Does God Exist?

Neo, Let me preface this by saying I do not believe the Bible as it pertains to faith and practice. I am sure you already know that. I believe in a more science oriented life maker.

Because I have studied the Bible I do know what it says.

Jesus broke bread and poured wine, the bread signifying his body and the wine signifying his blood. Why both if they are one? Wine and bread are each made with different processes. One does not require wine to eat bread and likewise one does not require bread to drink wine, they are not inseparably linked.

Abel also made offerings to God of both flesh and blood.

The Bible says the life of the soul is in the blood. Why does it refer to flesh and blood if we are only a soul?

Why are believers part of Jesus' body if we are souls?

Why is "the flesh" despised over the spirit in the Bible if it is of no consequence? And if we are souls why the spirit?

I know you may say that the same Greek word "pneuma" is translated as both soul or spirit. I am not convinced the new testament was first written in Greek. The writings attributed to Paul the Apostle say it was first written in Aramaic.

Are we souls or are we spirits?

If soul and spirit are the same why does the old testament say body, soul and spirit all in one verse?

If soul and body are one entity then God would say poof and a living being would stand before him.

Instead he formed the body, made the soul and created the spirit.

To "form" something from the dust of the ground (the human form) takes time (perhaps millions of years), to "make" something (the soul) may take less time than forming and to create something (spirit) denotes an instantaneous act.

These are three different works of the biblical God.

Isaiah 43:7
Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.

Comment:
They surely can't all mean the same thing if they are used in the same verse.

Even if it said I have created you, created you and created you, it would still denote three independent things.

1 Thessalonians 5:23 - And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Comment:
Why preserve the body blameless?

If soul and body are one thing then why use two different words to describe them?

Jesus when he returned from the grave at first people would not recognize him then before their eyes his body could change into his old form.

Why retain this form if it was not really part of who he was? How would they have known Jesus? Just as the mind (Gnosis) is also required to identify a person and the mind is part of the body not the breath.

If Jesus' soul was autonomous it could have occupied any form yet the Bible stipulates he retained his same earthly resemblance even after "death" and gravedom. Ever seen a dead person after three days? Not pretty, in fact quite horrifying. Thus the body must have had a quickening also. Also consider, DNA makes our bodies infinitely unique to each individual.

God created man/woman in his image what image does breath and wind have? They are invisible.

Can something invisible have an image, have characteristics, resemblances and how can you "know" God if there is no form?

The body is a temple that houses the soul and spirit. According to the scriptures this temple is a holy edifice and consider the holy sites of Israel an how a wall of the temple is valued to the faithful of Judaism.

Not only is the God of this temple worshiped but also a mere wall is a shrine of great reverence.

The ark of the covenant is long since removed yet the wall is still considered holy.

Jesus is the rock upon which this temple is built he is not referred to as the soul of the temple. Even though some believe the Bible does refer to Jesus as God.

1 Corinthians 12
12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

Comment:
We are known through our physical form and faces as we are also known through the intents and charity of our hearts and minds.

Before a fetus is born it is flesh and no breath life through its nostrils.

By biblical definition this child would be "dead" without breath through its nostrils if the body were not an entity unto itself.

The fetus is born and receives a soul and the believer is born again and receives a spirit.

2 Corinthians 3:18
But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

Comment:
This last verse is very difficult to understand, but this is how I understand it.

All three are living.
The fetus, the newborn with a soul and the born again believer with a spirit.

God is present in all three in varying degrees from glory to glory...

Hope that makes sense.

Compared to how many millions who have been saved by transfusions?

I don't think it is a simple as that, FB, as the scandal at the VA seems to show.

neo ought to have included those whose transfusions required further treatments. The shock to the system of a boozer who wakes up from a major operation with alcohol free blood is dramatic according to a pal of mine who it happened to.

I'm not against transfusions btw.

What scandal at the VA? Got a link?

I'm thinking of the entire history of blood transfusions. If more people had been harmed by them than helped, doctors wouldn't do them. "First do no harm." For that matter, if even a significant minority of people were more hurt than helped, they wouldn't do them. The JW stance is, I think, based on superstition, rather than medical research. Correct me if I'm wrong about that. I haven't studied them in great detail; the stuff that I do know is so whacked out that I've had little interest in learning more about them.

well, doctors do vaccinations as well!
BUT they are brainwashed into thinking they do no harm so consequently whatever happens, it will never be blamed on the vaccins! Even if they are , and they are, at the basis on a lot of diseases and even death!
you see you are thinking doctors are basically rational and logical people.
well, they really are not. Just see the suicide rates of them.
They ar really just puppets and frontman for the Pharmaceutical Companies.
and well, what are companies about? Money!! Yeah!! Lots of money!

you see.

Holy ****. That's as fucked up as a football bat, Que. I'm guessing your hat is of the tinfoil variety, then?

whatever you want to think.
I am only interested in truth. not popularity nor political correctness.

Stop waffling mate, I've already said i've forgiven him because I never took him seriously and thought he was funny..
You've called me -"ignorant, malicious, a fable-spinner, talks drivel, a deceiver, a liar, self-deluded, a threat to pygmy possums" but I don't take you seriously either and I find your JW beliefs funny..

But as regards you letting each other die for lack of a transfusion, that's definitely NOT funny. You said a while back-
"I would refuse a blood transfusion for myself or any of my dependents" (Neologist Aug 16 2006) and I presume you still stick to that.

No other religion deliberately lets its members die, nor do the most primitive backward jungle tribes, so i guess that makes JW's lower than any of them and I'm sure Gods got a supersize naughty step waiting for all JW's..

No waffling here. I refer to this gem you posted about your father on this thread:
http://able2know.org/topic/215845-117#post-5702760That doesn't sound all that funny.
Do you suppose he might have to forgive you?
Or will you just refuse to associate with him? How would that go over with Jesus?

Or will one of you be in hell?

There is a growing trend among hospitals and physicians in favor of bloodless surgery. Plenty of reasons besides the cost: fewer complications from tainting, surprisingly faster recovery rates for those not receiving transfusions, etc.

Of course, JWs refuse transfusions based on scripture. I always thought this one particularly prophetic:

That's it? I sounds like more of an admonition not to eat blood, rather than refuse life-saving blood transfusions. Whatever. There's no accounting for superstition and myth, anyway.

Mate, if something is the TRUTH, we don't need to apologise to anybody for saying harsh things about them, because the truth is the truth..

You've called me - "ignorant, malicious, fable-spinner, talks drivel, a deceiver, a liar, racist, self-deluded, a threat to pygmy possums"
which amounts to slander AND false witness, so I don't see how you can escape that big naughty step in the sky..

Jesus said "Thou shalt not bear false witness" (Matt 19:18 )
"Whoever spreads slander is a fool" (Proverbs 10:18 )
Jesus said:- "Every careless word you speak will be judged" (Matt 12:36)

Firstly, that refers only to food and not to transfusions..
Secondly JW's eat meat and there's blood in that!

In context therefore God was probably telling primitive people to improve their table manners and not to slurp down bowls of blood, or else there was livestock disease going around and he was warning them to lay off juicy steaks for a while.
Likewise the Old T says-
"All flying insects that swarm are unclean to you; do not eat them" (Deuteronomy 14:19)
Yet in the New T- "John's clothes were made of camel's hair, and he had a leather belt around his waist. His food was locusts and wild honey"- (Matt 3:4)
Jesus certainly had no problem with that because he said- "John is the greatest man ever to be born" (Matt 11:11)

Fact is, Jesus gave the all clear about ALL food-
Jesus said - "What goes into a man's mouth does not make him unclean" (Matt 15:11)
Paul said - "I am fully convinced that no food is unclean in itself." (Rom 14:14)

PS- when that young JW woman was dying, she refused a transfusion because she believed the blood might be tainted and kill her.
BUT SHE WAS DYING ANYWAY, so she had nothing to lose by having a transfusion, so where's the logic in refusing one?..

Well flip my flapjacks, Romeo, just exactly what have you been eating?Any meat we might eat should be slaughtered with attention to the Jewish Law which demanded proper respect for blood.

Are you Christian or Jewish mate?..

I'm sorry about calling you a threat to possums. That was a callous attempt at humor on my part. However, the other things are pretty much true. Look how you dodge the things you have said about your father. We are to honor our parents. Yet, you don't feel you owe any apology for equating your father with excrement? I certainly have never gone to that length with anyone. You can't dodge this, Romeo, not until you tell us when you meet up with your father you will apologize, you will forgive him, and love him as a fellow follower of Christ.
Of course, we may then assume you have retracted the statements you made about him in haste.

And by the way, being ignorant, malicious, fable-spinner, talks drivel, a deceiver, a liar, racist, and self-deluded are traits that you may change.