Attacks in Paris Stadium, concert hall

@BillRM,

It were just seconds the plane had been on Turkish territory, twice, if the map is correct.

re. those warnings: if it was in English, the Turkish might have sound a bit funny. I don't know the Englishknowledge of a common Russian military pilot.

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@Walter Hinteler,

Quote:

re. those warnings: if it was in English, the Turkish might have sound a bit funny. I don't know the Englishknowledge of a common Russian military pilot.

It is my understanding that commerce pilots and military pilots need to have enough English to follow directions of air traffic controls around the world.

Somehow I think there is more to the story then we know at this time and I still have not forgotten that the USSR once shoot down an off course jet liner who had flown near an island military base of their.

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@BillRM,

Military jets usually don't communicate with civil air control nor with that of another country. Especially not, when they are on a fight mission.

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@Walter Hinteler,

The Russian pilot(s) were shot when parachuting or executed on the ground by rebels - there have been other war crimes in Syria but ...

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@Walter Hinteler,

Turkey is no friend of Assad or Russia, and this is not the first excursion. As Turkey is a NATO ally we should be helping them.

This was always going to happen, it's a miracle it's taken this long, and the only people who are surprised are the idiots who don't understand the dynamic.

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Huge police search for one of the Paris attackers some dozen miles away from me (on the northern border of my state to Lower Saxon)

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@BillRM,

So if a Russian bomber appeared over New York you'd be quite happy for your airforce to try lots of diplomatic niceties and not shoot it down.

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

Quote:

So if a Russian bomber appeared over New York you'd be quite happy for your airforce to try lots of diplomatic niceties and not shoot it down.

I did not know that the Russian bomber was over Ankara or another important population center instead of a few miles inside a border region and the US military had escort soviet or Russian warships and aircrafts from our territories many times since the end of WW2

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It appears that there is a little 'do as I say, not as I do' afoot in the French response to their 911... :/

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/11/french-american-terrorism-response-comparison?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+motherjones%2Fmain+%28MotherJones.com+Main+Article+Feed%29

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@Lash,

The French for sure made the mistake of underperforming before the attack like we did, do they also over react? Do they also perform poorly as they ever react as America did?

IDK.

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@hawkeye10,

They found a target to bomb right away, and I remember thinking how many months we waited to id an Afghanistani target...of course, there's the whole bad intel / Iraq thing supported by almost everybody...

I also remember the French supporting Saddam through the sanctions...

Anyway, it is very compelling to compare the steps they take in a similar circumstance.

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@Lash,

The question I have is Hollande now playing John Wayne because it is the right thing to do, is it because emotion has swamped the brain, or is it to cover up the fact that his government massively failed at security?

Just dont know right now.....

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@ehBeth,

You can want it, but it isn't going to happen.

I appreciate that you are relating an emotional reaction to war in the abstract, but I am very happy your views don't shape any nation's policy.

For whatever reason, men and women, mostly young, fight in wars. Better that drones take out bad guys then these men and women. There will be collateral death with both means.

For a dove, you have a very romantic notion of war.

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@Lash,

Lash wrote:

I also remember the French supporting Saddam through the sanctions...

The sanctions began August 6, 1990, and stayed largely in force until May 2003.
France didn't have diplomatic relations with Iraq during that period.

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@ehBeth,

This is silly. If war can be made not to be horrible, who would complain?

It can't be until it is limited to assassinating the leaders who would start them (Which surprisingly is something most doves view with horror), and they are going to continue so what good comes from making them as horrible as possible?

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@Walter Hinteler,

France can claim plausible deniability. We all can decide whether or not we believe it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A16142-2004Oct7.html

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@Walter Hinteler,

We did support LIFTING the UN sanctions -- you can't sanction a country forever -- but we did apply them while they lasted.

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@Olivier5,

It's nice to see you support you country so consistently. Perhaps you will allow others the same patriotic reflex.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Just stating facts here. You're welcome to do the same.

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@Lash,

I don't deny at all what is said in that report. I was just and only responding to your claim that France was supporting Saddam through the sanctions.

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Attacks in Paris Stadium, concert hall

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