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Fallen Soldier's Mom Arrested Outside Laura Bush Event!

 
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Sep, 2004 08:42 am
Steve (as 41oo) wrote:
Brandon wrote

Quote:
I do not subscribe to the idea that only easy wars should be fought.


It was because invading Iraq was seen as a push over that Bush was so keen on doing it. The regular Iraqi army was already on its knees

Please provide evidence to back up this interpretation. Bush said that he was invading Iraq because it presented a great danger to the west, not because it was easy, and I agree with him that it was a grave danger.

Steve (as 41oo) wrote:
Bush knew there was practically no chance of Saddam doing anything really nasty because he knew (although he didn't exactly tell us) that Saddam had very little and probably no wmd capability.

Many, many people believed that Hussein still had the WMD he had had previously, and that he might be developing more. Bush says that he believed this and that this was his reason for invading. I am inclined to agree because I favored invasion for just this reason long before Bush 2 came on the scene.

Steve (as 41oo) wrote:
...The fact is Brandon this is a neo imperialist war of aggression for the control of a resource rich and strategically important area.

No. It is because we had to protect ourselves against the specter of an invulnverable Saddam Hussein, attempting to dominate the Middle East with WMD, and actually using them. What is your evidence that it was for oil? And in what way was it for oil? Are we loading up our trucks with oil and stealing it? Are we coercing Iraq to sell oil to us at an unusually low price?

Steve (as 41oo) wrote:
You cant impose freedom and democracy by force from outside. Its something that grows organically from within

Why would you think that? Of course, it is better if democracy comes naturally from within a country, but it seems to me that we did this rather effectively in Japan after WW 2. Anyway, we invaded as a matter of national defense, and having removed the government, we have no choice but to try to leave them with functioning one. When we do things like this, naturally we choose to arrange for democratic elections.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Sep, 2004 10:20 am
Quote:
Many, many people believed that Hussein still had the WMD he had had previously, and that he might be developing more. Bush says that he believed this and that this was his reason for invading. I am inclined to agree because I favored invasion for just this reason long before Bush 2 came on the scene.


Then you, as well as others, should be willing to admit that you were wrong. Very wrong. Every piece of evidence that we have today shows this.

Can you say that, Brandon? I think that a truly objective person who espoused that particular opine should....

Quote:
Why would you think that? Of course, it is better if democracy comes naturally from within a country, but it seems to me that we did this rather effectively in Japan after WW 2.


Your comparison is heavily flawed.

To begin, Japan attacked US in WWII, not the other way around. There was no way for the people of the country to view us as imperialists; hell, their PREVIOUS governement, the one which we defeated, were the imperialists.

It is interesting to note that the reasons given for the war against Asia and America by the Japanese government were.... to bring peace and security to the region. Sound familiar?

After their defeat, Japan's entire culture changed immensely. They had attacked US and been found wanting; their islands were in ruins from U.S. bombing.

So what did we do? We put THEM to work rebuilding their country. NOT American contractors. We showed them that THEY could rebuild and innovate, that they didn't need their old government to be successful.

We haven't shown anything of the sort in Iraq. American Contractors are getting the profits off of the rebuilding; there are tons of unemployed Iraqi citizens right now, with nothing to do.

The comparison of the two countries is so far off as to be ridiculous.

Quote:
Anyway, we invaded as a matter of national defense, and having removed the government, we have no choice but to try to leave them with functioning one. When we do things like this, naturally we choose to arrange for democratic elections.


The concept that we invaded a country halfway around the world, as a matter of national defense, when there was little evidence that said country had ever or ever would attack us, is ludicrous.

Beyond ludicrous. It's national offense.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Dookiestix
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Sep, 2004 10:43 am
I would argue that it is a seriously ill-informed disillusionment that permeates the rightwinger's world. In clear display by brandon9000, the contradictions and lengthy ad-nauseam diatribes go so off track, with a smattering of irrelevant historical references, that it seems so far beyond ludicrous.

Truly unbelievable.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Sep, 2004 04:04 pm
Steve (as 41oo) wrote:
Quote:
...The fact is Brandon this is a neo imperialist war of aggression for the control of a resource rich and strategically important area.


to which Brandon replied

Quote:
No. It is because we had to protect ourselves against the specter of an invulnverable Saddam Hussein, attempting to dominate the Middle East with WMD, and actually using them. What is your evidence that it was for oil? And in what way was it for oil?


to which my riposte is

What is your evidence it was for wmd?


come on Brandon, we are all grown ups here. If the pro war faction were to say "of course it was about oil, we NEED oil", I might even agree.
0 Replies
 
 

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