Does God Exist?

@farmerman,

Or not what? Just contenting yourself with "or not" is no use. It's just another example of what gunga was talking about on the Zimmerman thread.

0 Replies

@spendius,

Hey H, yea, Spend has summarized my position even better than I could

0 Replies

@spendius,

spendius wrote:

Quote:
If the theory of evolution is true, with the increase of the CO2 in the air for example, our body should mutate in such a way as to become acid resistant ... and it is not happening. There is not any person having become acid resistant thus far.

There is a possibility that we might mutate to cope with increased CO2 but not at the rate required. Evolution is an extremely slow process on our time scales and increasing CO2 is a rapid one on evolutionary time scales.

It might actually be happening but the changes are too minute to detect.

Would the new species still be able to mate with homo sapiens?

Laughing

2 Replies

@neologist,

Quote:

Would the new species still be able to mate with homo sapiens?

As long as the acidity didn't cause stinging sensations. Or corrosion.

1 Reply

@spendius,

Eek!

0 Replies

@neologist,

Quote:

There is a possibility that we might mutate to cope with increased CO2 but not at the rate required. Evolution is an extremely slow process

First the practical possibility is called feasibility, for the possibility remains purely formal and theoritical option, whithout any idea of whether it will work in practice or not.
Second ... that we might mutate: setting aside that the keyword here is 'might' can you give us an example of any such mutation (without intellectual interfence) that leads to improvement in the genetic material.
Third: ... to cope with the incereased CO2
How exactly? The ocean is acidified ... and the potable water is acidified ('at the speed of light in vacuum'). The trees and the agricultural crops die as a result of the acid rain (and acidified underground waters), which leads to further increase of the CO2 in the air. The standard calcification process in the ocean is impeded by 'bicarbonisation' (as a result of the promiscuous emissions of CO2, made by the humans).
Who, how and when is going to fix all that mess? I doubt that Big Bang has the capacity (and the intellectual abilities) to fix this ... notwitstanding what the theories of the evolutionists may claim.

1 Reply

@Herald,

You need to concentrate on the quote function. You attributed Spendi's words to me.

This is the way it should read:

spendi wrote:

There is a possibility that we might mutate to cope with increased CO2 but not at the rate required. Evolution is an extremely slow process

To which I answered with my famous sardonic wit:

I wrote:

Will the new species still be able to mate with homo sapiens. , etc

Not that I think the idea is ridiculous or anything; just inane.

1 Reply

@neologist,

Quote:

... the idea is just inane

What idea - this is the only option for us to survive the casino economy promoting planetary-destructive economic behaviour ... to everybody, and the systematic misrepresentation of data about the CO2, pumped out in the air ... to infinity ... by the fossil fuel apologetics. Clean coal - what does that mean: CO2 steadily above 400 pm within less than an year, or what? How far this could go?
I truly hope (but genuinely doubt) that somebody will manage to cope with the CO2 problem in the recent future. Maybe God or Big Bang ... or who shall is responsible to deal with the problem?
The Big Bang failed with the CO2 on Mars, His way of managing the CO2 on Venus is mind-blowing failure from any point of view, why do you think Big Bang will manage to do something how much different on the Earth?
Yes, to grow acid resistant trees & decorative plants is inane, but what are we supposed to do in a continuously acidified environment in order to tackle somehow the problem?
Even if the increase of CO2 is stopped all of a sudden (which is mission impossible), how much time will be needed to restore the planet to its former glory (CO2 in the air 250 - 300 ppm or s.th.)?

1 Reply

@Herald,

You speak of big bang as if he/she/it were a person?
Can you explain what you mean and how you qualify to judge?

2 Replies

@neologist,

Quote:

You speak of big bang as if he/she/it were a person?

I am mocking the atheists, for they implicitely and subconsciously attribute intelligence to the B.B. (logic, abstract geometry reasoning, decision making & planning abilities, optimisation skills & strategy, design skills, infinite knowledge in physics, chemistry, quantum mechanics, etc.) to organise and to execute the evolution of the stars ... we will never catch up with B.B. ... and also top level knowledge in microbiology and genetics, etc. to organise and to execute the evolution of the species, to create the intelligence of the living creatures on the Earth, incl. our own intelligence (that should be inferior to the intelligence of the B.B., for no being should be able to create something superior to it), to manipulate space and time as B.B. finds appropriate ... and at a level that we are not even able to understand and imagine, to take out of the pocket non-existing energy (E=M.c^2 where M is the mass of the universe) and to create with it the space and time continuum, and the gravitation, and the deformation of space ... how is this called?

3 Replies

@neologist,

Quote:

how you qualify to judge?

Who am I to judge whosoever. This is just and opinion ... and reasoning.

0 Replies

Herald wrote:

I am mocking the atheists, for they implicitely and subconsciously attribute intelligence to the B.B.

Do you really believe this crap?

Did a mini big-bang take place in your mind?

1 Reply

@timur,

It is pretty plausible tim.

Having a vanilla ice-cream cornet sprinkled with hundreds and thousands brought to your street, or road, or drive, or crescent on a warm Sunday afternoon in a technicolour van playing a nice Pied Piper tune, for small change, does seem to be beyond the capacity of "dirt" acting alone without intelligence.

0 Replies

@Herald,

Quote:

I am mocking the atheists, for they implicitely and subconsciously attribute intelligence to the B.B.

I can't see how. Presumably the development of the Universe from the BB until now is merely an evolutionary process not requiring any sort of intelligence, it's in a sense fully automatic just as with the evolution of life forms such as us

1 Reply

@Herald,

Are you saying that, in some way, the atheist conception of the big bang is synonymous with intelligent causality? Or "He that causes to become"?

0 Replies

@Herald,

Herald wrote:

Quote:
You speak of big bang as if he/she/it were a person?

I am mocking the atheists, for they implicitely and subconsciously attribute intelligence to the B.B. (logic, abstract geometry reasoning, decision making & planning abilities, optimisation skills & strategy, design skills, infinite knowledge in physics, chemistry, quantum mechanics, etc.) to organise and to execute the evolution of the stars ... we will never catch up with B.B. ... and also top level knowledge in microbiology and genetics, etc. to organise and to execute the evolution of the species, to create the intelligence of the living creatures on the Earth, incl. our own intelligence (that should be inferior to the intelligence of the B.B., for no being should be able to create something superior to it), to manipulate space and time as B.B. finds appropriate ... and at a level that we are not even able to understand and imagine, to take out of the pocket non-existing energy (E=M.c^2 where M is the mass of the universe) and to create with it the space and time continuum, and the gravitation, and the deformation of space ... how is this called?

It seems you are the one "implicitly and subconsciously attributing intelligence". Atheists think things started out simple, not a beginning where "poof" and all of sudden God is there... Complexity evolves from simplicity it does not just come into being on its own because a book says it happened that way.

Does God grow, learn and evolve? If God does none of these then God has no purpose or reason for existing...

1 Reply

@RexRed,

Quote:

Complexity evolves from simplicity

Can you give an example of this ... without the intervention of some intelligence and/or intelligent design.

Quote:

God has no purpose or reason for existing ...

... and we have. Seriously?

1 Reply

@dalehileman,

RE: '... is merely an evolutionary process not requiring any sort of intelligence, it's in a sense fully automatic'
How can evolution operate ... without intelligence and without intelligent design? Let's start from the very beggining.
We have zero-D space. We have no energy source. Big Bang enters ... and switches off the subtitles for creation (thus eliminating the Intelligence of the Universe from the scene) ... and then switches on the Evolution of the Stars. Evolution in progress.
Act 1: From behind the curtain (out of nothing) enter Space & Time ... and the Gravitational Continuity.
Space: I am tired of this 11-D hyperspace. It maybe stable, but it is not comfortable. I have to learn 11-D geometry, for example. I will ask Big Bang to smarten to us some 3-D private place ... where I would be able to expand to infinity
Time: Oh, dear, this expansion is our Time, oh, how great.
Gravitational Continuity: Hey you two, how are you doing. Shopping Mall time. I can make some deformation here and there to ride you right to the place.
Space & Time: No, thank you. We have some other problems right now.
Gravitational Continuity: ... and what are they, if it is not a secret.
Space: I was wondering where will Big Bang take all these energy from, in order to smarten our 3-D home-place.
Time: Out of nothing, of course.
Space: How does that happen?
Time: Through evolution.
Space: And how does the Evolution work?
Time: Automatically. Everything is on autopilot.
Space: I have always thought that Big Bang is the Master Mind of everything.
Time: Yes, He is. Yes, He is. But this is done automatically.
Space: But Big Bang does not have the chemical elements even as a draft project to build up our 3-D private space. Where will He take all these chemical elements from?
Time: Out of nothing, of course. Everything here is done out of nothing.
Space: How does that happen?
Gravitational Continuity & Time ... & the Audience in Choir: Automatically.

0 Replies

@Herald,

The earth formed mainly from the dust of our star the sun, is the sun intelligent? H2O evaporated into clouds from heat and moisture on the earth's surface, are the clouds intelligent? Rocks formed over billions of years from the earth's molten infancy, is the earth intelligent? Are you saying these things needed intelligence to form?

You can see no apparent and obvious purpose in your life? That is sad...

Odd that you see something that doesn't change or learn as the only thing with apparent purpose. Do rocks learn?

Discovery is the motivation and energy of purpose...

2 Replies

@RexRed,

O.K.
1. accretion from solar nebular is not dust from the sun
2. you peak up very simple things - dust, heat, moisture. It looks like 'cherry picking'. Actually this logical fallacy is called 'cinfirmation bias'
Why don't you take s.th. more complex - ourselves for example.
We cannot develop as mind and body without the intelligent design preset in our genes. Are you saying that the Big Bang has arranged our genes ... out of nothing ... and automatically.
Speaking about automatics, every automatics has some mechanisms of operation, that can be specified and explained explicitely. What is the automation mechanism that the Big Bang is using all the time. Is it only one universal mechanism ... or is it a set of evolutionistic and creationistic tools.
What has Big Bang used in the design and development of our Mind for example. How did Big Bang come to know what to design ... and how, having in mind that even we, even nowadays don't know what our mind actually is - but this is another story.

0 Replies

Does God Exist?

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know