19
   

Why are we here?

 
 
Krumple
 
  0  
Reply Thu 5 Mar, 2015 07:14 pm
@Herald,
"Why are we here?"

Conditions.

The conditions were "right" for life to appear. I don't like when people get snarky and smirk at random chance. There is nothing random about life arising on Earth. Where ever the conditions are "right" for life to appear, it more than likely will. But what are the odds? One in a billion? Even if they were one in a hundred billion those are still pretty good odds that there is life in every galaxy and with over a hundred billion galaxies that is a lot of life. I find it difficult to believe the odds are even less than that. I doubt that it is one in a few hundred trillion or worse. But I could be wrong.

We are here because of conditions.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Mar, 2015 07:31 pm
@Krumple,
Krumple wrote:

"Why are we here?"

Conditions.

We are here because of conditions.


That is as good a guess as any... and it might be right.

0 Replies
 
argome321
 
  0  
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2015 06:54 am
@layman,
Quote:
I don't really remember the details, and it's probably some misleading "summarization" at best, but I can remember being told that some respected philosopher (Alfred North Whitehead, I think), theorized that every single electron, proton, atom, molecule, etc., in the universe had "consciousness" and/or "intentionality." It sounded absurd to me at the time.



Consciousness is not a prerequisite nor requisite for life. We are not always aware of our stimuli yet we live.

Perhaps this Whitehead was romanticizing?
argome321
 
  0  
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2015 07:11 am
@Krumple,
Quote:
We are here because of conditions.


Just saying "Conditions" answer doesn't answer anything. It is as a mysterious answer as any. It is as if saying god and or a million other reasons can lay claim as to the reason that we are here, answering a mystery with another mystery. For example, As to what are these conditions? If not random in your eyes then what?

I don't think it clarifies anything
Why is it so difficult for us to just say we don't know, at least at this time? Perhaps we will never know. Isn't that the honest answer?

layman
 
  0  
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2015 11:20 am
@argome321,
Quote:
Why is it so difficult for us to just say we don't know...Isn't that the honest answer?


If I knew, I would answer that, Arg. I know, and you know, that I know, which you know, that we don't know nuthin.
argome321
 
  0  
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2015 11:34 am
@layman,
Quote:
If I knew, I would answer that, Arg. I know, and you know, that I know, which you know, that we don't know nuthin.


Don't you think it is a little early for the typical sophist rhetoric?

I think what I just said was redundant.
layman
 
  0  
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2015 11:50 am
@argome321,
Nuthin exists. Even if it did, we wouldn't know nuthin about it. Even if we did know something about it, we couldn't communicate what we know. Even if it could be communicated, it couldn't be understood.

Gorgias, the great Sophist.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2015 12:33 pm
@argome321,
Why is it so difficult for us to just say we don't know, at least at this time? Perhaps we will never know. Isn't that the honest answer?

Not difficult for me. I say it often.
0 Replies
 
Herald
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2015 04:51 pm
@argome321,
argome321 wrote:
Consciousness is not a prerequisite nor requisite for life.
     Really, but before claiming that perhaps you should define what is 'consciousness' and what is 'life'.
argome321 wrote:
We are not always aware of our stimuli yet we live.
     Yet we live owing to the partial inability of our predecessors to exhaust to ground zero the resources of the planet and to their partial consciousness not to destroy the planet, but would our successors be able to say something like that for us ... in case they succeed to avoid and to outlive the total collapse of the biosphere ... as it goes, caused by the infinite greed and the infinite stupidity of the populants, which could hardly be called consciousness.
argome321
 
  2  
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2015 06:05 pm
@Herald,
Really, but before claiming that perhaps you should define what is 'consciousness' and what is 'life'.


You should study a little anatomy and physiology. You should learn learn about our (CNS) Central nervous system to understand how it works in relationship to conscious states.


Quote:
Yet we live owing to the partial inability of our predecessors to exhaust to ground zero the resources of the planet and to their partial consciousness not to destroy the planet, but would our successors be able to say something like that for us ... in case they succeed to avoid and to outlive the total collapse of the biosphere ... as it goes, caused by the infinite greed and the infinite stupidity of the populants, which could hardly be called consciousness.



Here you are just babbling utter Doomsday nonsense.

Perhaps we will go the way of the Dinosaur? Perhaps an asteroid will strike the Planet. Or a pandemic?

Or perhaps we will accomplish great things before we become extinct?


Herald
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Mar, 2015 12:25 am
@argome321,
argome321 wrote:
You should study a little anatomy and physiology.
     How did you come to know that the answer for the consciousness (which is a non-physical phenomenon) can be found in the anatomy & physiology (medical science) just because they are supposed to sustain the material carrier of the consciousness. Why not philosophy and cognitology, or cognitive science (math logic), or even phenomenology or scientology?
argome321 wrote:
You should learn learn about our (CNS) Central nervous system to understand how it works in relationship to conscious states.
     No, I am not going to learn about any CNS and any neurotransmitters and neurotoxins - why don't you explain to us how exactly the Big Bang 'theory' has created your CNS out of the Singularity without even having the force carriers for the Infinite Gravitation?
argome321 wrote:
Here you are just babbling utter Doomsday nonsense.
     The Doomsday has arrived, if you are so curious to know. The fact that you don't want to know that, does not necessarily mean that it is not happening.
     How much is the concentration of the CO2, SO2, NOx, PM 2.5 (fine particles), and PM 10 (particulate matter) at 50 cm, on the street right under your window ... and how much is that on the floor of your house? What is the effect of the terminator of the copyrighted hybrid grains on the human metabolism? How much is the concentration of Rn in your basement ... and of Cs 137 in the Pacific? How can you explain 20 m of snow ... in an inhabitable city?; etc.
georgyel
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Mar, 2015 01:44 am
@Herald,
1. we are here to grow up mentally, to improve our soul.
2. From other side, we could be an alien experiment.
3. A try for saving the humankind.
Let's pretend Mars had a civilization, and the aliens do not look like green jelly.
What we see now is the result of lots of battles, which destructed the whole nature by destroying the protective air layer. What brought us here?
Some kind of organization which was protecting the humankind.
Maybe they already had some information, collected by scientists about Earth.
It sent a ship with some people on it. If we include religion, it could be the Noah's ark.
Well, what happens when people go somewhere where they never were before?
Simply, they survive.
Let's talk about food.
I became vegan an year ago. I realized that I don't get sick of anything, even cold.
So when people came Earth they ate plants. But it was not enough for their survival, so they started killing animals and eating meat, they became weak to cold. So they had to do something for example - getting their furry skin.
All this was long long time ago. Now survival is not that hard anymore. However, why are we still destructing this nature.
Why we are the only creature which acts like that.
The answer is simple - we don't trust nature.
We look on this planet as it is an endless resource, which if course is not true.
We have been deluded for so long that nowadays it doesn't even come to our head.
We are so enslaved by the community and we don't even realize that. We do so many things just because the Community does .
Community gives us some fun and simple things for easier life but what it takes in return? Our whole life. We are 100% under it's control. It even controls our thinking. It says "this is not true" and we all believe. We all believe in what it wants. So clever way to take control under all and everything. Community controls us but who controls the community? People which use it as a tool to get what they want (usually money). So worth, ah? And we accept that... we live and die serving those who use the community as a tool. And why do we still do this?
Because all do it...
We all have a head and a brain inside.
Herald
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Mar, 2015 03:52 am
@georgyel,
georgyel wrote:
1. we are here to grow up mentally, to improve our soul.
     Yes, but this is too general and too abstract. We have some super-specific problems: population overgrowth; absolute decline of the education; degeneration of the morality and social values; the sunrise of the modern money mechanics as source of 99.999% of the problems on the planet; intoxication of the biosphere at all levels; contamination of the environment; constrained energy resources (not in terms of the tar sands that can be excavated, but in terms of the CO2 that can be pumped out into the air to infinity without collapse of the biosphere), etc. What does 'grow up mentally' and 'improve our soul' mean in that context? How exactly will you ever be able to explain to the top designers of the Modern Money Mechanics that they have created a time bomb able to wipe us out of the planet?
georgyel wrote:
2. From other side, we could be an alien experiment.
     Not entirely to be excluded, having in mind that more than 3000 years ago the Bible is talking about things and vicious practices that we start understanding just recently.
georgyel wrote:
3. A try for saving the humankind.
     It is not sure that anything is able to save us already from ourselves, but it would be a nice try.
georgyel wrote:
Let's pretend Mars had a civilization, and the aliens do not look like green jelly.
     Mars does not have civillisation and has never had, for otherwise the thermal sensors would have detected life there and there should be stone buildings and ILF-made facilities all over the planet ... and also relics of the aliens. Nothing of the kind has been observed so far.
georgyel wrote:
What we see now is the result of lots of battles, which destructed the whole nature by destroying the protective air layer.
     The battles are only part of the equation - much more dangerous are the silent daily killers - TPPs & vehicles and the tar sands performances.
georgyel wrote:
What brought us here?
     We may never come to know that - in any case scenario it is highly improbable for us to have come down to the Earth from Mars. We might have come from the other part of the Universe, moreover that the theory of the Quantum Mechanics does not exclude that possibility - for us to exist concurrently in two different parts of the Universe - but that doesn't matter. What really matters is where we would go when the biosphere of the Earth be sent irreversibly into the Dimension X - this is much more interesting?
0 Replies
 
argome321
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Mar, 2015 05:37 am
@Herald,
Quote:
argome321 wrote:
You should study a little anatomy and physiology.
How did you come to know that the answer for the consciousness (which is a non-physical phenomenon) can be found in the anatomy & physiology (medical science) just because they are supposed to sustain the material carrier of the consciousness. Why not philosophy and cognitology, or cognitive science (math logic), or even phenomenology or scientology?
argome321 wrote:
You should learn learn about our (CNS) Central nervous system to understand how it works in relationship to conscious states.
No, I am not going to learn about any CNS and any neurotransmitters and neurotoxins - why don't you explain to us how exactly the Big Bang 'theory' has created your CNS out of the Singularity without even having the force carriers for the Infinite Gravitation?
argome321 wrote:
Here you are just babbling utter Doomsday nonsense.
The Doomsday has arrived, if you are so curious to know. The fact that you don't want to know that, does not necessarily mean that it is not happening.
How much is the concentration of the CO2, SO2, NOx, PM 2.5 (fine particles), and PM 10 (particulate matter) at 50 cm, on the street right under your window ... and how much is that on the floor of your house? What is the effect of the terminator of the copyrighted hybrid grains on the human metabolism? How much is the concentration of Rn in your basement ... and of Cs 137 in the Pacific? How can you explain 20 m of snow ... in an inhabitable city?; etc.


Doomsday has arrived? Well... I guess there's no chance of a coherent conversation here.

FBM
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Mar, 2015 07:12 am
http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb192/DinahFyre/11041795_10153100270986605_5855914308460567231_n.png
Herald
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Mar, 2015 11:08 am
@argome321,
argome321 wrote:
Doomsday has arrived? Well... I guess there's no chance of a coherent conversation here.
     Forget about the Doomsday - how much is the CO2 at the floor of your room, and how exactly do you intend to stand up against that challenge? ... or perhaps you don't have that problem at all.
Herald
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Mar, 2015 11:11 am
@FBM,
FBM wrote:

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb192/DinahFyre/11041795_10153100270986605_5855914308460567231_n.png
     This is not an evidence of whatever - it is a slapstick about which you will have yet to prove that it can be used and acknowledged as evidence at all.
argome321
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Mar, 2015 01:32 pm
@Herald,
Quote:
Forget about the Doomsday - how much is the CO2 at the floor of your room, and how exactly do you intend to stand up against that challenge? ... or perhaps you don't have that problem at all.


Paranoia will destroy ya

FBM
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Mar, 2015 07:42 pm
@Herald,
Herald wrote:

     This is not an evidence of whatever - it is a slapstick about which you will have yet to prove that it can be used and acknowledged as evidence at all.


http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb192/DinahFyre/535917_4688307301380_2905972891769669721_n.jpg
0 Replies
 
Herald
 
  1  
Reply Sun 8 Mar, 2015 12:31 am
@argome321,
argome321 wrote:
Paranoia will destroy ya
     So far so good, but perhaps you will have to prove that it is really 'paranoia' and nothing else.
    You will have to prove that the irresponsible pumping out into to the air to infinity of CO2 is not a threat to the economic and social development and the future of the biosphere on the planet.
     That any concentration of CO2 into the air is not dangerous to the human health. For further details you may see: http://avogadro.chem.iastate.edu/MSDS/carbon_dioxide.pdf
     That the threat for acidification of the ocean is 'irrational thinking' without any justification in the real world. You will have to prove that the ocean has not been acidified from pH 8.25 to pH 8,1 in the last few years only.
     You will have to prove that this claim is not a delusion. That the average annual CO2 for the planet has not been increased from 390 ppm to 440 ppm in the last few years, and that the acidification of everything is absolutely safe to the biosphere and to the future of us and our folowers.
     That the people excavating tar sands at production costs of USD 1.20 to produce oil at a price USD 1.00 by using for the production process of oil 23% more carbon emissions in comparison to conventional oil drills are 'economic geniuses' ... and are not the most irresponsible personalities on all indicators and for any age, etc.
 

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