Snowdon is a dummy

@revelette2,

In exactly the fashion that every sane person acknowledges is what has to be done to control what I must remind you are the criminal actions of your governments, the ones that you are providing cover for, the criminals that you are aiding and abetting.

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
Edward Snowden is charged with crimes committed under existing law...and to suggest that unless new laws are made which make the crimes no longer crimes a trial would not be fair...is ludicrous.

Bradley Manning was held in conditions that were 'Cruel and inhuman,' and he had little more than a show trial.

If Snowden had actually been spying for Russia instead of acting altruistically he'd probably have a street named after him in Moscow and would be living in luxury. Anna Chapman avoided a trial.

Not sure of your point, Izzy.

How does anything you wrote here impact on what you quoted me saying?

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@revelette2,

John Stockwell: I just got my latest book back from the CIA censors. If I had not submitted it to them, I would have gone to jail, without trial - blow off juries and all that sort of thing - for having violated our censorship laws....

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Sure, MiT, Snowden would get a fair trial.

*

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@Frank Apisa,

Izzy wrote: Bradley Manning was held in conditions that were 'Cruel and inhuman,' and he had little more than a show trial.

And Frank doesn't get the point.

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@JTT,

All those at Gitmo aught to be able to get a trial or released, Gitmo should be abolished as well as drones. Terror suspects aught to be able to have more rights than it seems they currently do in their defense. I already said that guy who lied to congress should be fired. Bush is gone as well as all the rest of the gang. One of the good things about the US, president's teams come and go.

However, all that don't got a thing to do with the subject at hand.

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@JTT,

Bradley Manning was in the military, a whole different ball game than Snowden.

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@revelette2,

Rev: I already said that guy who lied to congress should be fired. Bush is gone as well as all the rest of the gang. One of the good things about the US, president's teams come and go.
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So the guy who admitted he broke the law should be fired. Bush and the other war criminals that regularly infest the highest offices in your land get pensions.

But Ed S needs to stand trial for informing the people of the us of the criminal actions of their governments. Have you ever come across the phrase, "the rule of law"?

1 Reply

@revelette2,

You provide a litany of the numerous ongoing criminal actions of USA governments with not one suggestion that any of them should be held responsible for their actions. You must have majored in Totalitarian Ethics, Rev.

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@Frank Apisa,

Why don't you guys give him a fair trial, if you want that soooo badly? Just do it in abstentia.

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@JTT,

Look, I can't right all the wrongs of the US, when Bush was in office, I thought a serious hearing should have been held as to his administrations twisting of facts leading up to the Iraq war. Obama has said something like it would be a diversion. I didn't agree at the time.

Speaking of the rule of law, most of the procedures NSA uses was passed by congress with a large portion of the American voters approval. There was a few cases where NSA went beyond the laws intent and were rebuked by the 'secret court." Snowden is not the rule of law to decide what is the law and what is not and what should be revealed and what should not. No one died and made him judge and jury and God all in one.

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@revelette2,

Quote:

most of the procedures NSA uses was passed by congress with a large portion of the American voters approval

That's not quite true. The congressmen who authored the portion of the Patriot being used to justify metadata capture has stated it was never intended for it to be used in that way, and the American voters were certainly never petitioned for their by in on having all of their calls tracked. That same congressman (Jim Sensenbrenner -WI) has now co-sponsored a new bill that would shut it down completely. http://sensenbrenner.house.gov/legislation/theusafreedomact.htm

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@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Why don't you guys give him a fair trial, if you want that soooo badly? Just do it in abstentia.

Rather have him here...so he can testify in his own behalf.

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@Frank Apisa,

Use Webex or Skype then.

Just trying to help you with your obsession...

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Use Webex or Skype then.

Just trying to help you with your obsession...

Worry about your own obsession, Olivier.

Oh...you are. You are worried about me.

1 Reply

@revelette2,

Quote:

Snowden is not the rule of law to decide what is the law and what is not and what should be revealed and what should not. No one died and made him judge and jury and God all in one.

Hear! Hear! Rev, you are one observant lady. There are many outside the US who simultaneously admire the US yet rejoice in seeing the "Lady's"
weakness exposed. The noun "espionage" is a French word, meaning to spy. Many of our foreign allies are happy to see Snowden steal certain documents from the US, smearing America internationally. Truth be known, all governments spy; look at Russia's spying apparatus which recently captured senior official's "F*ck the EU" comment ... two senior US officials traded offensive remarks about the European Union and Russia caught this and aired it globally. All Western governments are doing the same thing as the US only, perhaps they are not as good as it. In Russia someone like Snowden would be shot yesterday if caught. In the US this is not likely to happen because the media is an enquiring one. Most of us will go to our graves never knowing the government had been listening for the simple reason our lives are already extremely exposed via credit cards, cameras on street corners, in stores, etc, and also we're in a new age, the Technological revolution which is on a roll.

1 Reply

@revelette2,

I applaud the things you've done but nothing seems to be working. Things haven't changed since the Philippines, Rev, and a lot of innocent people have died, continue to die. There are international laws that were basically the construct of the USA and they are being abused daily by criminal USA governments.

Is that really what you want?

There's this constant drone of "what about the people manning/Snowden put in danger". What of the millions who HAVE died because of USA government deat squads, because of USA government extermination camps?

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@Olivier5,

A capital idea!

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@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

Not sure of your point, Izzy.

How does anything you wrote here impact on what you quoted me saying?

Frank Apisa wrote:

Edward Snowden is charged with crimes committed under existing law...and to suggest that unless new laws are made which make the crimes no longer crimes a trial would not be fair...is ludicrous.

Stop acting coy Frank, it doesn't suit you.

After the treatment of Bradley Manning, a lot of us think the idea that Snowden could get a fair trial, as things stand, is ludicrous.

All the time the real spies, the ones selling America's secrets to an unfriendly power, get off Scot free.

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@izzythepush,

Izzy: All the time the real spies, the ones selling America's secrets to an unfriendly power, get off Scot free.

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Gee, you didn't even mention the war criminals Bush & Blair. How come, Izzy?

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@Frank Apisa,

I am deeply worried about your obsessions, Frank, because they tend to litter my preferred web forum.

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Snowdon is a dummy

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