Black Lives Matter

@bobsal u1553115,

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Not sure if Ben Carson knows that the only violence, or threats of violence, during the Yale and Missouri protests have come from two white men who, via social media, said they planned to shoot black protesters. In any case, Carson continued on in the same vein.

Not true as everyone saw the video of a professor calling on students to provide the muscles to removed a white student reporter from open university property.

That my friend was a call for violence by a university employee directed at a student who was within his rights to be there.

That is more serous then two men who have no connection to the university or near it issuing a threat with no known backing for carrying the threats out and in a manner where both was found by law enforcement within hours of issuing those threats.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

Now here we have two stupid threats with no means it would seems to carry them out and then we have a MU professor/employee trying to recruit students to used force on another student.

Quote:

http://www.kansascity.com/news/government-politics/article44247495.html

Northwest Missouri State University student Connor Stottlemyre, 19, was arrested on suspicion of making a terrorist threat after he allegedly posted a threat on the anonymous social media app Yik Yak that read "I'm going to shoot any black people tomorrow, so be ready," said university spokesman Mark Hornickel

Campus police were made aware of the threat by another student. The university issued a security alert to students and faculty at about 8:30 a.m. to inform them of the threat. Stottlemyre, of Blue Springs, Mo., was arrested at 11 a.m. at his dormitory on the Maryville campus.

In a separate incident, Hunter Park, of Lake St. Louis, Mo., was taken into custody around 1:50 a.m.Wednesday at a residence hall at the Missouri University of Science and Technology, in Rolla, Mo., where he is a student, the school said in a statement. Parks was taken into custody and transferred to the Boone County Jail in Columbia, where he was held on $4,500 bond.

No weapons were found during the investigation, the university said. Rolla is about 94 miles south of Columbia.

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@bobsal u1553115,

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You certainly are forgiving of other people's racist hate speech.

Sorry for example I question if the Jewish ACLU lawyers feel they needed to be forgiving of the speech of the American Nazis party in order to defend their rights under the bill or rights.

An yes indeed placing cotton balls or a drunk driving by yelling a racist insult hardly seems in the same class as the american nazis party who have Jewish lawyers defending their rights of freedom of speech.

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@bobsal u1553115,

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You don't have to 'buy' a 'victim's' story to be empathetic towards the alleged victim, nonce.

Yes actually one must buy that a person is a victim before acting towards as if that person is a victim, anything else is just acting, and is not either moral or fair to ourselves. Again we see from you theory that the one who claims to be the victim gets to make the rules. ****. That. I was made equal, my opinion matters just as much as does the one who claims to be a victim.

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Prosecutor: Distributor of KKK flier facing criminal charges
Source: Associated Press

Prosecutor: Distributor of KKK flier facing criminal charges
Updated 7:46 pm, Thursday, November 12, 2015

BURLINGTON, Vt. (AP) — A white man who prosecutors say distributed Ku Klux Klan recruitment fliers to two members of the city's small minority community is facing criminal charges.

The fliers didn't include a call to violence, but distributing them only to a black woman and a Hispanic woman shows an intent to threaten and therefore doesn't fall under free-speech protections, Chittenden County State's Attorney T.J. Donovan said Thursday.

William Schenk was arrested Thursday on disorderly conduct charges, prosecutors said. Because his conduct was motivated by race, the penalty could be enhanced to more than four years in prison if he is convicted, they said.

Schenk, 21, is expected to be in court Friday. It was unknown if he had a lawyer, and no phone number for him could be located in Burlington or in Wilmington, North Carolina, where he used to live.

Read more: http://www.chron.com/news/crime/article/Vermont-prosecutor-police-to-talk-of-KKK-6627305.php

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The kookery is spreading to Yale now:

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/11/the-new-intolerance-of-student-activism-at-yale/414810/

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@bobsal u1553115,

Quote:

The fliers didn't include a call to violence, but distributing them only to a black woman and a Hispanic woman shows an intent to threaten and therefore doesn't fall under free-speech protections, Chittenden County State's Attorney T.J. Donovan said Thursday.

Seem the first amendment is under attacks on all fronts but this
charge should be thrown out when it reach a judge who had hear of the first amendment and past court cases.

One also must wonder if a black panther had handed out their nonsense to two white women if they would had been charge with such nonsense.

So you are free to give out fliers only if you are very careful to not give them out to the "wrong" people............amazing theory indeed.

3 Replies

@BillRM,

Anyone who yell and pass out pro-life flyers to only those going into a plan parent clinic should be arrested for a hate crime?

Interesting world if we find ways to do away with the first amendment.

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Of course we as a nation had never been all that comfortable with the first amendment with the congress under the second president passing the Sedition Act,

Quote:

http://www.ushistory.org/us/19e.asp

In essence, this Act prohibited public opposition to the government. Fines and imprisonment could be used against those who "write, print, utter, or publish . . . any false, scandalous and malicious writing" against the government.

Under the terms of this law over 20 Republican newspaper editors were arrested and some were imprisoned. The most dramatic victim of the law was REPRESENTATIVE MATTHEW LYON of Vermont. His letter that criticized President Adams' "unbounded thirst for ridiculous pomp, foolish adulation, and self avarice" caused him to be imprisoned. While Federalists sent Lyon to prison for his opinions, his constituents reelected him to Congress even from his jail cell.

As late as WW1 a movie director was imprison for a movie showing the Brits in a bad light during our revolution war.

It is a constant and ongoing fight to keep the first amendment meaningful.

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@BillRM,

Once again you've demonstrated your inability to understand the difference between "free speech" and "protected speech" and added a racist comment behind it.

The idiot freely spoke unprotected speech. Race had nothing to do with it except as an element of his unprotected speech. Hate speech is not protected past the freedom to make it and his obligation is to accept the consequences. If he had any honestly held values he'd take his punishment like a man with the knowledge he stood up for his opinion. Too bad his opinion was racist and noninclusive and ultimately unAmerican.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

Quote:

One also must wonder if a black panther had handed out their nonsense to two white women if they would had been charge with such nonsense.

Your argument is spurious: this isn't the case and this sort of thing has never happened. However this jerk did do exactly that in essence so if you want to condemn your hypothetical Black Panthers, you of course want to condemn that racist. Right?

Do you really believe that black criminals have never had "hate" elements increase their punishment in assaults on whites? Because if you do, I have lots of examples to post to demonstrate how out of touch you've allowed racist tendencies blind you to the truth.

1 Reply

@bobsal u1553115,

Sorry but racial speech is indeed protected speech by all court rulings I am aware of no matter how unhappy it might made some people.

You have the right to go into the public square even at MU and state that all blacks are mud people who are sub-human or that all white cops are either cold blooded murders or would be cold blooded murders of black citizens.

American Nazis had been found to have the right to march through a community, in full uniforms that at the time was still full of Nazis death camps survivors who still have tattoo numbers from that time on their arms.

You do not have a right to limit someone free speech due to you dislike or distaste for their ideas.or opinions.

1 Reply

@bobsal u1553115,

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so if you want to condemn your hypothetical Black Panthers, you of course want to condemn that racist. Right?

Sorry I would defend the black panthers rights just as strongly as the KKK rights to hand out flyers under the bill of rights , just as the ACLU Jewish lawyers had a strong and to me wonderful history of defending the constitution rights of the american nazis party.

You can hate what someone said and stand for with all your being and still be willing to defend their rights to express those ideas under the constitution.

A concept you can not seem to understand.

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@BillRM,

Quote:

racial speech is indeed protected speech by all court rulings I am aware of

"racial speech", maybe (whatever the hell "racial speech" is), but not racist speech if its meant to incite violence, fear, intimidation. Fighting words are not protected speech, hate speech is not protected speech. The right to speak is whats protected. Content is not protected automatically. You have to issue me a parade permit, but what I say during the parade may well get me arrested.

So then why haven't hate speech laws and and hate speech predicates in assault punishment been thrown out of court? Why do these laws still stand?

I think your "I am aware of" explains itself. You don't seem to be aware of much, particularly the First Amendment.

By the First Amendment you have the right to speak anywhere without prior restraint (except where all speech might be prohibited), but you don't have the right to say anything you want. If you were, for example, why would there be laws against slander and libel? All the First Amendment allows you do is speak your crap first before facing sanctions over any law you may have broken saying it.

I know you don't get it. Fortunately we don't have to live in your assumed world.

Get someone from a junior high Civics class to explain this to you.

1 Reply

@bobsal u1553115,

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o then why haven't hate speech laws and and hate speech predicates in assault punishment been thrown out of court? Why do these laws still stand?

So far every time a public college speech code had been challenge in courts in regard to the first amendment they had had been found null and void as a matter of fact. It memory service me correctly this had happen at least 27 times over the years.

The only thing protecting any such codes is the cost of mounting such a challenge in the courts.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

That's just sad. The Kochs literally have a billion dollars to spend on elections and not a dime to spend on defending what you mistakenly mis-identify as pure "free speech" but is actually, by standing laws, freely spoken unprotected speech.

You are one confused camper. For the hell of it you ought to get a text book about how the Bill of rights work.

1 Reply

@bobsal u1553115,

Quote:

You are one confused camper. For the hell of it you ought to get a text book about how the Bill of rights work

LOL you had again and again had been shown to have a damn weak understanding of the laws less along constitution laws so instead of trying to list and link to courts rulings that back your positions you just claims that my understanding is weak.

Come on you can do better then that!!!!!!

Footnote since when had the Koch brothers been involved or shown any caring about the bill of rights? From what little I know of them I can not see them as members of the ACLU. Is bringing up their names out of thin air just another attempt of your to blow a smoke screen

You just picked out two billionaires out of thin air for some strange reason?

1 Reply

@BillRM,

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You just picked out two billionaires out of thin air for some strange reason?

1. They've many times publicly and explicitly stated that have one billion dollars to spend on the 2016 election.

2. Speaking of even more of the First Amendment - in the last ten years or so the Supreme Court has ruled:
a. Money is free and protected speech.
b. Free speech when expressed as cash in PAC doesn't have any limit so long as a candidate has no direct hand in it.
c. Corporations are people, too. (Get it: they now have separate protection for their First Amendment rights independent of their owners/shareholders. Its like Edgar Bergen, Charlie McCarthy, Mortimer Snerd all get a vote.

3. AIPAC the organization most responsible for most of the above, is financed mainly by the guess who, Koch brothers.

People must really hate being teamed up with you in Trivial Pursuit.

2 Replies

Quote:

http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/tag/flier

Iowa college to pay $14K to settle speech lawsuit
An Iowa community college will pay nearly $14,000 to settle a free-speech lawsuit filed by a student who was barred from distributing fliers criticizing a conference on gay youth.

Street preachers win early round in dispute with police
Federal judge issues temporary restraining order in lawsuit brought by men who were told to stop handing out leaflets and using a loudspeaker in downtown Syracuse, N.Y.

T. LOUIS — The city of St. Louis has been ordered to stop enforcing a law making it a crime to place leaflets on parked vehicles.
A consent judgment entered yesterday in U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Missouri says the city and its police department may not enforce the ordinance. The city also [...]

ST. LOUIS — Guests at this weekend's annual gay-pride festival in St. Louis will have some unwelcome visitors, but a federal judge says they have a constitutional right to engage the crowd.
Apple of His Eye Inc. — a religious group whose followers describe themselves as Jews who believe Jesus is the messiah foretold by Jewish [...]

RICHMOND, Va. — A Maryland school system's policy governing distribution of fliers is unconstitutional because it offers no protection against viewpoint discrimination, a federal appeals court ruled yesterday.
A three-judge panel of the 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals said the policy gives Montgomery County Public Schools unlimited authority to exclude any group from a program [...]

1 Reply

@bobsal u1553115,

What does this have to do with free speech on a college/university campus? What does it have to do with a facility member calling for the removal, by force, of a student journalist?

1 Reply

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