Dookiestix wrote:nimh wrote:
Quote:Bottom line, IMNSHO: F9/11 was a grating exercise in obfuscating the utter flakiness of its underlying arguments by provoking every reaction it could, jerking your tears, triggering your outrage, perplexing you with scenes of hilarious insult or perplexed disbelief.
In other words, it made you THINK. Gee, what a concept.
Err, no. Moved to tears, outraged, perplexed - those are not modes I get in when I
think. He was very, very good in triggering all kinds of sentiments. So much so that you almost forgot to observe that the main case he was making throughout the first half of the movie (the tortured attempt to connect Bush to Osama and suggest the true reason for the war was to be found there) was, well, tortured.
No, he was very good in making me feel all kinds of things. And then I realised I was being cheated, and felt ... cheated. (Jeez, whats with all the doubling up my words here?)
Dookiestix wrote:And before one complains about showing happy school children and peaceful scenes as disengenuous, one should at least understand the context of these scenes; that despite the tyrannical rule of Saddam Hussein, he ruled over THE most liberal country in the Middle East, where women had MORE freedoms than any other Middle Eastern country, MUCH more than our closest OIL allies, Saudia Arabia and/or Qatar.
Err, liberal in religious terms, yeah. It was a secular dictatorship. Liberal in political terms, no.
Many more people ended up tortured and imprisoned in Saddam's Iraq than in those of Saudi-Arabia - or most of the Middle East's states, in fact (and that's saying something). But you're right - not for any religious reason ...
Dookiestix wrote:the urrefutable fact that Saddam's tyrannical and murderous rule actually KEPT the country from breaking out into major civil war and keeping the Sunnis, Baathists, and Kurds from killing each other.
That is an utterly cynical argument, usually reserved for the realpolitik righties amongst us. Dictatorship aint so bad - you know, if you'd give them freedom, they'd only start fighting each other anyway. Three cheers for enlightened absolutism.
Dookiestix wrote:And when one complains about mass graves, we BETTER not forget that many of the dead were killed as a direct result of America pulling out of Iraq and encouraging the populace to rise up. This was AS irresponsible and short-sighted as the current pResident Bush has been
Absolutely, very true.
Dookiestix wrote:It's these complexities that were part of what Michael was trying to explain
I saw much rhetorical skill in Moore's movie, but "complexities" never was a word that popped up in my head. Well, some of the implied or insinuated conspiracy theories were pretty complex.
Dookiestix wrote:I will agree that Michael goes over the top many times in this movie, but if a movie can at least get you to THINK, it has accomplished so much more than watching FOX television and agreeing with everything they tell you to agree with.
You're setting a very low bar. People who'll agree with everything FOX says wont see the movie anyway. Otherwise, wouldnt the Left's alternative be to be
better than Fox, rather than its blue-state mirror image?