40
   

I'll Never Vote for Hillary Clinton

 
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Thu 2 Jun, 2016 08:00 pm
@snood,
I know, right? It is hard to believe she can't see it. I know she is smarter than this.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  0  
Thu 2 Jun, 2016 08:01 pm
@snood,
I've got this thing for equality.
snood
 
  1  
Thu 2 Jun, 2016 08:02 pm
@Lash,
You've got a thing, alright.
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  3  
Thu 2 Jun, 2016 09:25 pm
@Lash,
Quote Lash:
Quote:
Aren't any of you concerned about money in politics? Corruption in DC? The fracking earthquakes and ruined water sources? The increasing loss of privacy?

Right now I'm concerned with a Manchurian candidate going to the White House-somebody whose interests are not those of the United States, but of a foreign dictatorship. Since the end of WWII, the US has worked hard and paid a lot of money to make sure the advanced, democratic nations of the world are not over run by the forces of totalitarianism. For sure, we have not always been in the right, or even particularly honest sometimes. But at least we kept most of the advanced countries advanced, and not swallowed up. Look at North Korea and South Korea-one country that got split up. South Korea has a high standard of living and has gone from post WWII destitution to one of the members of the G20 economic summit. North Korea is a totalitarian mess whose people are having their food rationed and has Caligula's spiritual descendant at its helm.

One candidate wants to keep NATO and the US position in the world as it has been since the end of WWII, the other wants to drop our defenses completely and let the allies who trusted us to keep the world in order fall prey to an advancing Russian expansionism. Only NATO kept Russia in check in Europe, and when NATO goes, here comes Russia rushing in to fill the void. Trump likes to talk tough, but in foreign affairs he is Putin's servant. We can't let that happen. You flippantly dismiss such concerns, but they are central to prevent the world from being taken over by totalitarians.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  2  
Thu 2 Jun, 2016 09:30 pm
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

I can't understand why anyone would vote for Hillary Clinton.


Me either.
Blickers
 
  3  
Thu 2 Jun, 2016 09:34 pm
@McGentrix,
After Trump has let Russia swallow up Ukraine, Poland and the Czech Republic again and started working on France and Belgium, will you still not understand why anybody wanted to vote for Hillary?
Builder
 
  -1  
Thu 2 Jun, 2016 10:38 pm
@Blickers,
Quote:
When did we invade Libya?


This is a joke, right?
Builder
 
  1  
Thu 2 Jun, 2016 10:58 pm
@Blickers,
Quote:
When did we invade Libya?


Quote:
President Barack Obama, reflecting on his 7 years as Commander-in-Chief, admitted that ousting Libyan dictator Muammar Gaddafi was the biggest mistake of his presidency. While Obama took responsibility for the failure of Libya in that interview, he relied on the input of Hillary Clinton, his Secretary of State at the time.

In March of 2011, Clinton met with Mahmoud Jibril, who was leading the opposition to Gaddafi. As the New York Times reported, Clinton asked Jibril a series of questions about how his coalition planned to fill the power vacuum that would be created by Gaddafi’s ouster. And in the end, it was Clinton who convinced the White House that deposing Gaddafi was the right thing to do:

Her conviction would be critical in persuading Mr. Obama to join allies in bombing Colonel Qaddafi’s forces. In fact, Mr. Obama’s defense secretary, Robert M. Gates, would later say that in a “51-49” decision, it was Mrs. Clinton’s support that put the ambivalent president over the line.

The 2011 NATO-led invasion of Libya that took place after Clinton’s visit has since allowed extremist groups to seize power in an unprecedented takeover of much of the country over the last five years.

In 2014, the US State Department shut down the US embassy in Libya and issued a travel warning urging all Americans to stay away from the country. Roughly one year ago, Libya’s central bank, the last remaining institution in the failed state, was forced to flee to a city in the Eastern region of the country due to rebel forces encroaching on the bank’s facility in Tripoli, the capital.

Libya is now a haven for terrorists, with thousands of ISIS soldiers using the country as a staging ground.


Article here.
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  2  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 12:36 am
@Builder,
Quote Blickers:
Quote:
When did we invade Libya?


Quote Builder:
Quote:
This is a joke, right?


No, it's not a joke. So let me ask you again, you seem not to understand-I guess English is not your native language.

When did we invade Libya? Your article never said we did. And we didn't.
Builder
 
  1  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 12:42 am
@Blickers,
Quote:
Your article never said we did.



Try this one.

President Obama Admits the ‘Worst Mistake’ of His Presidency

Maya Rhodan @m_rhodan

April 11, 2016
He says the aftermath of the Libya intervention was the administration's biggest mistake
Builder
 
  1  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 12:56 am
@Blickers,
And I can see where you're heading with this denial tactic; it was a NATO-led invasion, right? Or a humanitarian mission of peace, right? Or, like Iraq, a liberation action against a tyrannical dictator, right?

Truth can be a tough pill to swallow, right?
0 Replies
 
Builder
 
  1  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 01:05 am
@Blickers,
And you might have missed this one too, if you live under a rock, that is, but McCain threatened Vladimir Putin with the same fate as Muamar Qaddafi.

Quote:
Does America know that McCain tweeted Putin a death threat? Saying what happened to Gaddafi will befall him? I don’t think so. Why is he even still in office? He has a hand grenade in one hand and a walking cane in the other. Please someone tell him to go home.

And by the way, isn’t that a treasonous act?

In 2013, Senator John McCain sent a twitter message to Putin, forecasting Putin the same destiny as that of Gaddafi. (which was regime toppling and death). Why didn’t the media ever talk about this? It sure would have been nice to know that a U.S. Senator was sending a threat to the leader of a world super power like Russia. That is headline material! At the time, Putin was asked at a press conference if he thought that was an empty threat or a real western initiative?

Putin responded, “Well about the “friend” part, you are seriously exaggerating, that is the person messaging is exaggerating. I am of course familiar with Mr. McCain, we met at the Munich conference, I think? First of all, I have read this yes, and what can I say? It wasn’t actually directed at me personally, it was directed at the fate of Russia. Some people would like to see Russia move aside. Just so it doesn’t get in the way of the hegemony. They are still wary of our nuclear potential. This is the reason we are able to practice independent politics. This is the reason Russia has paid particular attention to the “irritant” on the international arena. We have our own opinions. We conduct independent foreign policy and will continue to do so in the future. This is bound to be annoying to someone.

“Secondly the west is not homogenous. We have more allies than we have enemies. And my final comment, Mr. McCain as is known is a Vietnam veteran. I would suppose his hands are elbow deep in civilian blood. It appears he just cannot get by without repeated scenes that are atrocious to us of the murder of Gaddafi. On TV screens around the world we were shown his murder where he was drenched in blood. Is this what you call democracy? How did they do it? Using drones they delivered a blow on his battalion then over the radio to special forces, which shouldn’t have been on the territory, they brought in a camera crew as well as opposition rebels. And they murdered him without a trace or trial. If he was captured it should have been up to the people to decide his fate via democratic methods. Yes it’s difficult and it takes time but nothing else is acceptable.

“So Mr. McCain, as is known, was a prisoner of war in Vietnam. They put him not into a prison but into a hole in the ground. That is where he spent many years. And as any many would have, that is where he left his mind. So there’s nothing really to discuss.”


Article here.
0 Replies
 
Builder
 
  1  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 01:47 am
This is pretty damning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dY77j6uBHI
parados
 
  3  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 06:43 am
@Builder,
Perhaps you don't understand the meaning of the word invasion.

Invasion - to enter a country a country with an armed force in order to occupy it.
synonyms: occupy, conquer, capture, seize, take (over), annex, win, gain, secure;


When did the US invade Libya? We bombed Libyan troops to help rebels. That isn't an invasion.

Are you willing to argue that Japan invaded the US in 1941? Are you willing to argue that the British invaded Germany in 1940? Are you willing to argue that Japan invaded the Australian mainland in 1942? Are you willing to argue that the US invaded Japan in 1942? By your idiotic use of the term you would have to make all the above arguments.
woiyo
 
  1  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 06:51 am
@parados,
Regardless oif what you want to call the attack on Libya, it was another mistake and clearly botched and now destabilized. Just like IRAQ. How can anyone vote for someone who has been a failure as a Senator to Sec of State? How can anyone vote for someone who is OWNED by the elite and will never do anything to enhance the growth of the middle class. How can anyone ever vote for someone who should be indicted for her actions as Sec of State?
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  2  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 08:04 am
@Builder,
Quote:
President Barack Obama said the worst mistake of his presidency was failing to prepare for the aftermath Libyan leader Muammar Qaddafi’s ousting.

“Probably failing to plan for the day after what I think was the right thing to do in intervening in Libya,” Obama said in an interview with Fox News‘ Chris Wallace that aired Sunday.


First of all, I am glad he is big enough to admit his mistakes, I think when Bush was asked, he couldn't think of any. (unless my memory fails me) Second he didn't say he regretted the intervention but he regretted not planning for the aftermath of the intervention.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 08:43 am
It does no good to point out Clinton's weaknesses, faults and criminal side. Her supporters try to paint Sanders' supporters as being cult-like, practically worshiping the guy, but they refuse to see her as having any faults at all. "Ooh," they say; "she is simply evolving." Yeah, right.
DrewDad
 
  4  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 09:04 am
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

Ad hominem.

Not really. Nowhere did I say my, or anyone else's, opinion of Sanders should affected by our opinions of you.
DrewDad
 
  3  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 09:05 am
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:

Lash wrote:

I can't understand why anyone would vote for Hillary Clinton.


Me either.

I can think of plenty of reasons to vote against Trump, though....
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  3  
Fri 3 Jun, 2016 09:08 am
@edgarblythe,
edgarblythe wrote:

It does no good to point out Clinton's weaknesses, faults and criminal side. Her supporters try to paint Sanders' supporters as being cult-like, practically worshiping the guy, but they refuse to see her as having any faults at all. "Ooh," they say; "she is simply evolving." Yeah, right.

No matter who you support, you are destined to be disappointed if you insist that only perfection is acceptable.
 

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