What are your pet peeves re English usage?

Setanta wrote:

Merry Andrew wrote:
That is actually military slang, McTag. 'Troop' or 'troops' can be used as a plural for a group of soldiers but as a singular noun it is not standard American English. Anyone who uses it that way is doing so in a semi-jocular manner.

Actually, there is a standard usage for troop, which means a body of soldiers, specifically, a body of cavalry, usually the equivalent of a company of infantry.

Right. But, as I think I said, it's always plural. A cavalry troop is the equivaelnt of an infantry company or an artillery battery. In standard parlance it is never used to identify a single trooper.

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Isn't troop also a verb?

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plainoldme wrote:

Isn't troop also a verb?

Yes, as used in the phrase "Trooping the Colour"

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Clary wrote:

which brings us back to 'Meet with' and other US redundancies

A Google UK pages only exact phrase search yields a whole lot of meet with's.

Results 1 - 10 of about 1,070,000 for "meet with".

It's hardly a redundancy. The nuances, a vital aspect of language, are different.

Eats, Shites and Leaves by Antal Parody - Crap English and how to Use it.

I'll bet that this book is not much different than how this thread started out, Clary, just a bunch of old wives tales and general BS about the English language.

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JTT wrote:

Clary wrote:
which brings us back to 'Meet with' and other US redundancies

A Google UK pages only exact phrase search yields a whole lot of meet with's.

Results 1 - 10 of about 1,070,000 for "meet with".

It's hardly a redundancy. The nuances, a vital aspect of language, are different.

Eats, Shites and Leaves by Antal Parody - Crap English and how to Use it.

I'll bet that this book is not much different than how this thread started out, Clary, just a bunch of old wives tales and general BS about the English language.

Hooray! JTT is back, with some more trenchant opinions!

Sorry matey, "meet with" is no good in my book. Although I sometimes use it when I'm being modern and trendy. :wink:

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So good to see the old McTag v JTT lines being held.

As usual, I'm with McTag, Clary and the Brits on this one - for us, "meet with" is not the accepted version.

It makes me think of another difference in use: Brits tend to talk TO someone, whereas Americans talk WITH someone.

I don't believe there is actually a difference in the conversational style implied by these two prepositions but would others agree that there is a difference in usage on either side of "the pond"?

Confused

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Pete, in the USA there's at least an implied difference between talking to someone and talking with someone. Talking to someone implies that the speaker is giving some instruction or, at least, expecting no opposition to what he says; talking with someone implies an exchange of ideas.

"I spoke to him about that problem," implies that you told him not to do that again.

"I spoke with him about that problem," means you sought his side of the story.

Granted, these uses are not always strictly clear-cut and the two prepositions are sometimes interchangeable.

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McTag wrote:

But the song does not explain why they were marching..... :wink:

Perhaps at the behest of that Grand Old Duke of York.

Trooper is the singular form.

Trooper jones is a member of the troop of soldiers.

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I can meet with disaster

But I can only meet my friend Jim (if I'm British)

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dadpad wrote:

McTag wrote:

But the song does not explain why they were marching..... :wink:

Perhaps at the behest of that Grand Old Duke of York.

Trooper is the singular form.

Trooper jones is a member of the troop of soldiers.

I'm pretty sure I've heard Americans on TV (Sen John Kerry?) using "troop" to refer to an infantryman.

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McTag

How do you chew and whistle at the same time?

I would say meet with is redundant. But then I would wouldn't I?

What is still my mega peeve is "I could care less" = "I couldnt care less".

Anyone care to resurrect this one?

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Steve 41oo wrote:

McTag

What is still my mega peeve is "I could care less" = "I couldnt care less".

Anyone care to resurrect this one?

I'm with you on this one steve. i could care less means "I care at least a small amount."

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dadpad wrote:

Steve 41oo wrote:
McTag

What is still my mega peeve is "I could care less" = "I couldnt care less".

Anyone care to resurrect this one?

I'm with you on this one steve. i could care less means "I care at least a small amount."

Indeed it does.

And whilst I accept language changes and there is not necessarily a right or a wrong version, I cant accept that a statement in this case

I could care less

and its direct negation

I could not care less

can ever mean the same.

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Look at me!

Does this face look like someone who's bovvered? :wink:

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I just noticed the use of the phrase: old adage. That, too, is redundant.

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Letty wrote:

I just noticed the use of the phrase: old adage. That, too, is redundant.

Could be; adage- a traditional maxim, a proverb.

We often hear about "new innovations", too. Smile

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Steve 41oo wrote:

I would say meet with is redundant.

Recently reading a David Cornwell novel (a.k.a. John LeCarré), i saw a snippy little bit of dialog in which one Englishman says to another that the Americans want to meet with you, and something to the effect that this is just another of those annoying Americanisms.

However, a little thought (and familiarity with the American language) gives the lie to that. To an American, to meet someone means that you encounter them for the first time, or unexpectedly:

I went to the party to meet a co-worker's husband.

I met Steve at a restaurant in which i would never have expected to see him.

However, to meet with someone means that you are keeping an appointment, or seeking an engagement:

I went to the bank to meet with a loan officer.

Meet with also appears in a colloquial locution which is common in America:

He tried to climb the ladder with one hand, carrying the paint pail in the other. But he met with an accident, and now the paint is all over the ladder and the shrubbery.

It was a small shrubbery, with a little, white picket fence.

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Hmmm... old adage, new innovation. A further redundancy bothers me.

Here we had a discussion about a crossword answer... the clue was "Say three times" and the answer was "reiterate".

Re: "I could care less" = "I couldn't care less".

dadpad wrote:

I'm with you on this one steve. i could care less means "I care at least a small amount."

Steve 41oo wrote:

Indeed it does.

I think you're right... that caring person did care a small amount, but at some point in the past.

There's a strong implication of gossip and previous caring when the word is used. Later, after that first initial caring, the subject is found wanting. So, "I could care less" is not so much a statement of how I feel at this moment, but a considered opinion of what my view will be the next time the subject comes up in the future. I could NOT care less also refers to a future state, akin to "my cares will not change." Insert the word "any" that is implied by the negative: I couldn't care (any) less if you brought this up tomorrow.

---My mind's made up.
1 - I don't care (anymore).
2 - I could care less (if I thought about it... but I'd prefer not to).
3 - I couldn't care less (if you asked me next week).

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McTag wrote:

Look at me!

Does this face look like someone who's bovvered? :wink:

you may not be but dont tell me you could care less you hear young man?

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Setanta wrote:

Steve 41oo wrote:
I would say meet with is redundant.

Recently reading a David Cornwell novel (a.k.a. John LeCarré), i saw a snippy little bit of dialog in which one Englishman says to another that the Americans want to meet with you, and something to the effect that this is just another of those annoying Americanisms.

However, a little thought (and familiarity with the American language) gives the lie to that. To an American, to meet someone means that you encounter them for the first time, or unexpectedly:

I went to the party to meet a co-worker's husband.

I met Steve at a restaurant in which i would never have expected to see him.

However, to meet with someone means that you are keeping an appointment, or seeking an engagement:

I went to the bank to meet with a loan officer.

Meet with also appears in a colloquial locution which is common in America:

He tried to climb the ladder with one hand, carrying the paint pail in the other. But he met with an accident, and now the paint is all over the ladder and the shrubbery.

It was a small shrubbery, with a little, white picket fence.

Interesting and I dont for one minute deny the logic. But let me ask a straightforward question...Would you say

"The appointment was arranged, and I went to the bank to meet with the loan officer"?

And more importantly was the white picket fence splashed with pink?

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What are your pet peeves re English usage?

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