42
   

Snowdon is a dummy

 
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 11:02 am
@Walter Hinteler,
This is a paragraph from today's Yahoo News.
Quote:
This was one of the interview’s most unintentionally revealing moments because, while the agency’s domestic data gathering raises serious privacy concerns, Snowden’s question can be turned back on him. Can he point to a single American who’s been harmed by the NSA’s actions?


Yes, I can! The government doesn't have the authority to presume all Americans are criminals in their mass data collection. The presumption of innocence is a legal right.

Quote:
The Fourth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution reads as follows:
“The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.”
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 11:09 am
@Walter Hinteler,
The investigation is about this paragraph in the German Criminal Code
Quote:
Section 99
Working as an agent for an intelligence service

(1) Whosoever

1. engages in intelligence activity for the intelligence service of a foreign power against the Federal Republic of Germany which is directed toward communication or supply of facts, objects or knowledge; or

2. declares to the intelligence service of a foreign power or one of its intermediaries his willingness to engage in such activity,

shall be liable to imprisonment not exceeding five years or a fine unless the offence is punishable under section 94, section 96(1), section 97a, or section 97b in conjunction with section 94 or section 96(1).

(2) In especially serious cases the penalty shall be imprisonment from one to ten years. An especially serious case typically occurs if the offender communicates or supplies facts, objects or knowledge which have been kept secret by an official agency or at its behest, and he

1. abuses a position of responsibility which especially mandates him to safeguard such secrets; or

2. through the offence creates the danger of serious prejudice to the Federal Republic of Germany.

(3) Section 98(2) shall apply mutatis mutandis.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 11:44 am
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Quote:
This was one of the interview’s most unintentionally revealing moments because, while the agency’s domestic data gathering raises serious privacy concerns, Snowden’s question can be turned back on him. Can he point to a single American who’s been harmed by the NSA’s actions?


To say nothing of the American firms that are losing tens of billions of dollars of business as no one trust them not to be in bed with the NSA.
Olivier5
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 12:12 pm
@revelette2,
Quote:
So, how can he release more documents relating to Brazil or Britain if he gave them all to those various people?

Presumably, because these people will release documents if and when he asks them to release them...
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 12:20 pm
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:
What's up with that statement coming right after saying he would like to live in Brazil, is he trying to entice Brazil into offering him asylum?
In an interview aired by local TV station Globo on Sunday evening, Snowden, who's temporary asylum in Russia expires in August, said that he had requested asylum from Brazilian government, and he would be happy to live in Brazil if the government approves his request
Brazilian Foreign Minister Luiz Alberto Figueiredo said Monday that officials have not received his petition. (I couldn't find any later news about that.)
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 12:33 pm
@revelette2,
Quote:
What's up with that statement coming right after saying he would like to live in Brazil, is he trying to entice Brazil into offering him asylum?


If you were a young male, Revelette, and given the choice of spending the rest of your life in exile in Russia or on the beach at Ipanema...which would you choose in a heart beat?
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 12:35 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:

Quote:
What's up with that statement coming right after saying he would like to live in Brazil, is he trying to entice Brazil into offering him asylum?


If you were a young male, Revelette, and given the choice of spending the rest of your life in exile in Russia or on the beach at Ipanema...which would you choose in a heart beat?
Besides the fact that it's just a temporary asylum which will end soon.
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 12:41 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:

Quote:
What's up with that statement coming right after saying he would like to live in Brazil, is he trying to entice Brazil into offering him asylum?


If you were a young male, Revelette, and given the choice of spending the rest of your life in exile in Russia or on the beach at Ipanema...which would you choose in a heart beat?
Besides the fact that it's just a temporary asylum which will end soon.


I have a suspicion that the grant of asylum will be extended for Snowden. I'd be surprised if Putin didn't, because almost the only option would be to turn him over to the US. He has no passport...and really cannot go anywhere else.

But...bigger surprises have happened.

Gotta keep watching this drama.
BillRM
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 01:01 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
He has no passport...and really cannot go anywhere else.


Put him on a Russian warship and deliver him to Brazil is about the only safe way to move him outside of the borders of Russia given that the US had already have a head of state plane force down to checked if Snowden was aboard.

Can you picture someone having air force one force down for a similar reason!
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 01:07 pm
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Quote:
He has no passport...and really cannot go anywhere else.


Put him on a Russian warship and deliver him to Brazil is about the only safe way to move him outside of the borders of Russia given that the US had already have a head of state plane force down to checked if Snowden was aboard.


Putin would have to make that decision.

What's in it for him?

What is in it for Russia?

Why would extending the term of asylum not be a better choice?
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 01:18 pm
@Frank Apisa,
[...] Range decided to take the more difficult route and showed that he intends to exercise the powers of his position in accordance with the rule of law. This is a fact that Germany's allies will have to put up with. Range's message is clear: Spies in Germany, regardless of where they are from, should not feel safe when they break the country's fundamental laws. [...]
SourceThey'll get a fair trial.
BillRM
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 01:23 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
Putin would have to make that decision.

What's in it for him?

What is in it for Russia?

Why would extending the term of asylum not be a better choice?


You have not taken note that the relationship between the US and Russian is not at a friendly point and the US had placed economic sanctions on Russia and Russia in turn are threatening to have our astronauts walking to the space station.

So giving the finger to the US in a manner that a large percent of the world would support is what would be in it for Putin.



Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 01:38 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Sorry, forgot to mark the quote
Quote:
[...] Range decided to take the more difficult route and showed that he intends to exercise the powers of his position in accordance with the rule of law. This is a fact that Germany's allies will have to put up with. Range's message is clear: Spies in Germany, regardless of where they are from, should not feel safe when they break the country's fundamental laws. [...]

Source

They'll get a fair trial.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 01:39 pm
@BillRM,
He better not find the clit I should have thought Bill.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 02:18 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

[...] Range decided to take the more difficult route and showed that he intends to exercise the powers of his position in accordance with the rule of law. This is a fact that Germany's allies will have to put up with. Range's message is clear: Spies in Germany, regardless of where they are from, should not feel safe when they break the country's fundamental laws. [...]
SourceThey'll get a fair trial.


Okay.

I'll be waiting.

Looking forward to the trial.

Obama?
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 02:18 pm
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Quote:
Putin would have to make that decision.

What's in it for him?

What is in it for Russia?

Why would extending the term of asylum not be a better choice?


You have not taken note that the relationship between the US and Russian is not at a friendly point and the US had placed economic sanctions on Russia and Russia in turn are threatening to have our astronauts walking to the space station.

So giving the finger to the US in a manner that a large percent of the world would support is what would be in it for Putin.






We shall see.

This is something that should come up soon.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 03:08 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:

Looking forward to the trial.

Obama?
You mean, he was sitting in a dark room in the embassy in Berlin and listening to Merkel? (He has diplomatic immunity as head of state, btw)

It will take some time with the investigations, I think, and I won't bet,if there will be a trial.
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 03:15 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:

Looking forward to the trial.

Obama?
You mean, he was sitting in a dark room in the embassy in Berlin and listening to Merkel? (He has diplomatic immunity as head of state, btw)


Well...I am sure the defense for anyone actually charged (I seriously doubt anyone ever will be charged)...will include some variation of "I was just following orders." And the buck will stop with Obama.

That is why I asked.


Quote:

It will take some time with the investigations, I think, and I won't bet,if there will be a trial.


I'd be willing to bet there will NOT be, Walter.

This thing is going nowhere, except in the blogosphere.
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 03:41 pm
@Frank Apisa,
I wish the "buck stopped" with me! I'd be rich. Mr. Green
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Wed 4 Jun, 2014 04:01 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

I wish the "buck stopped" with me! I'd be rich. Mr. Green


Me too, ci.

But the bucks always seem to pass me by. They visit for a very short while...and then move on. Damn...if only I didn't have to eat!

Had a good friend who hit the NJ state Lottery for a cool million +.

I do not buy tickets...so I doubt it will happen for me.
 

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