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Bush supporters' aftermath thread

 
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Mon 7 Feb, 2005 12:47 pm
Quote:
Blatham,

Clean your ears out. There was an open invitation for you to visit Corazon anytime. We don't limit our hospitality only to those who agree with us. Aunt Bea and I seldom agree on political matters, but she remains dear to our hearts. I had hoped to see more of Dys and Diane once they moved to Albuquerque, but so far we haven't. The Fox lives within a mile and we still haven't met face to face, but she's certainly welcome here anytime at all.


ash

Here at a2k, we have evolved from even the most miserly attempts to bi-partisanship or objectivity. Each word and sentence aims for the heart. We assume now that the cup of coffee arriving at our table is poisoned, and that the buxom waitress has blood-soaked scissors under her apron.
The evangelicals here at a2k have it right...these are the end times.

Aside from that, good day to you and your wife.
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OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Mon 7 Feb, 2005 12:48 pm
Good on you Asherman. I should have such class... and in case there is any doubt; your words are never wasted and I'm holding my place in line to purchase your book should you ever choose to write one.

Ps. Wow, you even welcome those pesky, whiny, Preston wannabes. A real giant among men that makes you.
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Ethel2
 
  1  
Reply Mon 7 Feb, 2005 12:51 pm
The best public relations technique is necessary in politics....necessary because of the reality of the way man thinks. We must evaluate the message that is being sold, if we are to make a responsible decision. We must be able to think critically about the message and make up our minds based on our ability to question and reason logically.

(1)
Quote:
The conscious and intelligtent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. We are governed our minds molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of. This is a logical result of the way in which our democratic society is organized.


(2)
Quote:
The driving force which has brought about the most tremendous revolutions on this earth has never been a body of scientific teaching which has gained power over the masses, but always a devotion which has inspired them, and often a kind of hysteria which has urged them into action. Whoever wishes to win over the masses must know the key that will open the door to their hearts . . . [i.e.] to follow the lead of the great mass in such a way that from the living emotion of his hearers the apt word which he needed would be suggested to him and in its turn this would go straight to the heart of the hearers.


(3)
Quote:
No serious sociologist any longer believes that the voice of the people expresses any divine or specially wise and lofty idea. The voice of the people expresses the mind of the people, and that mind is made up for it by the group leaders in whom it believes and by those persons who understand the manipulation of public opinion. It is composed of inherited prejudices and symbols and cliches and verbal formulas supplied to them by the leaders . . .

The political leader of today should be a leader as finely versed in the technique of propaganda as in political economy and civics. If he remains merely the reflection of the average intelligence of his community he might as well go out of politics. If one is dealing with a democracy in which the herd and the group follow those whom they recognize as leaders, why should not the young men training for leadership be trained in its technique as well as in its idealiam?


Some of you may recognize the first quote from Mein Kampt. Hitler knew how to sway an audience. And the audience was sway-able because of the horrible economic conditions produced by the decisions made at Versailles. It was not his technique, however that created the Holocaust, it was his message. Here's a sample, from Chapter XII, volume 1 of Mein Kampf

Quote:

Whoever wishes to win over the masses must know the key that will open the door to their hearts. It is not objectivity, which is a feckless attitude, but a determined will, backed up by force, when necessary.

The soul of the masses can be won only if those who lead the movement for that purpose are determined not merely to carry through the positive struggle for their own aims but are also determined to destroy the enemy that opposes them. When they see an uncompromising onslaught against an adversary the people have at all times taken this as a proof that right is on the side of the active aggressor; but if the aggressor should go only half-way and fail to push home his success by driving his opponent entirely from the scene of action, the people will look upon this as a sign that the aggressor is uncertain of the justice of his own cause and his half-way policy may even be an acknowledgment that his cause is unjust.

The masses are but a part of Nature herself. Their feeling is such that they cannot understand mutual hand-shakings between men who are declared enemies. Their wish is to see the stronger side win and the weaker wiped out or subjected unconditionally to the will of the stronger.

The nationalization of the masses can be successfully achieved only if, in the positive struggle to win the soul of the people, those who spread the international poison among them are exterminated.


and of course their's much more where that came from, in which Hitler speaks of the ""pure racial stock." Bad idea.

The second quote is from the man who quoted Hitler inBraveNew World Revisited

And the third is a quotation from propaganda by Edward Bernays, Sigmund Freud's nephew, commonly referred to as the Father of Public Relations.
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JustWonders
 
  1  
Reply Mon 7 Feb, 2005 04:31 pm
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JustWonders
 
  1  
Reply Mon 7 Feb, 2005 04:55 pm
And...in case you missed this during the game yesterday, or like me, just want to see it again. Here it is:

THE BEST SUPER BOWL COMMERCIAL EVER
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 06:39 am
Oh dear!

Asherman has acutely noticed that I have no particular opinion on anything.Why shouldn't I filter out "anything and everything" that,in the past,has called my "views" into question.That is the learning process.If I expressed a view and it was called into question I would learn from that.I'm assuming that "call my views into question" means a succesful challenge and,as such,would refine my views to the point of them vanishing.It is called debate.And I've had plenty of that.

It isn't that I am in favour of the war.It is that the war is a logical necessity driven by destiny.I was in favour of just such a war before 9/11.And I don't think losing it would be a good thing.That implies further logical necessities which I don't see anybody facing up to.What we ex-military in GB see is a war being fought without any real sacrifices being made by the sponsoring populations.As far as I am concerned war means total war and my fundamental objection to Asherman's piece was that it was too easy to shoot down and thus provided waverers with an opportunity to sound like they have a case.There should be no ambiguities and slippery phrases in a pro-war argument because that stuff makes war sound like an afternoon punt up the river which.as anybody who has been there will tell you,is not the case.You can't fight a war in an armchair in front of the TV.Most people have no idea how patronising news media and comment can sound at the front line.I wouldn't sully this thread by quoting some of the things I have heard,and said myself,on that subject.
What Asherman seemed to me to be attempting was to be pro-war and sound civilised at the same time.Well war isn't civilised just like the "eagle blazon" we see so often is not a civilised emblem.It is,as everybody knows,a bird of prey.It is a good example of how a cliche can become meaningless up to the point of it being refreshed.If I have shocked anybody by refreshing it so be it.We have the 3 lions.

This war has been going on for hundreds of years.Saddam called this phase "The mother of all battles" and it surely is.Once WMDs are on the agenda all kidding and polite discussion are off it.
Views are irrelevant.Mr Bush can't just sit there and wait for the next big trick.
I'm happy Asherman hasn't taken offence because none was intended.I was trying to push him into 100% mode.Don't EVER forget Suez.If our loyal ally had backed us on that we wouldn't be where we are today.And anybody who puts any real faith in this Iraqi militia needs to go back to school.And you didn't ought to forget the IRA collecting boxes in the US either.That was hard to take.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 07:33 am
We are well represented by a tree leaf.
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 07:51 am
MG:-

It's cute.I like it.But it is passe.As Spiro Agnew once said "the meek will inherit the earth when the strong have finished with it."And there's plenty more where he came from to slightly quote Rider Haggard.

We all love pacifists.We just don't allow them anywhere near the levers.I will refrain from describing what would happen if we did.

Hey-I'm not a drunkard.A quiet drink every night in terrible company is my limit.

MG must mean Maple Glucoseychops.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 08:24 am
dear spendiago

Those levers, in the right hands, tiipped South Africa rather gently.

What's your beverage?
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 08:42 am
MG:-

John Smith's No Nonsense Best Bitter@ £1.70 per pot full including fluffy white froth beard tickler so reminiscent of the good old days.

It's early days in S Africa.But it was cricket and rugby that brought them a bit nearer.Sport is a mighty force not noted for the pacifist tendency.Don't forget that the main man was Peter Hain who is now in the war cabinet and one of it's more militant members.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 09:37 am
Wrong end of telescope...Tutu and Mandella.

My freres have a taste for the brown beverage and after a couple might begin to speak of the many generations of Shropshire Latham beer chemists which apparently justify their appetite for the stuff. Now and again, I'll share a bottle or pint with them, except where they've made it themselves which I'll refuse utterly with absolutely no regard for their personal feelings. I'm consistent in this and treated our father's product with the same disdain. Wine is the thing. And BC bud, it goes without saying.
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 09:43 am
Going to see the archbishop is a euphemism here for seeing a old friend off to the seaside.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 10:09 am
But what is 'seeing a old friend off to the seaside' a euphemism for? You english are positively ruining my language.
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FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 10:13 am
Sounds like he's going to take a ****.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 10:17 am
Do people use euphemisms for that? How odd.
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FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 10:19 am
An episode of South Park comes to mind...
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DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 03:46 pm
blatham wrote:
And BC bud, it goes without saying.


nothin' lite about that stuff !! :wink:
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 07:18 pm
dtom

Yeah, I know. I was away for a long bit and then returned to a bowl of "holy jesussssssss"
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Feb, 2005 08:46 pm
Quote:
CONCORD, N.H. (AP) -- The former head of a Republican consulting group was sentenced Tuesday to five months in jail for jamming Democratic telephone lines in several New Hampshire cities during the 2002 election.

Allen Raymond, 37, who was president of the Alexandria, Va.-based GOP Marketplace LLC at the time, did not comment as he left the U.S. District Court sentencing. He also was fined $15,600.

He had pleaded guilty in June.

Court papers say Raymond and co-conspirators plotted to jam Democratic lines that voters could call for rides to the polls in Manchester, Nashua, Rochester and Claremont. A line run by the nonpartisan Manchester firefighters' union also was jammed.

The blizzard of more than 800 computer-generated calls lasted about 90 minutes on Nov. 5, 2002, as voters decided races for governor, U.S. senator and hundreds of other offices.

State Republicans acknowledged two years ago they hired GOP Marketplace. But then-Republican Chairwoman Jayne Millerick said the company was paid $15,600 for telemarketing services to encourage people to vote Republican, not to jam lines.

Chuck McGee, former executive director of the New Hampshire Republican Party, also pleaded guilty. He is scheduled to be sentenced next month.

James Tobin, 44, regional chairman of Bush's campaign last year, was indicted in December and pleaded innocent. Tobin, of Bangor, Maine, had stepped down from Bush's New England campaign in October after the allegations against him became public. In 2002, he was northeast political director of the party committee working to elect Republican senators.
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/national/AP-Phone-Jamming.html
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gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Feb, 2005 03:57 am
http://rmeek141.home.comcast.net/BittKerryEdwardsVote.JPG
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