What are your pet peeves re English usage?

Letty says "My Mom always dropped her "r's" and I was a rather big gal before I realized that "wardrobe" wasn't pronounced "wadrobe"...<smile>"

She must have been a closet Brit. I actually thought of Mazurah as the correct pronunciation, because it's what the locals call it. Surely oral comes before written in these historical names? There are lots of places in Britain whose names have changed in pronunciation since too many people can read! Aveton Gifford, near here, is pronounced Aut'n Jif'd by old locals, but with every syllable clear and a hard G by blow-ins from London and elsewhere.

Missouri is a fairly accurate French version of the name for the river common to the Madan. Mizzourah is the pronunciation arrived at by the generations of southerners who lived there before the Germans began to arrive. Those who pronounce it Mizzourah clearly label themselves for their origin, even among their fellow citizens.

Many of these usages come from those who are not from the place referred to. Far too many Americans say "Illinoise," despite the frustrated efforts of natives of that state for many generations to get them to say "Illinoy." Illinois is another "frankified" name, the tribal confederation referred to themselves as Illiniwek. Many southerners say "Loo-zee-anna" rather than pronouncing Louisiana, but my experience is that natives of that state insist upon a "correct" pronunciation.

One of the most interesting place name pronunciations i have come across is in southern Illinois. The rural inhabitants there don't say Saint Louis, they say Sant Louis (prounounced like "can't"). This is interesting, as the French population of that area (including Ste. Genevieve and other small settlements down river) were the majority until well into the second decade of the 19th cenury--their pronunciation would have been "San Louie." Southern Illinois was settled by southerners long before central and northern Illinois were settled. I suspect that the bucolic natives of southern Illinois are repeating the pronunciation with which their ancestors would have been familiar nearly two centuries ago--although, of course, it cannot be proven.

Hee Hee! I knew we'd get a lecture from Mr. Set. Love it.

Clary, my Mom's family as well as my Dad's go waaaaaaaaay back to Merry old England. Took me a while to figure out face fomuss, too.

I've probably said this before, but my older sister finally figured out where the expression, " Mammmmaaaaaa, Billy Rae is making a mouth at me." came from. It was French for the word "moue". (think that's the way it's spelled)...Must have been some French in there somewhere.

Way interesting, Set.

I don't know how to pronounce some of your Frenchified American towns - Des Moines? Baton Rouge? How French can you pronounce them without being ridiculed? And the French-native American tribes - Iroquois?

As usual, Setanta beat me to it. A good deal of what appear to be mispronunciations in American place names stems from the fact that most of the US Midwest and a goodly portion of the South were originally French possessions, acquired by the USA via the Louisiana Purchase during the administration of President Thomas Jefferson. Spelling was, at best, erratic during those halcyon days of the late 18th and early 19th Centuries (ah, I remember them well!). This is why Arkanas is pronounced Arkinsaw. It's not a matter of illiteracy, merely a case of Anglophones imitating the French way of saying it to the best of their abilities. (The Arkanas River, by the way, is frequently pronounced just the way it's spelled; not so with the state.)

Clary -- Des Moines is generally pronounced De Moyn. BAton Roozhe is Baton Rouge (stress the first syllable of the first word). The Iroquois have become the Irakwoy, not Irak-wah.

The Frenchified names aren't so bad. What galls me is that Texans will say San Zhasinto for San Jacinto, rather tan San Wasinto or Hasinto. They have a terrible time remembering that the Spanish names of localities acquired from old Mexico should not be pronounced as though 'j' equalled the French 'zh' sound. That's not an isolated example, by the way. In Arizona, I never know whether to say 'San Havier' or 'San Zavier' when referring to the San Xavier mission near Tuscon.

I have heard Brits say Le Mans as if it rhymed with cans, and Nike shoes as if they rhymed with like. Do they do that in the US too?
It's interesting at what point the spelling takes precedence over the spoken word. Basically there's something wrong with spelling if it doesn't reflect pronunciation - after all it was invented to do that! The French are particularly bad at that. In the interests of etymology, it seems. Reintroducing letters that had been quietly dropped. Ah well. It keeps the savants happy and generations of schoolkids miserable.

I've never heard Nike pronounced as anything but Nigh-kee in the USA. Le Mans, though, does seem to become Lay Mans (rhymes with cans) for some people, even sports broadcasters who should know better.

another interesting anecdote surrounds the famous isle off the east coast of Maine: Mount Desert Island; the name comes from the french explorers who discovered it (names Setanta?) naming it "Isle de la Mont Desert", referring to the central mountain (basically the whole island) which is by far the most obvious geological feature, being a baren mountain devoid of trees - looking rather 'deserted'! The indigenous residents renamed the island from the french name, but got it wrong (as usual) calling it (reversed), "Mount Desert Island"; combining the Anglesized Mount (for Mont.), and the French past participal 'Desert' (pronounced 'deser', meaning deserted), but in English of course meaning a dry arrid vegetationless place.

The pronunciation generally heard (not from Canadia/en tourists) is 'Mount Dessert Island' with the locals changing the desert to (ice cream) dessert (alluding to the original french pronounciation). But Mount 'Desert' Island is also used by more educated residents, and tour guides, aware of the history.

[This island is also the highest, east most, point on the eastern seaboard; so the sun strikes the top of Mount Desert first each morning (when not completely surrounded by mist!).]

How do you all pronounce "Mackinac"?

And, of course, the name of the city of Buffalo, NY, does not derive from the popular name for the American bison. It is, rather, an Anglo mispronunciation and consequent misspelling of beau flux, referring -- in an understatement, I might add -- to the flow of the nearby Niagara Falls.

Mackinac? You pronounce it just as it's spelt.

Howzabout Michillimacinac?

Or Sault St. Marie.

If i mispronounce that, so sue me . . .

Anybody who calls it "Frisco" annoys the hell out of me.

Annoys the hell out of you? How do you think the residents of the city by the Bay feel about it? Or, for that matter, the residents of Frisco, Colorado?

Zis have anything to do with Jack Lords and "Frisco Danno?"

'Zis have nuttin' to do wif nuttin'. We should start a new thread on misuse of place names.

In the english language, I have heard of MANY MANY people who have never had a SANDwich , but alot of people who have SANGWITCHES all the time. Grrrrr .
Or the ever popular "like" , Like wow man Like that was cool Like oh my god!
jeeezzee... maybe I should just speak cave man. UG

If you do, see if they have any meatloaf sammiches they could spare . . .