Why are we here?

@Herald,

You truly are a loon. Babbling about "the big bang" is your schtick, not mine. I have no cosmogony, and need none. Life is, and needs no justification. Your lack of reasoning abilities is glaringly evident in your insistence on your terms and definitions, which have been shown to be hopelessly flawed, and your witless insistence on refuting the "Athesists" who "believe" in what you were pleased to call Big Bang, no definite article, as though Big Bang were a person. As you subsequently referred to Big Bang as "He," you must think Big Bang is some kind of god.

Your entire thesis proceeds from unsubstantiated and flawed premises, and all you want to do is peddle your religious bullsh*t, while insisting that everything be discussed in the terms you insist upon, with the screwy definitions you insist upon. Don't hold your f*cking breath.

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By the way, as for "proposing [me] a peace" (Jesus, your English really sucks), do you actually think that you are entitled to peddle this bullsh*t and that no one must ever challenge it? Don't hold your breath for that one, either.

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@Herald,

Herald wrote:

The question is: has our species (the mankind) any special purpose of its existence and development

No.

Herald wrote:

, and if we (as species) don't have any special purpose (or at least cannot formulate it properly), how can an individual claim that he/she has super-meaningful purpose in life ... and all the money of the other people shuld go to him/her, respectively?

I haven't the faintest idea how the first part of your question is supposed to connect to the last. If human life in general did have a purpose, it still would not follow that one individual has a super-meaningful life and that all the money of the other people should go to her.

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@Thomas,

Herald wrote:

, and if we (as species) don't have any special purpose (or at least cannot formulate it properly), how can an individual claim that he/she has super-meaningful purpose in life ... and all the money of the other people shuld go to him/her, respectively?

Thomas wrote:

I haven't the faintest idea how the first part of your question is supposed to connect to the last. If human life in general did have a purpose, it still would not follow that one individual has a super-meaningful life and that all the money of the other people should go to her.

I think Herald is making a stronger a statement than "it doesn't follow that one individual has a super-meaningful life." He is saying something like: "if mankind has no purpose, IT FOLLOWS that NO individual has a super-meaningful life."

And that makes sense, does it not? You'll agree that if one individual has a super-meaningful life, then mankind as a whole has a purpose? Herald has simply stated the contrapositive of that (in the form of a rhetorical question).

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@Herald,

Well, I had a feeling what I said wouldn't make sense to you but it is what I believe so I'm sticking to it. Even if you don't agree with everything.

And it's good that you don't, that means your establishing an opinion of your own. At the end of the day that's what you're gonna need in order to find a definite answer to the questions you are asking.

And even if you don't find an answer, it's the effort you're making that gives your life purpose. So you just answered your own question.

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@Kolyo,

Kolyo wrote:

And that makes sense, does it not? You'll agree that if one individual has a super-meaningful life, then mankind as a whole has a purpose?

Not really, no. I don't see how that follows, either.

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@Herald,

Quote:

What is the purpose of life? Does life have meaning? [...] Where are we going [...] ... where are we?

God: "Why am I here? What should I do? What's the purpose, the meaning, blah, blah?"
As if there was some higher Significance Provider to consult; as if there could be answers in that situation other than what such a non-designed intelligent agent invented for itself.

Humans: "Why are we here? What should we do? What's the purpose, the meaning, blah, blah?"
As if there was some higher Significance Provider to consult; as if there could be answers in that situation other than what non-designed intelligent agents invented for themselves.

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@Thomas,

Thomas wrote:

Kolyo wrote:
And that makes sense, does it not? You'll agree that if one individual has a super-meaningful life, then mankind as a whole has a purpose?

Not really, no. I don't see how that follows, either.

Well, the one individual with the super-meaningful* life is part of mankind, right?

If his existence is super-meaningful, and he's part of mankind as a whole, then doesn't that whole derive a degree of meaning from the fact that one of its parts' existence is meaningful?

If mankind had no other intrinsic reason for existing, it could be said to exist for the purpose of allowing that one special individual to be born.

*--Whatever that means.

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@Herald,

Herald wrote:

What is the purpose of life?
Does life have meaning?
What is better: to be a person with purpose or a person without purpose ... in life?
Where are we going, where are our perspectives, where are our dreams ... where are we?
Can one believe both in Money and in God?

I no longer concern myself with abstract questions like those.

The questions I spend time answering are more along the lines of: "Damn! They're cutting down all our trees and laying out parking lots...How can the bastards be stopped?"

Good luck with the philosophical enquiry, though. Smile

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@MacrOScopicaL,

MacrOScopicaL wrote:

... it's the effort you're making that gives your life purpose. So you just answered your own question.

Although the idea is not entirely bad, my life purpose in not to look for the purpose of life.
We all have some observations (both our own and on the people around us) about what the puprose of life might be:
- to make as much money as possible ... with no view to the consequences
- to make as many children as you can throughout your active period (and who, how and when is going to feed and dress and educate them - this is not your problem - it is problem of the society)
- to pile as many things in the house as you can (without considering that owing to the furniture and the junk virtualy there is no space to live)
- to buy as many books ... and CDs as you can, notwithstanding that you have no time to read even 10% of them
- to drive as big SUV as can pass through the gate of the yard (without consideration of the air pollution and the financially ruinous maintenance)
- to read as many horoscopes in the newspapers ... and on the TV as you are offfered (without consideration how much retard this can make you with the time), etc., etc.
IMV the idea of life is to raise your own standard of living ... and that of your heirs eventually, but obviously these things are not that easy to be done and made.
The very moment you ignite the engine of the SUV the quality of the air in the garden starts falling, the very moment you put a big section on the wall the living space is reduced in half, two days after you throw the fial of the motor oil in the flowers (as an expression of your free will) they are gone, the very moment you collect the money of the population the people remain without current cash and cannot be the customers of your business as usual ... and the profits go south.
Without co-ordination of the purposes of the people in a given community for example all the attempts to raise the individual standard of living range from poor ... to meaningless.

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@Kolyo,

Quote:

Quote:

What is the purpose of life?
Does life have meaning?
What is better: to be a person with purpose or a person without purpose ... in life?
Where are we going, where are our perspectives, where are our dreams ... where are we?
Can one believe both in Money and in God?

I no longer concern myself with abstract questions like those ... Good luck with the philosophical enquiry, though.

Believe it or not, but nothing in these questions is abstract.
Do you really believe that the people who present themselves as jelous worshippers of God, but actually worship the Money, believe only in the Money, and in nothing else ... is purely abstract?
Do you really believe that the people who are able to design ... and maintain for years on end a theory like the theory of the big bang ... just to snuggle the money and for nothing else, is really abstract?
Believe it or not but there are people ready to send their mother to Venus (on space experiments with unpredictable consequences) so far the right person shows the right amount to them ... and this is not abstract reasoning.
These are the realities in which we are living.

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All this talk about meaningful is just so much hot air. It is the individual who assigns meaning, and that meaning can have no more value than the meaning assigned by anyone else. An individual may be able to exercise more real, physical power than other individuals, and therefore impose whatever imperatives he or she alleges arise from the meanings he or she has asserted. That, however, is not evidence that his or her meanings have more value than anyone else's meanings. It just demonstrates the coercive force he or she can exercise.

Based on this member's past posts, i suspect that in some tortured way, he is attempting to work his way around to asserting that there is a god, and that it is the relationship with the god which gives meaning to life. That, of course, implies that only human life is meaningful, a conceit and a narrow view. I suspect that more maiming of English and failed attempts to logically reason will be in store in this thread.

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@Herald,

Herald wrote:

What is the purpose of life?

I've been wrong about things from time to time; but I do know the bible makes a claim that our purpose is to "Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it, and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving upon the earth.” (Genesis 1:29)

So far as I know, it doesn't say God ever changed his mind.

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You're making even more assumptions than the author of this silly thread, and that's saying a lot.

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@neologist,

neologist wrote:

Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it

... and what is your interpretation of this. It is too general to have any special meaning.

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@Setanta,

I had to do it.

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@Herald,

Herald wrote:

neologist wrote:
Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it
... and what is your interpretation of this. It is too general to have any special meaning.

I suppose it means if they had not disobeyed, they would still be here.

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@neologist,

neologist wrote:

I suppose it means if they had not disobeyed, they would still be here.

I was asking about 'fruitful', for it may mean besides 'productive of offspring' (increasing the population of the Earth ... to infinity, without any special idea, which however decreases the standard of living of the whole species), also 'benficial and remunerative'.
If we apply the latter to the present day problems, what could ''benficial and remunerative'' mean (as a message)?
1. beneficial: useful, helpful, good, profitable
2. remunerative: advantageous, favourable, gainful, paing back the efforts
In other words do you think that digging for example fossil fuels (to infinity) ... is useful, advantageous and paing back the efforts in terms of: environment preservation, combat with the acid rain and the drought, protecting the human health against cancer, insulin resistance, obesity, MS, Alzheimer, high blood pressure, etc. ... & providing better perspectives to increase our standard of living (aside from wasting energy for any whims)?

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@Herald,

you seem to indict our species ingenuity to take and use resources as some kind of crime. Perhaps if wed evolved with only half a functioning brain youd be more satisfied?

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@farmerman,

I object in the strongest terms to the implication that Herald is operating with more than half a brain.

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