41
   

Snowdon is a dummy

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 11:29 am
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
ASIDE: You folk in Europe deal with floods often. You ought to pass laws against them also...so they will no longer be a bother.
Is that part of the European Charter or an article in our constitution?
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 11:41 am
@Frank Apisa,
You should be used to people not taking any notice of you Frank. I know you think being American means you should be treated as an object of veneration, but that's not how it goes outside your borders. Our courts have decided that our citizen's data needs a lot more protection than that on offer your side of the pond. You being happy with it, is not a valid argument, your gun laws being a point in question.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 12:07 pm
@izzythepush,
Actually the EU-court has said that the law should be followed.

I think it to be a peculiar funny idea to include the behaviour of nature in a constitution or criminal law. But since some Americans have peculiar funny ideas, like officially taking up a resolution that asks God for mercy for following a U.S. Supreme Court ruling ...
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 12:11 pm
@izzythepush,
Quote:
Our courts have decided that our citizen's data needs a lot more protection than that on offer your side of the pond.


An your stupid UK prime minister wish to somehow ban any means of communication that the government can not read.

He must think that he and his government have Harry Potter magic wand.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 12:43 pm
Most European politicians refused to have a discussion since Edward Snowdon revealed the massive surveillance programs by the NSA in 2013 - especially those in the German government (which includes Conservatives as well as Social-Democrats as you know).

The ruling by the European Court of Justice now forces us/them to have this discussion. No-one can just close the eyes and carry on as if nothing has happened. Something needs to change, and thanks to the court's clear wording, nobody can deny that.

European data protection commissioners will have meetings this week to find a common solution as to how to put the court's decision into practice.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 01:01 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

You should be used to people not taking any notice of you Frank. I know you think being American means you should be treated as an object of veneration, but that's not how it goes outside your borders. Our courts have decided that our citizen's data needs a lot more protection than that on offer your side of the pond. You being happy with it, is not a valid argument, your gun laws being a point in question.


I am not saying I am happy about it.

Actually, I am indifferent to it.

And for the record, most Americans ARE as bothered by it as you guys.

In any case, if it were as easy to allow for a guarantee as has been asserted here...why not pass laws against flood...and earthquakes also. They should work every bit as well.

What I am saying is that Europeans are not any more "protected" against privacy intrusion...than we are.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 01:05 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Actually the EU-court has said that the law should be followed.


OH...you should have said that coming out of the gate.

The court has said that the law should be followed!!!!

Walter, I love ya...but do you think before you post stuff like this?

There would be no crime anywhere if all that were needed is for a court to say, "The law should be followed."


Quote:
I think it to be a peculiar funny idea to include the behaviour of nature in a constitution or criminal law....


My point was...good luck with that!

"The court has said that the law should be followed!"
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 01:14 pm
@Frank Apisa,
I know that you have a different legal and court system, but you don't seem to have the slightest idea about a) what was ruled on b) what basis.

The Court of Justice (ECJ) is the highest court in the European Union in matters of European Union law.

With this ruling, the Court of Justice declares that the Commission’s US Safe Harbour Decision is invalid.
Quote:
In today’s judgment, the Court of Justice holds that the existence of a Commission decision
finding that a third country ensures an adequate level of protection of the personal data transferred
cannot eliminate or even reduce the powers available to the national supervisory authorities
under the Charter of Fundamental Rights of the European Union and the directive. The Court
stresses in this regard the right, guaranteed by the Charter, to the protection of personal data and
the task with which the national supervisory authorities are entrusted under the Charter. [... ... ...]

Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 01:18 pm
@Frank Apisa,
If I would take the content of your above stupid reply serious, Frank, I should vote for abolishing our state and federal constitutional courts.

That, however, only could be done by a revolution.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 01:21 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

I know that you have a different legal and court system, but you don't seem to have the slightest idea about a) what was ruled on b) what basis.

The Court of Justice (ECJ) is the highest court in the European Union in matters of European Union law.

With this ruling, the Court of Justice declares that the Commission’s US Safe Harbour Decision is invalid.
Quote:
In today’s judgment, the Court of Justice holds that the existence of a Commission decision
finding that a third country ensures an adequate level of protection of the personal data transferred
cannot eliminate or even reduce the powers available to the national supervisory authorities
under the Charter of Fundamental Rights of the European Union and the directive. The Court
stresses in this regard the right, guaranteed by the Charter, to the protection of personal data and
the task with which the national supervisory authorities are entrusted under the Charter. [... ... ...]




Allow me to make this as succinct as possible...so perhaps you can understand where I am coming from:

No court is ever going to "guarantee" personal privacy in the sense you are suggesting, Walter.

Ever.

The day of "personal privacy" of the type you are discussing...

...IS OVER.

Get over it.

If there is something you do not want people to know...

...keep it to yourself.

But if it is out there in cyber-space...

...YOU HAVE NO PRIVACY.

In the meantime, if you want to pretend you do...if you want to tout a court decision as a "guarantee"...by all means do so.

Just understand there are people like me who are going to ask you to step back and take another look. (As nicely and civilly as possible, I hope.)
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 01:22 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

If I would take the content of your above stupid reply serious, Frank, I should vote for abolishing our state and federal constitutional courts.

That, however, only could be done by a revolution.


Okay...I hope that helped you feel better.

But I stand by what I've said so far.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 01:23 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Holy mackerel. THE RULING REFERRED TO EUROPEAN CHARTER.

Herewith I end discussing with you.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 02:02 pm
reuters reports:
Quote:
[...]
The ECJ ruling became effective immediately and the European Commission said it would continue to work with the United States on a revamped data transfer deal to fill the void.

"In the light of the ruling, we will continue this work towards a new and safe framework for the transfer of personal data across the Atlantic," Commission Vice President Frans Timmermans told a news conference.

Without Safe Harbour, the United States loses its status in the EU as a country that provides "adequate protection" for personal data.

The EU has granted that status to only 11 countries worldwide. For transfers to any other country, such as Japan, companies have to draw up contracts establishing privacy protections between groups or seek approval from data protection authorities, something they will now be required to do for transfers to the United States.

"The EU's highest court has pulled the rug under the feet of thousands of companies that have been relying on Safe Harbour," said Monika Kuschewsky, special counsel at law firm Covington. "All these companies are now forced to find an alternative mechanism for their data transfers to the U.S."

The group of EU data protection authorities, known as the Article 29 Working Party (WP29), said it would hold discussions this week to "determine the consequences on transfers" of data and schedule an extraordinary meeting shortly.

It is too early to say whether companies left in the lurch by the annulment of Safe Harbour and without any alternatives will be given a grace period by data protection authorities, a spokeswoman for the WP29 said.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 02:06 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
And from the Washington Post:
This privacy activist has just won an enormous victory against U.S. surveillance. Here’s how.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 02:09 pm
@BillRM,
In English please.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 02:12 pm
@Frank Apisa,
I'm sure the court will be interested in your input, you should tell them. Either way Facebook aren't going to be able to dish up any more European data on a plate to our self appointed overlords.

You don't sound very indifferent, you sound well pissed off.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 02:18 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

I'm sure the court will be interested in your input, you should tell them.


I doubt the court is interested. But you and Walter sound interested...so I am sharing my thoughts with you guys.

Quote:
Either way Facebook aren't going to be able to dish up any more European data on a plate to our self appointed overlords.


Problem solved...right!

That is so cute that you think that!


Quote:

You don't sound very indifferent, you sound well pissed off.


No, Izzy...I sound indifferent. And resigned.

The notion of personal privacy is done; that train has left the station. The only way to insure personal privacy (it won't ever be done by court order)...is to keep anything you want private...PRIVATE.

Don't share it with anyone.

But for the most part...if you share it with someone...and you share it in cyber-space...

...you share it with everyone.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 02:28 pm
@Frank Apisa,
You sound like the estranged husband who upon receipt of a restraining order vows to get his wife anyway, complete with condescending language.

You really don't like the rule of law, so much for wanting 'fair' trials.

BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 02:31 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
I told Frank on this thread many moons ago that US firms had and are going to take large large hits due to the massive spying of the US government and this is just one more indication that I was right in expressing that opinion.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 02:40 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

You sound like the estranged husband who upon receipt of a restraining order vows to get his wife anyway, complete with condescending language.


No I don't...but I can hear the frustration oozing out of everything you write right now...so I expect insults to intrude over reason.

No problem.

Eventually you will get under control again.


Quote:

You really don't like the rule of law, so much for wanting 'fair' trials.


I respect the "rule of law."

I just think that people who suppose the "rule of law" guarantees stuff like Walter (and apparently you) are supposing...are laughably naive.
 

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