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Feminism (as seen by the GOP)

 
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Mar, 2016 05:21 pm
@revelette2,
Revelette, you are completely missing the point. Please answer these questions.

1) Why do you think that so few women are serving on corporate boards or in executive positions?

2) Why do you think so few fathers have equal responsibility for their children and involvement in their lives?

3) Why are your answers to these two questions so different?

The hypocrisy here is ridiculous. We are working hard as a society to help women gain equal positions of involvement and responsibility in business and in politics. Why not do the same for parenting? I don't know about you... but I consider my role as a parent and my involvement in the lives of my children as far more important than any professional goal. And yet, my ability to be a parent was questioned, and put at risk in court, simply because of my gender. This is wrong.

Your statistics make my point. Rather than challenging the gender stereotypes that lead to this inequality, you are supporting them. If children are so much more likely to live with their mother than their father... why would you actively obstruct fathers from having the responsibility and involvement in the lives of their children?

It makes absolutely zero sense to oppose fathers who want to have equal responsibility and involvement in their children's life. And that is what feminists are doing to the detriment of both fathers and children.

If feminism were about equality, there is no question that they would support equality in all areas of society and oppose gender stereotypes wherever they happen.
If you truly believe that society should be more equal, then you will support both women in corporate executive positions and fathers who are in the role of parent.

This is one place that modern feminism falls flat on its face.
TheCobbler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2016 04:15 am
It seems all understanding of what we are male and female begins with our DNA.

XX and XY (and all variations in between)

Does XX = XY?

One might argue well XX has two X's and XY has a unique Y.
But actually that Y is a mutation of an X

So XX has two complete X's

So XX is actually two full human chromosomes.

The Y chromosome came from an X.

X can turn into a Y again and again.

Y can never create X

...because Y has information missing from X.
revelette2
 
  2  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2016 06:13 am
@maxdancona,
Quote:
Your statistics make my point. Rather than challenging the gender stereotypes that lead to this inequality, you are supporting them. If children are so much more likely to live with their mother than their father... why would you actively obstruct fathers from having the responsibility and involvement in the lives of their children?


I never once said or implied I was actively seeking to deprive children from their fathers. In fact I said the opposite more than once. I think it is good idea to have some kind of movement such as the bullies movement to encourage fathers to be more active in their children's lives. Or to acknowledge those fathers who already have involvement in their children's day to day care in their lives.

As for custody issues, I think it should be decided on a case by case basis. If the mother in the home was the one who regular had the care of the children, then naturally she should have custody, the same is true for fathers who regularly had the care of the children in the home. If it was divided more or less equally, then shared custody. I don't see why this is a difficult.

Please stop putting words in my post I never said or implied.
TheCobbler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2016 06:43 am
@TheCobbler,
Do Male Cats Act Paternal and Fatherly Towards Kittens ...
http://pets.thenest.com/male-cats-act-paternal-fatherly-towards-kittens-9281.html
Other than siring as many kittens as possible, tom cats don't tend to get involved in the raising of the kittens. Male cats have been known to kill kittens, usually ...

Most cats, including domestic breeds, have 19 pairs of chromosomes for a total of 38. Some types of cat in South America, however, have only 36 chromosomes, including ocelots, kotkots and margays. Dogs have more than double the number of chromosomes with 39 pairs, while humans have 23 pairs.

It would seem that humans gaining a few chromosomes helped fix the problem in cats of the male part of the species killing the young.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  0  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2016 07:15 am
@revelette2,
You didn't answer the questions at the top of my post, Revelette. Those are the key to my challenge to your way of thinking.

You are quibbling about one justification of why it is OK that women are still given custody in the majority of cases. In my opinion your rationalization just reinforces existing gender stereotypes. But rather than quibble, let's look at the big picture.

You aren't answering the question about why this inequality persists in society. And you aren't explaining why feminism, which claims to be about equality, doesn't treat this example of inequality the same as other areas (such as greater positions of responsibility and power in business or politics).

TheCobbler's answer is that males are genetically deficient. I will assume that you, Revelette, don't agree. This means that we should work to give fathers equal rights, respect and responsibility and challenge the gender stereotypes that make this difficult rather than perpetuate them.

Equality means equality, in business, politics and in parenting.



revelette2
 
  2  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2016 09:06 am
@maxdancona,
I have never been an activist, nor am I a feminist. I am not going to going to work to get more father custody of children in court cases. I think it should be decided on a case by case basis like I have already said. There are cases where father's should be given custody, I don't deny it. There are much more cases where father's don't want custody have little to do with their children, nor do they pay child support. I have two daughters and a niece, I know it is like pulling teeth to get money out of them, much less spend time with their kids. You are simply on a rampage.

If there should be any kind of movement, it should be to get fathers who do not live in the home to be more involved with children and much more supportive for both their sakes but mostly their children. Children do need their fathers.
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2016 09:20 am
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:

I have never been an activist, nor am I a feminist.

That's too bad. I think all chicks should want equality. I think it's weird that you don't.

fem·i·nism
ˈfeməˌnizəm/Submit
noun
the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.

Quote:
If there should be any kind of movement, it should be to get fathers who do not live in the home to be more involved with children and much more supportive for both their sakes but mostly their children.

There is a movement. Fathers are tracked down and have their wages garnished to support their children. I'm sure in some cases, some guys get away with disappearing off the grid, but it is a formidable legal process in place to rectify abandonment by fathers.

However, the legal process in place that unfairly awards custody to the mother - before reviewing which parent might actually be the best primary caretaker - is not being challenged. That is wrong.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2016 09:55 am
@revelette2,
Revelette,

I appreciate that you are not a feminist. But your views on gender equality are demonstrably one sided.

Who do you think is the greater "deadbeat" when it comes to not paying child support?

1) Men who owe child support to custodial mothers?
2) Women who owe child support to custodial fathers?

Of course there are a lot more people in the first category (which in my opinion is a sign of the inequality that we are talking about). But yes, 32% of custodial fathers who are owed child support have not received any of the money owed them (compared to 25% of custodial mothers).

The facts don't support your one-sided narrative.


TheCobbler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Apr, 2016 02:10 pm
https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xlt1/v/t1.0-9/12994289_1780085155559631_2615969934080508583_n.jpg?oh=5a8cdeea697442eb22cee91b08503cde&oe=57B77A96
0 Replies
 
TheCobbler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Apr, 2016 02:13 pm
@maxdancona,
Do you have a shriveled Y? LOL!

maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Apr, 2016 06:25 pm
@TheCobbler,
Yes I do have a shriveled Y chromosome. But, on the bright side I can pee standing up, so it all works out in the end.

What is that space lady all about?
0 Replies
 
TheCobbler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2016 04:35 am
First Black military woman elected to Aviation Hall of Fame
http://m.phillytrib.com/news/first-black-military-woman-elected-to-aviation-hall-of-fame/article_55b55071-5f87-56e7-8cbd-e25512843d8c.html
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2016 06:49 am
@TheCobbler,
That is pretty cool Cobbler. Brenda Robinson is an impressive person.
0 Replies
 
Lilkanyon
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2016 04:31 pm
I am unhappy, and a bit angry that the feminism arguemnt, for a long time, broke down into the capabability of child rearing. Tbh? That all depends on the parent and how they are evaluated fairly. I do not believe that was the purpose of this subject. In a way, male and female will always butt heads as dems and repubs do. Its a difference of philosophy. If women were respected from the git, there would be no female revolution. Same time, if men didnt create war, women wouldnt understand money. If men didnt walk out on their families, women coulda been home caring for their kids. I know it sounds like men are to blame for the current "woman" revolution, but umm....Im struggling to defend why women should not be angry.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2016 05:12 pm
@Lilkanyon,
Most women are not angry.
Lilkanyon
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2016 05:40 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Most women are not angry.


According to who? But its really beside the point. We often think of women raising kids alone as a modern thing, but my great grandmother raised 8 kids alone and I heard the resentment of my great uncles having to cover the slack. My great grandfather walked out. He left her with 8 kids and no ability to feed them. Yet men of that day resisted women getting educated. Why would that not make us angry?
I have a wonderful husband, I am not a man hater nor a feminist. But we should, as women, be given the respect we require, to raise our children with dignity and a full belly, without the plague of disrespect that comes with raising a family unmanned.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2016 06:11 pm
@Lilkanyon,
According to women themselves, most women are not angry. I don't have any reason to doubt them. Less than 20% of women identify themselves as feminist. Women are not revolting (as you say they are).

I am a divorced father raising a child. I feel that men and women should equally be given the respect they desire to raise their children with dignity. I think most women would agree with this.

What is wrong with given both mothers and fathers dignity, respect and support?
TheCobbler
 
  3  
Reply Sun 17 Apr, 2016 04:22 pm
Catholic Archbishop says domestic violence is caused by women ‘not obeying men’
http://churchandstate.org.uk/2016/01/catholic-archbishop-says-domestic-violence-is-caused-by-women-not-obeying-men/

Comment:
Down with the Catholic Church, down with Republicans and down with the apostle Paul (who supposedly wrote this abysmal doctrine)!

Male chauvinist pigs obeying their libido!
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Apr, 2016 08:14 pm
@TheCobbler,
You really hate men, don't you Cobbler.
glitterbag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Apr, 2016 08:36 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

My father died when I was two years old. My mother had two more children with another man, and we lost our mother, because she favored here new children. I was left to my own devices since I was two. It's amazing that I managed to stay alive, because we lived close to the Sacramento River which we used to visit often, and played on the banks. We always heard stories of kids drowning.

Here's a recent report of a 24 year old man.
http://www.sacbee.com/news/local/article27873496.html



I am so sorry to hear your story. I can't imagine being abandoned at such a young age. I'm especially pained to hear your mother favored her new children over you and your siblings. Sometimes we lose touch with the ugly side of life or maybe the tragic side. I always admired my grandmother for surviving a horrible childhood, early mother-hood and a father who wanted nothing to do with the child he created. Her life wasn't easy, but she had ugh a lovely outlook on life. She never was bitter about the people who abandoned her, I'm sure it was an act of forgiveness or just a urge to live without rancor.
 

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