42
   

Snowdon is a dummy

Forums: Politics, Snowden, Asylum, Nsa, Snowdon
Email this Topic • Print this Page
 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 08:54 am
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
Sounds like Germany ought to wake up and put some teeth into laws against doing that sort of thing. Don't you think so?
No. We don't live in Nazireich anymore.

Aside from that: here, 'stealing' is 'stealing'. We don't differ in the criminal code if you steal something from the government/administration or an illegal immigrant. (The sentence might differ, thought.)

Frank Apisa
 
  3  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:05 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
Sounds like Germany ought to wake up and put some teeth into laws against doing that sort of thing. Don't you think so?
No. We don't live in Nazireich anymore.

Aside from that: here, 'stealing' is 'stealing'. We don't differ in the criminal code if you steal something from the government/administration or an illegal immigrant. (The sentence might differ, thought.)




If you Germans have as many people stealing classified government documents as you say, Walter...it is time to put some teeth into your laws against that type of stealing...or nobody should ever share any intelligence with you.

And if you think that "stealing" classified government documents is essentially the same as "stealing" a loaf of bread ...maybe that gives us a clue as to why Germans would be willing to allow other Germans to steal classified government documents and release them publicly...with only a slap on the wrist.
Olivier5
 
  1  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:05 am
@Frank Apisa,
Everything is relative, Frank. It's minor compared to the practices he uncovered, which are much larger offenses.
revelette2
 
  3  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:06 am
@Walter Hinteler,
What is wrong with it is people with such an obvious agenda (mostly against US policies)really should not be trusted with x-number of classified US documents, most of which has nothing to do with privacy issues. (the parts they haven't released yet, you know the part the Pentagon are worried about being released or just out there in unauthorized persons hands)
Frank Apisa
 
  3  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:07 am
@Olivier5,
Olivier5 wrote:

Everything is relative, Frank. It's minor compared to the practices he uncovered, which are much larger offenses.


I see.

So you do think stealing classified government documents and releasing them to unauthorized persons is a relatively minor offense.

Wow...the depths to which some people will stoop in an attempt to avoid acknowledge the obvious (which is what you are doing, Olivier)...truly is astounding.

Gotta love it! Wink
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:08 am
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
If you Germans have as many people stealing classified government documents as you say, Walter...
Where did I say that? (Actually, we don't have a special paragraph for such in criminal code.)
izzythepush
 
  -2  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:11 am
@revelette2,
Why don't you tell us what that obvious agenda is? And because it's so obvious you will have sources to back up your claims.

Or is it obvious in the same way it was obvious that just one man was deciding what documents to disclose?
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:14 am
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
And if you think that "stealing" classified government documents is essentially the same as "stealing" a loaf of bread ...
I neither wrote nor think that "stealing" classified government documents is essentially the same as "stealing" a loaf of bread.
I referred to "stealing".
(Stealing classified documents could be "Treasonous espionage; spying on state secrets" or "Working as an agent for an intelligence service" or "Disclosure of state secrets with intent to cause damage" or ... ... ... (see my link above)
Olivier5
 
  2  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:15 am
@Walter Hinteler,
You Germans really got sloppy... You need to bring your police state back up: the mass spying over citizens, camps for indefinite detention without trial, and torture of course. How can you live without those, one really wonders...
Frank Apisa
 
  3  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:15 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
If you Germans have as many people stealing classified government documents as you say, Walter...
Where did I say that? (Actually, we don't have a special paragraph for such in criminal code.)


Read your comment above, Walter.

You seem to be indicating that stealing classified government documents is rampant in Germany (almost a thousand cases since 1990)...either that, or you posted something that has no issue with what was being discussed.
Frank Apisa
 
  4  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:17 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
And if you think that "stealing" classified government documents is essentially the same as "stealing" a loaf of bread ...
I neither wrote nor think that "stealing" classified government documents is essentially the same as "stealing" a loaf of bread.
I referred to "stealing".
(Stealing classified documents could be "Treasonous espionage; spying on state secrets" or "Working as an agent for an intelligence service" or "Disclosure of state secrets with intent to cause damage" or ... ... ... (see my link above)


You said "stealing is stealing."

What is that supposed to mean if not what I suggested?
Frank Apisa
 
  4  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:18 am
@Olivier5,
Olivier5 wrote:

You Germans really got sloppy... You need to bring your police state back up: the mass spying over citizens, camps for indefinite detention without trial, and torture of course. How can you live without those, one really wonders...


If stealing government classified documents is a wide-spread as Walter seems to be indicating...maybe something has to be done.

The Nazis would never have put up with that crap...that is for sure.
0 Replies
 
Olivier5
 
  2  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:18 am
@Frank Apisa,
Relative to mass spying, it is indeed a minor offense. To say in in simple words that you can understand, spying a little is a lesser offense than spying a lot.
Frank Apisa
 
  4  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:20 am
@Olivier5,
Olivier5 wrote:

Relative to mass spying, it is indeed a minor offense. To say in in simple words that you can understand, spying a little is a lesser offense than spying a lot.


Okay, Olivier...don't lose your cool again.

That is what I said:

Quote:
You do think stealing classified government documents and releasing them to unauthorized persons is a relatively minor offense.

Olivier5
 
  1  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:22 am
@revelette2,
People who were against the Iraq war should not be trusted? I see...
izzythepush
 
  -1  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:25 am
@Olivier5,
How could anyone be against it? It was such a resounding success. The terrorist thread posed by Iraq has been replaced by a moderate representative democracy.
BillRM
 
  3  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:28 am
@revelette2,
Quote:
(the parts they haven't released yet, you know the part the Pentagon are worried about being released or just out there in unauthorized persons hands)


Once more Snowden have done a good job of picking the guardians for those papers and the government is not concern enough to go into the NYT and begin to throw the holders of those papers in jail until they return them it would seems.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:30 am
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
You seem to be indicating that stealing classified government documents is rampant in Germany (almost a thousand cases since 1990)...either that, or you posted something that has no issue with what was being discussed.[/b]
We have in our laws and legal system obviously a very different legal terminology, words in our laws obviously mean something different.


I (nor anyone) could ever know how many "classified government documents" (and I add her: "classified documents from other public offices and administrations", since that would be by far the majority of classified documents) without looking through the various sentences. Most aren't online - I just took the numbers given by the Federal Prosecution (who has primary jurisdiction in cases of terrorism, espionage, treason, and genocide).
Frank Apisa
 
  3  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:30 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Quote:
(the parts they haven't released yet, you know the part the Pentagon are worried about being released or just out there in unauthorized persons hands)


Once more Snowden have done a good job of picking the guardians for those papers and the government is not concern enough to go into the NYT and begin to throw the holders of those papers in jail until they return them it would seems.



And what, as you see it, is the significance of that?
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Wed 10 Sep, 2014 09:32 am
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
You said "stealing is stealing."

What is that supposed to mean if not what I suggested?
'Stealing' in our legal terms is "theft" or "aggravated theft".
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
AMERICAN CONSERVATISM IN 2008 AND BEYOND - Discussion by Foxfyre
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Fellow Bostonians: How many of us wished we had an assault weapon last night? - Question by maxdancona
What should be first on the agenda of the winner in November? - Discussion by Frank Apisa
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
  1. Forums
  2. » Snowdon is a dummy
  3. » Page 522
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 5.71 seconds on 11/26/2024 at 01:26:33
▲ ▼