics committee has been unable to operate because members are deadlocked in a dispute over rules for launching an investigation.

Bush told the American Society of Newspaper Editors that he expects that Delay will cooperate with an investigation.

"As I read his comments today, he wants the ethics committee to review his case, and he's willing to step up and talk to the ethics committee about it," Bush said. "And secondly, I'm looking forward to working with Tom. He's been a very effective leader. We've gotten a lot done in the legislature."
Bush laughed off an editor's question about whether he agrees with DeLay that the "liberal news media" are responsible for his troubles. "Of course not!" Bush exclaimed and then chuckled.

Democrats and Republicans are using the ethics turmoil surrounding DeLay to wage a rhetorical duel accusing each other of skirting tough debates on Social Security, gas prices and judges.

Hyperbole, no stranger on Capitol Hill, is a key weapon in a fight tightly coordinated by party leaders.

Republicans lunged first on Wednesday, accusing Democrats of exploiting questions about who paid for two of DeLay's trips abroad.
"Tom DeLay did nothing wrong," Rep. Todd Tiahrt, R-Kan., told reporters after the weekly GOP caucus meeting. "There's no evidence of any breaking of the House rules. What this is, is a political smear campaign made by an organization, a political party that is devoid of ideas."


Continued:
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/D/DELAY_FALLOUT?SITE=1010WINS&SECTION=POLITICS&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Of course he didn't he is as pure of the driven snow. Embarrassed And that from our most moral highness Bush.
0 Replies
 
chiczaira
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Apr, 2005 08:42 pm
au 1929- You said it. Look at poor Bill Clinton- They impeached him for "nothing"--"sex"-- What DeLay allegedly did is fifty times worse. Corrupting the government. It' is just too bad that Clinton couldn't leave his zipper alone. The Republicans took over the House, the Senate, the Presidency, have most of the Governorships and are the majority in most of the State Legislatures--just because of "sex"

<Maybe we should get a pair that could never be tarred with the "sex" brush/ What about Hillary Clinton for President and Barney Frank for Vice President?
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Apr, 2005 07:04 am
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/D/DELAY_TANCREDO?SITE=WFAT&SECTION=HOME

Apr 16, 8:46 AM EDT

GOP Congressman Urges DeLay to Step Aside

By SUZANNE GAMBOA
Associated Press Writer





Quote:
WASHINGTON (AP) -- One of Congress' most conservative members on Friday became the second House Republican to urge Majority Leader Tom DeLay to step aside because of the ethics scrutiny he's facing.

"If the majority leader were to temporarily step aside so that these trumped up charges can be dealt with in a less hostile environment, as they have proven to be an unnecessary distraction, it may be a productive move," said Rep. Tom Tancredo, R-Colo.
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Apr, 2005 07:17 am
My guess that DeLay will be hard pressed to give up the goose that lays the golden eggs. But in the end if he has any integrety at all,which is very much in doubt, he will step down. Or will he?
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Apr, 2005 04:34 pm
tancredo is one of the republicans, along with hagle, that i believe come across as realistic and moderate. i may not agree with everything they say, but i respect them and find them good for the mix.

create a better congress, without delay... Laughing
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Apr, 2005 05:46 pm
pretty good little slogan, dtom.
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Apr, 2005 06:03 pm
revel wrote:
pretty good little slogan, dtom.


hahahaha! thanks revel. how's things with you ? ya gonna go up ta luavull for the derby week fun ?

been tryin' to put together a derby party here, but nobody, including my wife gets it. "what? you want people to come over and watch a 2 minute race ???" Rolling Eyes

guess i might as well take my colonel's commission off the wall... Confused
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Apr, 2005 06:08 pm
My husband has a tradition where he goes to a local club and puts in a bet, so I guess we won't be travelling up your way. When we was divorced for a while he went up there and collected quite a few glasses, but now it is back to the club. I guess being married don't inspire that kind of a thing.

My grandpa used to bet the races so it was a hot issue in our house growing so I am not really into it.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Apr, 2005 06:09 pm
I have way too many years of experience with Tancredo, the guy makes the KKK look like church camp watermelon fest.
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 01:15 am
revel wrote:
My husband has a tradition where he goes to a local club and puts in a bet, so I guess we won't be travelling up your way. When we was divorced for a while he went up there and collected quite a few glasses, but now it is back to the club. I guess being married don't inspire that kind of a thing.

My grandpa used to bet the races so it was a hot issue in our house growing so I am not really into it.


don't feel too funny, briar(ette). i was into it for a while... from reading too many books by charles bukowski ( don't ask... Laughing ), the downs (both of 'em), hollywood park, aquaduct, santa anita, belmont, yadda yadda. all with my big $2 bets. hahahahahaa! i figured if i won enough to pay for parking, a ticket, a beer and a hotdog, it was a fun day out in the sun. my guitar player was a different story. that was the early '80s. and most of the horses he gave me hot tips on are still running for the finish line. Laughing

now the bein' hitched an' all. derby week in luavull t'aint so much about the race as it is the barbecue, music, riverboat races (submarine races for the young'uns ) and generally havin' a good time. no bettin' required.

grab mysteryman on the way up, he's earned a nice cold one with some hushpuppies. :wink:
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 05:40 am
In the unlikely event that we will be coming, will most definintly do. You would have to have some bloody mary's for my husband though along with the beer. Diet RC is fine for me. Do you know you can really only find RC around in southern Kentucky areas mostly?
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 05:49 am
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/18/politics/18ethics.html?oref=login


April 18, 2005
With Changes to House Ethics Rules, Standoff May Emerge
By CARL HULSE


WASHINGTON, April 17 - When Representative Tom DeLay appeared last year before an ethics panel investigating bribery accusations surrounding a Medicare vote, lawmakers conducting the confidential inquiry let him know they had collected substantial sworn testimony about what took place.

What they did not tell Mr. DeLay, the majority leader, was exactly what they knew, giving them added leverage as they questioned him.

Mr. DeLay, speaking under oath, then gave a candid account of how he offered to endorse, in a primary election, the son of a Republican congressman in exchange for the congressman's vote on a prescription drug bill, confirming the exchange that was at the heart of one of Mr. DeLay's three ethics admonishments last year.

Now, past and present leaders of the House ethics panel say rules changes that grew out of Republican resentment over the treatment of Mr. DeLay and others are threatening to put the committee on too short a leash. The escalating partisan clash over the legalistic details of the ethics process has paralyzed the panel at a moment of intense scrutiny of Mr. DeLay's conduct and has highlighted anew the historical difficulty of politicians judging other politicians.

"We cannot organize a bipartisan House ethics committee with a partisan process," said Representative Alan B. Mollohan of West Virginia, the senior Democrat on the panel, officially known as the Committee on Standards of Official Conduct.

Incensed over rules changes that originated in the office of Speaker J. Dennis Hastert without the consultation of House Democrats, committee members or staff, Mr. Mollohan is refusing to allow the panel - the only House committee split evenly between Democrats and Republicans - to organize while he pushes to reverse the changes.

Republicans, including Mr. DeLay, say the revisions are intended to better protect the rights of lawmakers and to give those who find themselves accused of misconduct a presumption of innocence and protection from politically motivated attacks. "What some partisans had found, that if there was no agreement and charges brought against a member, the member would be hung out to dry," Mr. DeLay said Thursday on the House floor.

Other Republicans say Democrats want the ethics committee to founder. "The Democrats want to keep the ethics committee shut down so they can keep lobbing charge after charge at our members without the ethics committee coming to any conclusion," said Ron Bonjean, spokesman for Mr. Hastert.

At the center of the rules fight are three basic changes: one to allow the dismissal of a complaint if a majority of the panel cannot agree on how to proceed after 45 days, another to allow lawyers to represent multiple participants in any inquiry and a third to allow lawmakers a chance to respond if they are to be named in committee reports.

Republican officials say they did not believe the scale of the changes merited a review by a two-party task force like those that produced ethics reforms in the 1980's and 1990's. But Democrats and a few Republicans say the way the revisions were drafted and forced through the House in January was an affront to the bipartisan nature of the panel.

Representative Barney Frank, Democrat of Massachusetts, was critical of the process, saying Sunday on "Meet the Press" on NBC: "Hey, look, let me be very straightforward here. I, 15 years ago, had a problem because I behaved inappropriately. The ethics committee stepped in. Newt Gingrich had a problem. He was reprimanded; the ethics committee stepped in. The difference between us and Mr. DeLay is, I think, we changed our behavior. Mr. DeLay changed the ethics committee."

The potential automatic dismissal of a complaint has drawn much of the attention, but the rule on legal representation is also troubling to veterans of the ethics committee. Mr. Mollohan said the panel had been moving toward a recommendation to prohibit lawyers from representing both a subject of inquiry and other witnesses when the leadership went in the opposite direction.

Committee veterans said one of their chief tactics in cases like the Medicare investigation was collecting information from others before confronting those central to the incident, an advantage that could disappear if one lawyer is serving both the subject and others being called to testify.

"It is so easy to coordinate witnesses and skew the case," said Representative Joel Hefley, Republican of Colorado and the former chairman who was removed from the ethics panel this year by Mr. Hastert. "What you want is a good, honest answer."

Republicans say that the right to counsel of one's choice is a basic element of the American legal system and that it is up to lawyers to know when their representation could create a conflict between clients.

The least contentious change is the one giving lawmakers the chance to respond if they are to be cited by the panel. It also arose from the Medicare inquiry after Representative Candice S. Miller, Republican of Michigan, was admonished for her role but given no notification that she was to be singled out in a public report. Both Republicans and Democrats agree with the underlying concept, though they disagree on how to achieve it.

The chief change at issue is the requirement for dismissing a complaint if the panel remains deadlocked after 45 days. Under the old system, an impasse would trigger the creation of an investigatory subcommittee.
In reality, officials on both sides say, that point was never reached in earlier inquiries, because the panel came to terms on how to proceed. But the prospect of an automatic investigation, many say, created a climate that led panel members to resolve a complaint.

Critics say the new rule eliminates the incentive for negotiating and instead gives committee members of either party the power to run out the clock. "What we have created is the ability of both sides to stop investigations in their tracks," said Representative Steny H. Hoyer of Maryland, the No. 2 Democrat in the House. "Both sides."

Republican officials say that the previous system was unfair to lawmakers because it could lead to a prolonged review of their cases and that the mere suggestion of a lingering investigation can be poisonous to a political career. But Republican leaders are also becoming uneasy about the prospect of an extended fight over the ethics committee and are beginning to seek some accommodation with Mr. Mollohan and the Democrats.

While the impasse continues, both sides say they hope a compromise can be reached. "You need an ethics committee for the institution," Mr. Hefley said.
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 11:32 am
revel wrote:
In the unlikely event that we will be coming, will most definintly do. You would have to have some bloody mary's for my husband though along with the beer. Diet RC is fine for me. Do you know you can really only find RC around in southern Kentucky areas mostly?


really? i've never seen it out here, but when i was kid, they had it in cinnci when we lived there for a couple of years. it was still called the full on "royal crown cola" back then. and kfc was still kentucky fried chicken. man! i still love that stuff ! my cardiologist would wack me one if he saw me eatin' it though. luckily ( Confused ), they just don't make it right in our area. it either comes out like it's waiting for the sweet and sour sauce or a dollup of hummus.

change. humppphhh... neve' done nobody no good a'tall, durnnit! Laughing
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 01:14 pm
You can get RC cola all over Texas. Great stuff.

The best, however, unbeatable, great-tasting cola is.... Dr. Pepper made with cane sugar instead of High Fructose Corn Syrup. It's like heaven on the tongue and actually is better for ya than the regular stuff.

You can only get it in small bottles (10 oz.), and it's hard to find outside of country stores here in Texas.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 01:22 pm
coke in the 8 oz. bottle... ummm-ummm!
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 02:40 pm
Quote:
KEEPING UP THE HEAT ON DELAY

House Majority Leader Tom DeLay continues to take the slings and arrows of the mainstream media and the left. The anti-DeLay jihad seems to be aimed at running him out of Congress, making the Republican party look bad and perhaps most importantly, creating a juicy target for their Democrat fund raising appeals. The left needs a bogeyman to raise money, and for the moment, DeLay is it.

So in the case of the liberals vs. Tom DeLay, let's take a look at the facts and review the charges. Last week the New York Times ran a story reporting that DeLay had hired family members to work on his campaigns and his political action committee. Not long after that, it was reported that scores of other House members did the same thing about 48 Senators and representatives ... both Democrats and Republicans. Nothing there.

Then there was the trip to Russia. The media reported that DeLay's 1997 trip was paid for by lobbyists. Imagine that...he must be a crook! Well, not so fast. The trip was paid for by a non-profit organization, and many members of Congress do the same thing all the time. Again, nothing there.

Now the Democrats are howling about the change in the House ethics committee rules sought by DeLay. He had been the target of a political investigation, so he decided the rules should be changed. At least one member of the other party on the committee has to agree to conduct an investigation of a member. That's the "abuse of power" that Democrats are talking about. Was it politically smart to change the ethics rules? Probably not. But an abuse of power? Hardly.

Apparently DeLay has a relationship with a shady lobbyist who allegedly paid for some of DeLay's overseas trips. That's against the rules. But it won't be investigated without at least one Republican on the ethics committee agreeing to let it happen. We'll see.

Democrats have their lightning rod. Most of what they're accusing DeLay of doing is done everyday by other members of Congress. Perhaps that doesn't make it right...but it sure doesn't make it unique.

If DeLay deserves to go down over anything, it's his despicable conduct threatening federal judges in the Terri Schiavo case.
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 02:50 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
If DeLay deserves to go down over anything, it's his despicable conduct threatening federal judges in the Terri Schiavo case.


if for nothing else is right.

hey tico, if ya check out lime wire there's a "wish you were here" synced to 2001: a space odyssy floating around in the music video search.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 03:12 pm
DontTreadOnMe wrote:
hey tico, if ya check out lime wire there's a "wish you were here" synced to 2001: a space odyssy floating around in the music video search.


Thanks. I'm going to have to get that when I get my broadband working at home. Still haven't fixed it yet.
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Apr, 2005 04:54 pm
Overreaching on Judges

The Monitor's View

Leading the charge against "activist" judges in the House, Texas Republican Tom DeLay is himself in danger of wrongheaded activism on this issue.
In the Monitor
Tuesday, 04/19/05
Taking steps to fulfill his promise that judges in the Terri Schiavo case would "answer for their behavior," majority leader DeLay last week asked the House Judiciary Committee to investigate federal court decisions related to the case, and come up with possible legislation. Mr. DeLay is furious with the judges for not intervening, calling the judiciary "out of control."

He may have since apologized for his "inartful" language, but he remains intent on bringing to heel judges who create laws from the bench, and who have ruled against social conservatives on such issues as having "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance.

The Constitution gives Congress considerable power over the federal courts. But how it wields that power is something DeLay and and his colleagues should consider more deeply.

While he did not specify what kind of legislation the Judiciary Committee might come up with, DeLay pointed to past House legislation (it failed in the Senate) that would have broken up the liberal Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, and removed federal courts' jurisdiction over certain issues such as the Pledge of Allegiance.

Perhaps DeLay was nonspecific because of existing legislation to restrict federal jurisdiction. The proposed Constitution Restoration Act - in both the House and Senate - would restrict federal courts from cases involving the acknowledgment of God. Violation of this and other provisions would be an impeachable offense. Indeed, a cry is rising among some conservatives for "mass impeachments" of judges who don't strictly interpret the Constitution.

Congress has rarely impeached a judge - only seven times in the nation's history, and mostly for crimes. To impeach judges for their interpretation of the Constitution would undermine the finality of the law, and reinforce the notion that there's always a way to get around a ruling one doesn't like. Such a practice would turn Congress itself into a court, violating the judiciary's independence, and prompting judges to look over their shoulder to consider what Congress might think of a ruling.

Congressional limiting of federal jurisdiction is also rare, concerning far less controversial subjects than God and the law (for instance, establishing a dollar threshold for certain cases to be heard). Meanwhile, barring an issue from federal courts simply shoves it down to the state courts.

The federal courts are not infallible. And they've had to take on more social issues because legislatures have failed, through extreme partisanship like DeLay's, to resolve these issues.

The way to address disappointment with judges is not through congressional activism, but through the usual mechanisms: proper vetting of judicial appointments and the election of able politicians who make and confirm those appointments.
0 Replies
 
 

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