I'll Never Vote for Hillary Clinton

@Ragman,

All the while, Europeans have a good laugh at our politics based on "Billary."

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@Robert Gentel,

Robert Gentel wrote:

Edgar is just one person, in Texas who will have no bearing on the general election no matter what he does.

This silly season sniping between progressives should stop, it's sad.

And it's this kind of primary animosity that will dull Democrat enthusiasm for Clinton when she wins. It's not going to make people more likely to vote for her to have overstatement and fear mongering used to try to compel them.

We're repeating ourselves. I didn't say just Edgar. I said all those who wold withhold a vote for Hillary on election day.
You said we can't influence the Bernie voters to vote for Hillary, but you forgot to mention that their "sniping" about Hillary won't make us more likely to vote for Bernie. Bias, much?

1 Reply

@snood,

I was responding to a post where you continue haranguing Edgar specifically, not a post where you speak generally. I doubt you are being an effective advocate for Clinton to him by doing this.

1 Reply

@Robert Gentel,

And I long since agreed that Edgar and Lash can't have the effect that a multitude of like minded could.

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@snood,

Then why do you persist in trying to directly address him and convince him otherwise? I don't speak for the man but if I were in his shoes you would be having the opposite effect than what you claim to intend.

I really don't think that you are making anyone any more likely to vote for Clinton with that approach.

1 Reply

@Robert Gentel,

Sad to a fellow progressive, but to a conservative it's angel song.

The same argument will be engaged in on the Right should Trump win the nomination. I, for one, will not vote for the man. Of course I have the convenience of living in Texas. The GOP candidate won't need my vote.

I have to say that my estimation of some of the progressives here has risen thanks to this debate.

HRC is a terrible person, and she shouldn't be allowed to have the power of the presidency. I'm happy to see that some progressives can rise above partisan politics to recognize this fact.

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@Robert Gentel,

Robert Gentel wrote:

Then why do you persist in trying to directly address him and convince him otherwise? I don't speak for the man but if I were in his shoes you would be having the opposite effect than what you claim to intend.

I really don't think that you are making anyone any more likely to vote for Clinton with that approach.

For the same reason you feel compelled to keep addressing me, unsolicited, I guess. Do you you think we need your input to keep our arguments and motivations straight? Edgar does exceptionally well on his own.
I may or may not influence someone- I may or may not be influenced by someone - but again, that certainly seems to me to be no affair of yours.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Finn dAbuzz wrote:

Sad to a fellow progressive, but to a conservative it's angel song.

Yeah, I know. I take small delight in watching when Republicans do this.

Quote:

The same argument will be engaged in on the Right should Trump win the nomination. I, for one, will not vote for the man. Of course I have the convenience of living in Texas. The GOP candidate won't need my vote.

Well I do have that your side of the fence is in much larger disarray to take heart in. I don't envy smart Republicans at all these days, they are being served a very paltry offering by their party.

Quote:

HRC is a terrible person, and she shouldn't be allowed to have the power of the presidency. I'm happy to see that some progressives can rise above partisan politics to recognize this fact.

I think she's pretty typical of a politician, personally. I'm not a huge fan, and she's certainly less sincere of a human being than a person like Bernie but not any much more than a person like Rubio. She's just been around and been a lightning rod for longer to be branded that way.

1 Reply

@DrewDad,

DrewDad wrote:

edgarblythe wrote:
That's just it. You think we are saying, "If I can't have my candidate I don't give a damn." We (the ones like me are all I can speak for) are not giving up on Hillary because we might not get Bernie. We are giving up on her because we don't want her to be president. Has zero to do with Bernie.

So let's run with that for a minute. If Hillary get's the Democratic nomination, which of the Republican candidates are you willing to vote for over her? Trump? Cruz? Rubio? Bush?

Personally, I don't want any of them to be the President. They are all bad. With Hillary, she'll screw us on the sly ... while the Republicans might be more open about it ... and I would rather have the transparency. We may have to hit rock bottom before a "change we can believe in" can truly take place. Apathy and fear are paralyzing emotions, whereas anger is a motivating emotion. When will the people get angry enough about our corrupt two-party system before they take charge? They can't depend on our Supreme Court to do their work for them.

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@Robert Gentel,

Rubio is miles beyond her.

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@Debra Law,

You Bernie guys never give Hillary any credit for having done anything good. Surely you don't think she's spent ALL her time figuring how to screw the American people "on the sly"?
Surely she had some time to support helpful legislation as senator, to help broker useful alliances as SOS?
I'm sorry, but it just seems like an open-ended, glaringly incomplete argument.

This is what the conversation feels like, in a way:
"I'm mad as hell at the system, and I'm not going to take it anymore!"
"Well, what can we do about it?
"Nothing! Let the worst of the worst lead the system; I'm going home!"

2 Replies

@snood,

Actually, we Bernie supporters are saying the same thing about Hillary supporters. Do nothing, because it is too hard to make a better system. So, we are supposed to, according to Hillary people, do nothing.

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@Blickers,

Blickers wrote:

Quote Debra Law:

Quote:
If the American people cannot depend on the Supreme Court to protect individual liberty from the clutches of the self-designated morality police, then they better protect themselves by voting for representatives who won't strip them of their rights. I'm not going to let the Democrats hold "Roe v. Wade" or anything else over my head as a threat ... vote for Hillary or else. I'm not afraid ... bring it on!

We won't bring it on. It's the fellows who oppose Roe v Wade who'll bring it on. And if Bernie supporters stay home because they can't stomach Hillary, then getting rid of Roe v Wade becomes considerably easier.

You missed the point, Blickers. I'm not afraid ... even if Roe v. Wade is overturned, I'm not afraid. I'm not falling prey to fear mongering. If the Supreme Court is so politicized that it cannot be trusted to protect individual liberty against government oppression, then the American people will have to protect themselves against the morality police (the hypocrites who want to use the power of the state to oppress others).

1 Reply

@Blickers,

Quote:

".... fellows who oppose Roe v Wade who'll bring it on."

.
They have been "bringing it on" to no avail. What makes you think that's going to change?

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

the difference (to an observer who finds both of them undesireable) is that the supporters of Ms. Clinton say they will vote for whoever the Democratic candidate is in the general election. The supporters of Mr. Sanders say (to a fascinating, if disturbing, degree ) that if Mr. Sanders is not the candidate in the general, they will not be voting Democratic.

It is a striking difference.

1 Reply

@Debra Law,

I must disagree. It is not fear to respect one's opponent enough to anticipate what he will try to do, especially when they have spent quite a lot of years announcing that is what they are going to try. Similarly with Social Security and the rest of the New Deal / New Frontier programs. I see no reason to think that Hillary will not defend those to her utmost, and will appoint judges who will uphold Roe v Wade and those programs as well. I feel that the Clinton years were a time of progress overall, and I don't mind a bit if we keep going in that direction. Hillary is a different person from Bill, but I think they are both on the same page. I also think Obama has done a damn good job with what he had to work with when he came into office, and he's got the country going in the right direction.

I'll vote for Bernie if he gets the nomination, he's fine too. But in my mind, Hillary is the more likely of the two to keep the hounds at bay until the electorate is composed of fewer Reaganites and more progressives, which is the direction it's going.

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@cicerone imposter,

there is one supreme court justice position in play

it is not the position that was anticipated - two other supreme court justices are expected to retire/die within the next 5 years

having 3 supreme court positions in play could change a lot for Americans

that's why there is so much fuss about this replacement and the election

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@Blickers,

Not Reaganites. The current republicans don't resemble the republicans of Reagan.

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@Blickers,

Blickers wrote:

Hillary is a different person from Bill, but I think they are both on the same page.

I'd say they're in the same book, but Ms. Clinton seems to be reading a more liberal chapter than her husband ever got to.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

Only if you consider it nothing to cast your vote for whoever the nominee is even if its Hillary.

0 Replies

I'll Never Vote for Hillary Clinton

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