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Rising fascism in the US

 
 
coluber2001
 
  3  
Tue 7 Jun, 2022 11:04 am
The Jan. 6 committee begins hearings with a big challenge: Capture public attention
Whether the public hearings will be considered a success for Democrats largely depends on what comes after and whether legislation or prosecutions follow.

June 6, 2022, 3:32 AM CDT
By Peter Nicholas and Scott Wong
Seldom has a set of congressional hearings opened amid so much anticipation and, at the same time, so little guarantee of success.

The House committee investigating the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol will hold the first of at least a half-dozen public hearings this week, having already promised stunning revelations that would lay bare just how dangerously close the U.S. came to losing its democracy.

“It’s all about democratic resiliency. Can we fortify our institutions and our people against insurrection, coups and violence?” Rep. Jamie Raskin, D-Md., a committee member, told NBC News. “I hope we will be able to spur the country to make the necessary reforms to solidify democracy.”

But what will success look like? The question has weighed on committee members and congressional Democrats who have invited the panel to present both a definitive accounting of the riot and tangible solutions to prevent another.

What comes later is likely to determine whether the committee’s work is judged a success or a failure, according to interviews with more than 20 committee members, other lawmakers, witnesses, congressional aides and political strategists.

As the panel sees it, the hearings can’t just come and go. Members are looking for accountability. The committee isn’t a law enforcement body, so it can’t prosecute anyone. Yet if members lay out a compelling story about the far-flung effort to deny Joe Biden his rightful victory, it could pressure the Justice Department to ramp up its own inquiry.

“I am really very hopeful that what [the committee] will produce will be a road map — not just for Congress, but for the Department of Justice and for the American people who want to preserve our democracy,” Rep. Veronica Escobar, D-Texas, who was trapped in the gallery of the House chamber during the riot on Jan. 6, 2021, said in an interview.

If the committee is to succeed on its own terms, members will need to stoke enough outrage that voters demand concrete actions preventing anyone else from subverting the peaceful transfer of power. They’ll need to leave a national audience sufficiently alarmed that the politicians and prosecutors who track public opinion decide they must act and act now.

That won’t be easy. A slew of leaks in the run-up to the hearings could leave viewers with a feeling they’ve heard it all before. What’s more, a year and a half after that harrowing afternoon when a violent mob tried to stop certification of Biden’s victory, many Americans have moved on. A Quinnipiac poll in January showed that 44 percent of the country believed too much was being made of the attack on the Capitol, compared to only 38 percent five months earlier.

There’s no doubt that the committee is well positioned to sway opinion. The first hearing will open in prime time with wide network news coverage (Fox News, a conservative outlet, didn’t respond to an inquiry about whether it would carry the hearing live). Over the course of the month, the panel will show video of the events surrounding Jan. 6 that the public has never seen , while publicizing hours of testimony from people tied to Donald Trump’s effort to overturn the election.

As the hearings unfold, members are expected to show that the Trump forces knew they had lost in 2020 yet pushed the baseless claim that the election was stolen anyway. They will lay out how the former president and his associates implored then-Vice President Mike Pence to block certification of Biden’s win even though he had no authority to do so as the electoral votes were tallied. And they’re likely to reveal what Trump did and didn’t do in the West Wing in the hours when a mob breached the Capitol in a violent effort to keep him in power.

Two witnesses who the committee hopes will testify publicly are Marc Short and Greg Jacob, senior Pence advisers who were with him in the Capitol when rioters stormed the building, looking to hang him.

A Republican who has informally advised committee members said: “There’s a sense within the committee that there is a very limited period for them to do this and win public opinion. There’s been this concern that even if they report their findings, does the Justice Department do anything with that? So they’re trying to figure out how to maximize telling the story to the public.”

Equally important to the committee is shoring up a democracy that, when it was challenged, proved more fragile than most Americans had suspected. A triumph for the committee would be for the hearings to advance legislation — now languishing in Congress — to stop candidates from exploiting ambiguities in the Electoral Count Act, the 19th century law that controls how presidents are elected. A bipartisan group of senators has been meeting quietly to revamp the law but has made scant progress.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/jan-6-committee-begins-hearings-big-challenge-capture-public-attention-rcna29868
0 Replies
 
coluber2001
 
  3  
Wed 8 Jun, 2022 02:04 am
The Thom Hartmann Program

What would a fascist American government look like?

0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  4  
Thu 9 Jun, 2022 08:36 am
@hightor,
Quote:
And political corruption Not Equal "fascism"

True. And rather obvious. But Lash's game is, and always has been, regurgitating the slime she reads to attack the Democratic Party, not making careful discernments.
coluber2001
 
  2  
Sat 11 Jun, 2022 12:28 pm
The Thom Hartmann Program
Canadians warn that American democracy could collapse.

Lash
 
  -4  
Sun 12 Jun, 2022 09:31 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Quote:
And political corruption Not Equal "fascism"

True. And rather obvious. But Lash's game is, and always has been, regurgitating the slime she reads to attack the Democratic Party, not making careful discernments.

Blatham’s afraid to have a fact-based argument with my points, so he relies completely on lies, ad hominem s to create stories about me in a weak attempt to avoid the truth about the Democrats.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Mon 13 Jun, 2022 08:00 am
@coluber2001,
Thanks.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -2  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 09:57 am
Once more, let me remind you what fascism is. I need not wear a brown shirt or a green shirt. Fascism begins the moment a ruling class, fearing the people may use their political democracy to gain economic democracy, begins to destroy political democracy in order to retain its power of exploitation and special privilege.


Tommy Douglas
Straight Through the Heart: How the Liberals Abandoned the Just Society
Lash
 
  -2  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 10:05 am
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

Once more, let me remind you what fascism is. I need not wear a brown shirt or a green shirt. Fascism begins the moment a ruling class, fearing the people may use their political democracy to gain economic democracy, begins to destroy political democracy in order to retain its power of exploitation and special privilege.


Tommy Douglas
Straight Through the Heart: How the Liberals Abandoned the Just Society

Superdelegates, corporations = free speech, Obama signing Monsanto Protection Act, unaffordable healthcare, separate and unequal education, institutional racism, federal money going to other countries without a vote, abortion rights decided without a vote, unaccountable lawmakers obviously taking bribe money with no accountability.

Fascism.

Lash
 
  -2  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 10:06 am
Stop accepting their premise.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 10:32 am
@Lash,
Do you really think that the political situation in Canada and the criticism of it can be so easily transferred to the USA?
US social democrats?
US liberals espousing the principles of liberalism?
Lash
 
  -1  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 01:29 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Yes. Don’t you?
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 01:36 pm
@Lash,
No.

Or do you have a (ruling) party following traditional liberalism?
A large Social Democratic Party in the USA?
Walter Hinteler
 
  4  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 01:41 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Or do you have a (ruling) party following traditional liberalism?
No
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 01:45 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
A large Social Democratic Party in the USA?
Yes, since the Democratic really is a member party of the Progressive Alliance.
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  4  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 01:47 pm
@Lash,
Quote:
unaffordable healthcare,
separate and unequal education,
federal money going to other countries without a vote,
abortion rights decided without a vote

These aren't facism. Not even the last two, because the virtually all governemtn decisions & laws are decided without direct vote by the public. Generally speaking, only constitutions get decided by direct vote by the public.

Others in your list are likely debatable
- no idea what Corporations=Free Speach means
- don't know anything about some of the others in your list, not being from around your countries

I would have said the rise in fascism is caused by:
- government believing they are an entity built to serve the government, or 'the country' rather than 'the people'. 'The Country' is problematic because they may come to see the government as the country.
- increasing surveillance laws to serve 'the government' (or 'the government' through 'the country')
- increasing censorship that stretches to include the government (they usually do this internally first, so the people have no idea how corrupt the government actually is)
- increasing use of PR/Progaganda
- centralisation of power in the hands of a few
- making the populace lose trust in the judiciary
- actions designed to leave specific political figures as the only trustworthy source of information & leadership for the country
- personal appoint of friends / politically aligned judges
etc

all of these move a country closer towards the point where it can become a dictatorship or fascist state
izzythepush
 
  1  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 02:26 pm
@vikorr,
America never had abortion rights enshrined in law.

Row v Wade is interpretation, not legislation.

Therefore it can be reinterpreted without legislation.
0 Replies
 
coluber2001
 
  2  
Tue 14 Jun, 2022 05:18 pm
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  1  
Wed 15 Jun, 2022 04:06 am
Quote:
George Orwell wrote in 1944 that "the word 'Fascism' is almost entirely meaningless. ... almost any English person would accept 'bully' as a synonym for 'Fascist,'" and in 1946 that "...'Fascism' has now no meaning except in so far as it signifies something not desirable."

wikipedia
blatham
 
  1  
Wed 15 Jun, 2022 11:17 am
@hightor,
Yup. Tommy Douglas was a well-respected, even heroic figure in our family as he was for many lefty Canadians. Our dad was a perennial NDP (Douglas' party) supporter. But that description he wrote of fascism is pretty awful.
Mame
 
  2  
Wed 15 Jun, 2022 11:41 am
@blatham,
Agreed on both counts. I've always thought Ed Broadbent and Jack Layton would have made excellent prime ministers. Rational, trustworthy, credible, and drama-free.
0 Replies
 
 

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